Need a little 9mm help???

[flyingstick]

So after 2 years of building a house I'm finally getting to cast some and my 9mm Ruger SR9 is giving me a challenge. So a little advice would help. I've slugged the barrel at .356 and am using a lee 358-125-RF over 3 grs of Clays. The gun will load and shoot every time without a hiccup and is very accurate for about 20 shots, then the dreaded leading begins. The boolits are measuring a consistant .358. I've shot water quenched WW and air cool WW. Both lead. The only lube I've tried so far is 45 LLA/45 JPW/10 MS. I don't mind pan lubing and I have a lee .358 sizer. I know it's a toss up but I'm thinking either another lube or power/charge or straight LLA. I've read every post I can on 9mm so a little 9mm advice couldn't hurt too bad.......

[Shiloh]

You may need to add some linotype to bring up the hardness a bit. Your size is what I run mine at. Do you know how fast you are running??
What is the start load for that powder??

Shiloh

[Mlcompound]

Is the leading down the entire barrel or just the last half? You could be running out of lube or your lead could be too hard and not sealing fast enough. This could cause the lube to be burnt off before the bullet expands and seals. Depending on the load you might actually find a hotter load will help the bullet seal quicker. I fought mine (m&p9c) and found fairly soft lead (straight range scrap - mostly jacketed) sized at 0.358 finally worked.

[Cherokee]

Per Hodgdons manual, 3.0 gr Clays gives low velocity with high pressures. Pick a slower powder for one thing, try a better lube as well. HS6 or Power Pistol followed by 231 are my choices. I use White Lable CR lube with ACWW+tin without any leading in 1100-1200 fps CB loads.

[williamwaco]

Pull some bullets from loaded rounds and mike them. Micrometer. Not caliper.
I suspect they are being swagged down during the seating operation.

LLA is not the problem. I use it exclusively.
I have tried several methods of mixing and thinning it but now use it straight.
Straight out of the bottle does not provide a better lube, it is just much less trouble.

I find that my 9mms do not low velocity loads.

I use BullsEye and A no.2 in mine at around 1050 to 1100 fps

[LUCKYDAWG13]

C/R lube and Bullseye works great in my 9mm i size at .357
good luck

[Iron Mike Golf]

I have started working up loads for the MP 125 HP in my SR9c. Alloy is 94-3-3, water dropped, lubed with Carnauba Red, sized .358.

3.3 gr Clays shot with no leading. Better performance using HS-6, Power Pistol, HP-38, and AA #5. HS-6 and #5 are working best, so far. No leading with Titegroup, but like Clays, groups were a good bit larger.

Check your bore for roughs spots, steps, or tool marks, too.

[flyingstick]

Thanks fellows, that should get me going in the right direction. First, it is indeed leading the last half of the barrel. Next, I pulled a boolit out and it has been swaged down to .355 from preloaded .358.

[flyingstick]

Ok, when I adjust the seating die so it won't swage down the boolit, then it won't load in the gun. If I keep adjusting it down to where it will load it has come back to the place of swagging the boolit back down to .355. What now? The nose bearing is still at .358. Different lube? Hotter load?

[Larry Gibson]

I've shot water quenched WW and air cool WW. Both lead. The only lube I've tried so far is 45 LLA/45 JPW/10 MS

Seems to be a common problem......

Add 2% tin to the COWWs and let AC for 7-10 days.

TL those cast bullets with straight LLA as per Lee's instructions.

After lubing size through that .358 sizer.

Try 4 gr Bullseye.

Larry Gibson

[dtknowles]

Sounds like your chamber is too tight for the bore. A couple things could fix this if it is really the problem.

You can hope that a harder lube and hotter load might work but first I would look for brass with thinner neck so it would not swage as much.

The other things you could try are just not something I would do for a 9mm. You could ream or turn the necks of the brass. You just need a half a thou but that is too much trouble. You could open up the chamber but I would trade the gun before I did that because I already have too many guns I have modified, can't get comfortable selling someone a gun that I modified in case there was trouble.

Tim

Ok, when I adjust the seating die so it won't swage down the boolit, then it won't load in the gun. If I keep adjusting it down to where it will load it has come back to the place of swagging the boolit back down to .355. What now? The nose bearing is still at .358. Different lube? Hotter load?

[gefiltephish]

Ok, when I adjust the seating die so it won't swage down the boolit, then it won't load in the gun. If I keep adjusting it down to where it will load it has come back to the place of swagging the boolit back down to .355. What now? The nose bearing is still at .358. Different lube? Hotter load?

The swaging of the bullet is the first thing that needs to be addressed waaaay before worrying about lube, alloy and powder/charge. I can think of numerous things that could affect this. Are you also using the FCD? If so, you can knock the carbide ring out of it or get a taper crimp die. What expander are you using? If it isn't expanding the case enough for the larger than jacketed bullet, or if it's not expanding deep enough, this could be (part) of the problem. This could be even worse if your sizing die is undersize (diameter too small). I use Lyman M dies with custom plugs for expanding for my "oversize" cast bullets. You can try adjusting your sizer upward a bit so it's not sizing full length, as long as the case is not bulged and it'll still chamber.

I have a brand new LC9 that leads horribly for the entire length of the barrel. This even after ensuring proper sizing, exanding, no swaging issues, good (conventional) lube, etc. The barrel has a lot of machining marks in it and passing a tight patch through it confirms that it's quite rough. I'll be firelapping this baby very soon (after trigger parts are returned from Galloway).

That said, I have a 5" XD9 that leads full length also, except for one bullet design that is not all that accurate out of this gun. That bullet will actually clean the barrel. Go figure. Never did firelap it though.

9mm is the only caliber so far that consistently gives me leading issues. I only have the two 9mm's though. Curiously, both have a 1:10 twist, while most 9mm (that I'm aware of) have 1:16. After giving up on tumble lubing, I have no problem with 45acp, 38/357, 45-70 or 30-30 (gc'd).

Happy hunting!

[Shiloh]

Larsens BAC works for me with all powders. Sized at .358. Keep the velocities to no more than mid range, or use a harder alloy.
Factory lead bullets sized at .356 leaded, patterned, and hit sideways at 50'. Not so .358

Shiloh

[Jal5]

Flyingstick- check previous threads for the description of using a larger expander plug in the Lee die. I swapped out the expander part for a $3 part that was supposed to be used in the 38 S&W die. It allows for a little bit more expansion and a little deeper into the case than the 9mm expander die. no more swaging. Joe

[DX250]

I have found that a stout load of a med burn rate powder does the best in my guns. I am running a 356-102-1R and a NOE 358-128 rf cast with straight indoor range lead with a little tin over 5% off max loads of power pistol. I also use a Lee 38 expander and no swaging down.

[MtGun44]

Clays is extremely fast, try slower powder, maybe Unique. Also, try NRA 50-50 or similar
"known good in this application" lube. I suspect a lube problem, exacerbated by either
smaller diam that you intended (swaging down in case ) or too fast powder.

I hope you are not using a Lee FC die.

Bill

[flyingstick]

Thanks everyone, I've got some universal on hand. I'll give that a try. And I'm not using the Lee FC die.
I'm about to load some more up and I've moved the boolit out as far as I can. I'll shoot it tommorrow and see how it goes.
Thanks again,
Don

[DX250]

I forgot lube is lla or carnuba red

[gefiltephish]

I've slugged the barrel at .356

...I pulled a boolit out and it has been swaged down to .355 from preloaded .358.

I'm not sure what part of THIS^ is being missed. If your bases are being swagged down .003 (.001 UNDER groove), then you'll be chasing powders, charges, lubes till ya turn blue and it won't solve your problem. Until you deal with this issue, you're just pissin' in the wind. My apologies if I have completely overlooked something in this thread.

[Jal5]

This is why I suggested that he exchange the expander part in the die for a larger one, the 38 S&W expander spud works fine in my Lee die with no leading, no swaging. Joe