winchester '86 in 45-70 need loads for

[Char-Gar]

Shooting 350 to 450 grain bullet much past 1,500 fps out of a 45-70 levergun will produce nothing of value in the hunting field. You can't turn the 45-70 into a flat shooting rifle and a decent cast bullet going the above speed with shoot through and through, from any angle, any game animal in North America.

Any extra powder past that point is just going into blast, fire and recoil with nothing real to show for it.

[smokeywolf]

I very much concur with Char-Gar on this. A 405 grain boolit traveling at 1700 FPS is not likely to kill much deader than the same projectile moving at 1500 FPS. The only reason for greater velocity is if you're seeking a flatter trajectory. If that's the case, you should probably be utilizing a lighter boolit.

[aspangler]

25 gr 2400, 1/2 gr dacron, under the 405 pb flatnose boolit for 1450fps will kill anything on the NA continent. Best of all it is a trapdoor level load and recoil is about the same as a 20 ga. field load.

[TCLouis]

10.5 grains of a Milsurp #105 (be careful, there are two of these with this designation and the other is MUCH faster) which looks like and acts like Unique behind a 340 to 378 cast boolit. Gives me right at 1100 fps and is the mist accurate load on a model 86. 1100 fps is not a barn burner load, but would likely dent even the best armored deer.

REALLY accurate in my rifle too.

[RidgerunnerAk]

I've shot 3031 exclusively in my Marlin 1895's and .45-90 Win 86's and 1885 Hi walls for 40yrs.... except for my bear loads that are max H322 and beyond painful to shoot in the light Marlin. I primarily use cast 400+/-gr boolits and find, as others have, that anything over 1500fps is painful to shoot and a waste of energy and powder. The 400gr boolits will go clean through a moose at 200+ yds, a caribou at 250yds that I know of for sure. You want to really feel how they recoil, try shooting on your "off" side sometime. I'm losing the sight of my right eye and have been experimenting with shooting left-handed.... Damn, that hurts! I couldn't move my shoulder for a week. I'm going to reduce my loads and go to the more proper 300gr boolits using a Saeco mold for the .45-90's, which will shoot straighter than the 400's. I used to have a 292gr Lyman mold but can't find it. Anyone have any pet loads for a 300gr boolit in .45-70/90? I have the 3031 but also a good supply of IMR4227 I inherited and would like find a use for. Target velocity for especially the .45-90's is 1450-1500fps. I put a veggie card and cotton batting under the .45-90 boolits for filler. The HiWall is light and especially brutal on recoil vs the significantly heavier 24" 1886. The lever gun shoots especially straight with 300gr boolits if I do my part. I've had it shoot moa groups at 200 yds if I do it right. It's one hell of a moose gun I can tell you.

[303carbine]

I loaded my B-78 45-70 up to where it got almost unbearable to shoot with the crescent butt, I agree that shooting 405 grain cast bullets at 1650 fps will drop anything on this side of the globe and most of everything else in the world with a well placed shot.
The buffalo was nearly wiped off the face of the earth with heavy 45 cal bullets travelling at Trapdoor speeds.
The 7x57 Mauser in a modern action and a 45-70 in a modern action are the only two rifle cartridges needed for hunting the entire planet.

[TCLouis]

10.5 grains of Milsurp powder that compared 100% with Unique ( No, not the russki Unique) gave me 1100 fps with 340 Lee and 378 grain RD boolits.

Not a barn burner, but VERY accurate and fun to shoot.

[Reaper]

36 grains of 3031, large rifle primer and a plain base 405 grain boolit average 1275fps out of an 1884 trapdoor. I've shot them in the Winchester/Miroku 1886 take-down rifle at steel gongs out to 405 yards. The 1886 is a lot easier to shoot if you rest the crescent butt plate on the point of the shoulder rather than the pocket.