I recently traded for a very old Savage Model 1899. The barrel is marked Savage 30. The serial number (196XX) indicates it was made in 1902.
I was told that there is no "Savage 30" cartridge and that this rifle is chambered for the 30/30 Winchester. When I do a search on the internet for the Savage 30 I come up with 300 Savage, but the 300 Savage cartridge was not introduced until some 18 years after this rifle was made.
What ammo do I use in this rifle?
Last edited by Tallyman; 04-28-2012 at 01:31 PM. Reason: Add Photo
It migth be possible that your gun was re-barreled to 300 savage? I have never seen one marked Savage 30.
Short of a trip to a good gunsmith (never a bad idea @ times like this) I think a close look at the bolt face will tell you what you need to know. Pretty sure it's a 30-30 but a chamber cast and some careful measurements may save a bit of drama and head-scratching. Gun's been around a long time, no telling what's happened over the years.
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Your rifle may be a 303 Savage, there were more of caliber that any other at that time
That is wierd, did savage even mark them as savage 30 wcf back then or would it have been just 30wcf.
The 303 was popular in that time frame and would have been marked as savage 303 or 303 savage.
I am interested to find out what you find it to be.
My 300 savage started life as something else, the original caliber was Xed out and restamped along with the gunsmiths name.
I suspect it was a 30/30 originally.
303 Savage was the original caliber for the 1895s and 1899s. 30-30 was added in 1900.
A 303 Savage case will not fully chamber in a 30-30. Likewise a .300 will not go into a 303 or 30-30. You should get a pretty good idea as to what the chambering is with a few rounds of ammo or empty cases. If you can't sort it out that way, I would suggest doing a chamber cast, or having a gunsmith do it for you.
If it hasn't been rechambered or rebarreled, more than likely its a 303 Savage.
If you need one send me a pm with an address and I'll send you a 303 Savage case. By the way, If that is what it is the internal capacity of that case and the 30-30 are identical and you can use 30-30 reloading data. 303 Savage reloading data is hard to come by. I got some 303 brass several years ago from Graf and Sons.
The first markings for the 30wcf a.k.a. 30-30 that savage used was SAV 30. So your 99 is an early 30-30.
I'm not disagreeing, but whats your source for that info?Originally Posted by Rimfire
Yep, Savage marked their earliest .30/30's as 'Sav .30'. All .303's were marked as .303's. The consensus among collectors is that they marked the .30/30's that way because of the rivalry with Winchester. That all changed a couple of years after this one was built when they switched to marking them '.30/30'.
While on the subject, all early .30 cal Savages (.303 and .30/30) used the same nominal bore dimensions. Early .303's were often (but not always) loaded with .310-.311 diameter bullets in order to jack pressures up a bit and get a smidge more velocity in order to back up their claims for beating the .30/30 Winchester in power. In truth, there isn't much difference between the two. They dropped that scheme in the first years of the century, and all ensuing .303's were loaded with .308's.
It was the excellent 190 grain bullets commonly found in .303's that gave it an edge on the .30/30.
Last edited by gnoahhh; 04-29-2012 at 09:14 AM.
Pretty sure I've read that somewhere, Bret. Just couldn't cite it. Have read and heard ctg headstamps were sometimes misleading back then as well. Manufacturers didn't like stamping another mfrs' names in their products back then, even if it lead to confusion. Don't think the name "30-30" was commonly used at that time.
Last edited by TXGunNut; 04-29-2012 at 10:38 AM.
Endowment Life Member NRA, Life Member TSRA, Member WACA, NRA Whittington Center, BBHC
Smokeless powder is a passing fad! -Steve Garbe
I hate rude behavior in a man. I won't tolerate it. -Woodrow F. Call, Lonesome Dove
Some of my favorite recipes start out with a handful of depleted counterbalance devices.
I have owned 2 Sav 30's both were 30-30's.
I learn sumthin new here every day. That's why I love this place.
Rimfire: I chambered a loaded 30/30 round. It went in and extracted like it should. I have some low power lead boolit 30/30 loads with 115 grain 32-20 boolits. I will try them out next time I go up the mountain to do some shooting at my "Red Neck Ranch" in Florissant, CO.
Again, with respect, source info?
Even though it was politely done, there's no need to call someone a liar, IMHO - since it's documented fact. (seek, and ye shall find)
FWIW, NO original firearm maker willingly put the name of another firearm maker on their own firearms (at least while the original owners were in situ) - So Arthur Savage NEVER put Oliver Winchester's name on his rifles, period.
.
Now I lay me down to sleep
A gun beside me is what I keep
If I awake, and you're inside
The coroner's van is your next ride
Not calling anyone a liar, but like Bret, I too would like to know of the source.
Larry
Cerrosafe chamber casting would be worth it's weight in gold.
It's funny how things are forgotten or lost over time, years ago a sav30 marked gun was known to be a 30-30, now it is a big mystery. Sort of like how people confuse the 32spec. and 32wcf or 303sav and 303british.
Years ago, there was an article in one of the annuals ( Gun Digest, Shooter's Bible) on collecting Savage Model 99s that discussed the various calibers manufactured and the markings. I can't remember which it was, but I do recall reading that the "Sav 30" was in reality the plain jane 30-30, which in those days was known as the 30 WCF. IIRC, the author ascribed the variance to the reluctance of the Savage Firm to put any mention of their rival on their guns, much as Colt marked their revolvers "38 New Police" and not "38 S&W".
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