Problems with 9mm

[Jamesconn]

I am casting and reloading for 9mm at first I had problems casting but I fixed that by casting hot and fast and warming up the mold.

I am using lee 356-120 TC I measured the boolits they are the right size but I get shaving when I load them and the boolits seem to bulge out of the cases when I made a few duds I measured the inside of the case and it's alot smaller than the boolit I'm 800 mi away from home and I forgot the exact numbers

What can I do to fix this my dad is already against casting as it is he thinks it's cheap ****

Should I get lee's universal expanding die?

[MtGun44]

Bulging can be pretty normal, one of the issues with 9mm is that the brass dimensions
like wall thickness are all over the map between brass makers. As to the shaving, all
the pistol die sets that I have used have an expander that if you push it deeper into the
case, it starts flaring the case mouth. You need to set the expander die depth deeper
until the case mouth is flared enough to clear the boolit and not shave it.

The Lee Universal Expander is needed for dies for bottleneck rifle cartridges where the
expander is a button on the decapping rod which works by pulling it through the neck
on the way out. This has no way to flare the case neck, so they shave cast boolits
if you don't do some sort of flare. Straight wall rifle dies are usually like pistol dies,
and the expander will flare if driven deep enough into the case.

Bill

[geargnasher]

Read the "sticky" on using a .38/357 expander on 9mm.

Gear

[Jamesconn]

The case isn't bulging where the projectile is its shaving off and it's squeezing the lead out the end the TC loses its shape and looks more like a grape

[Jamesconn]

So I need a Lyman-M die?

That thread confused me I have the same problem he has i have the lee 4 die 9mm pistol set with a lee 4 hole turret press

I do plan on getting a progressive press but I gotta start makin cast ammunition work as plinking ammo and when I get a hollow point mold and/or rifle mold I'll be anal about it but my boolits look wonderful is the putting it in the case that I can't get right

[ku4hx]

Flaring the case mouth a bit more always cured my lead shaving. An "M" die will certainly do that, but I don't recall ever seeing a 9mm die set that didn't have the capability to flare the case mouth. On all my sets, all I need do is allow the case neck sizer to go a mite deeper into the case so its tapered shoulder opens the case mouth more.

You got to be sure your remove all the flaring. I much prefer to do that in a last and separate step on my Dillon machines via a taper crimp die.

The bulge you see in a properly loaded 9mm Luger round (also called the "Coke Bottle" effect) is normal under most circumstances. The 9mm case has a slight taper; boolits don't so you get the bulge. As long as they chamber, fire and eject as expected they're of no concern.

Yeah, cast boolits are cheap **** but so is cutting your own grass, building your own computers, cooking your own meals and a host of other activities. If your dad is like me he's an old fart and is going to have his say. But you won't be the first son to find a better way. You have the opportunity to either prove him right or help him understand that better way.

[HeavyMetal]

The 9mm can be the hardest round to reload so I will suggest we go back to basics.

First we need to determine as cast size of your boolits

Then, if you can, we need to slug your bore to determine a starting point for boolit size.

Most die sets, particularly in 9mm, are set up for jacketed boolits you will need to know what diameter the expander plug is in your die set so you can make a choice when you select another plug. Yes you may wind up buying an M die if you can't get Lee to understand what you need to make the set up you have work.

To cut down the variables in case's sort your brass by head stamp and only use one brand to set up the die set in the press. Be aware each tme you change brands of brass you may have to readjust the expander die.

Keep in mind that loading cast is not like loading jacketed!

[dakotashooter2]

Also check the nose/seating punch in your die. It almost sounds like you might be using a RN punch for a TC bullet. That might be contributing to the rounding of your bullets. Is this a used set of dies? If so you might be missing some stuff.

FYI any type of appropriatly sized tapered steel rod can be used to flare cases in a pinch. A hammer and a ground down punch works.

[fredj338]

IMO, you do notneed a M die, just adjust your dies properly. Also seating & crimping lead bullets seems to give me a better result. Easy to do on a progressive, more of a PITA on a ss press.

[Iron Mike Golf]

IMO, you do notneed a M die, just adjust your dies properly. Also seating & crimping lead bullets seems to give me a better result. Easy to do on a progressive, more of a PITA on a ss press.

I think he means seating and crimping as separate steps. +1 on that.

[Doble Troble]

You should have a charging die in your set. This die is designed to accept a powder measure. In addition to activating the powder measure it is also designed to flair the case mouth, but you have to adjust it to do this.

Run a case into it as far as possible on your press and turn the die in until you feel it contact the case mouth. Then lower the case, and turn in the die a bit more, maybe 1/4 turn, raise the case back in all the way, lower and inspect. If you want more flair, screw in the die another 1/4 turn. Repeat until bullets seat the way you want them to.

Less flair is better for the brass, and you have to adjust either your seater or your crimp die to remove the flair to finish the cartridge.

[Jamesconn]

Thanks for your help guys y'all never fail me

If I ever find out how to post pictures I'll take a few of my bench

[Bad Water Bill]

When ever you go to your shooting range starting NOW turn on your radar,sonar and satellite viewer. There is more 9 mm brass laying around than you will ever be able to use.

It is generally the only brass in the buckets when I help the range master close for the day.

If you shoot at a private range ask the owner what he would charge for a 5 gal bucket FULL. Yes I know there will be brass you do not need NOW. You can either keep the stuff for later years or put it up for sale on our site.

Personally at your age and the way the politicians act I would NOT let one round out of my sight.

Keep asking questions and paying attention here as you have folks here with many years actual hands on time willing to help a new caster (no matter what age) overcome their difficulty.

Keep casting,reloading and shooting and you will soon be shooting as good as dad or better (yes we all go downhill at some point) and he will understand that his son can indeed teach him something.

CAUTION Some dads pride, ego etc are easily hurt so be gentle with us old folks. Just remember we had to pick your sorry stinking butt up 1K times before you could walk your first step. Return the favor and you will be better for it.

Keep the questions coming because that is what makes Cast boolits great and in no time YOU will find yourself able to help someone else with their problems.

[Gtek]

In regard to the shaving, what about a VERY light spin with chamfer tool. Most factory ammo I have seen once fired is not square and has very sharp edges. Case inspection and prep -step one.
Sort by Manuf', Check your cartridge lentghs if crimping. Stand, walk, run, fall every now and then.
I am tickled with your growth, in the spring you were talking about getting some lead out from the bad road area, now you have reloading issues. Makes gray hair smile! Gtek

[GREENCOUNTYPETE]

i just tried it on my lee powder thru expanding die in 9mm, on a turret , i purchased the 9mm dies and second turret press from a guy who only loaded jacketed , he had it set to drop the powder but not flare running a piece of 9mm brass and adding a 1/4 turn on the die till it flared where i wanted it to was all that was necessary

[Lizard333]

You can get a case gauge from various manufactures. I got mine from Dillon. My 9mm looks goofy but load fine, and drop into my case gauge without problem. Bell the cases more, and you should be fine. 9mm can be a real pain, just be patient and try to fix one problem at a time. You'll get it.

Good luck!!

[Sapper771]

Janesconn,

Good advice on here. These are the same Gents that helped me out of the 9mm problems.

-Slug your bore. Very important.
-Size your boolits accordingly.
-Use a good boolit lube.
-Case swaging is a PITA.......I use a Lyman M Die with a modified 38spl plug.
-Take the time to make dummy rounds to ensure your case isnt swaging the boolit.
-Wheel weight alloy does work for 9mm boolits.
-Water quenching WW alloy is not always the right answer.
-follow your load data
-experiment with different powders.

Good luck, its a long and bumpy road.

[canyon-ghost]

James, I use an expander die to flare the case mouth (only a little bit) to where it just lets the base of the bullet enter so, it doesn't shave lead. By re-checking the fit when I crimp, I can adjust the taper crimp die (bullet seating die) so that it only straightens the case enough to feed the round.

The bullets seem to be way tight in the case so, I don't worry if it doesn't crimp a lot, just that it squeezes the case mouth down enough for the edge not to catch on the chamber. * I had a pretty expensive way to check this, used a new Contender barrel chamber, as opposed to my autoloader*

If you are shaving lead pretty badly, you need to look at expander dies, my dies are RCBS so, I don't know anything about Lyman "M" dies. But, it'll work with other brands.