advice on H110 reloads

[desertwheeler]

Thanks for all of the input.

I went back to the shop today, and even though I only bought the powder last Thursday, they wouldn't take it back. No returns on powders...final. That got me a little hot under the collar. I asked the guy helping me if there were other reloading suppliers in town and he gave me three places. I picked one and drove over there. That place was the jackpot. They had everything, including a huge selection of revolvers (with more than reasonable prices...I see another 44 in my future...something I can abuse with the H110 I'm stuck with...like a SBH). They had an old K-22 in very decent shape for a little over $400. That made my mouth water. Anyway, these guys were serious reloaders and were much more helpful. I walked out with a bottle of Unique and a bunch of Federal primers (I can compare them to the Remington primers I got at the other place). (And the guy told me they would have taken back the H110.) So I feel pretty good about powder now. Thanks again for all of the help.

[Ole]

The trick to getting H110 to burn consistently is to give the case a really healthy roll crimp. Seat your bullet and crimp in separate steps. You should crimp so much that you're almost messing up the case with the crimp. Experience will teach you what the "feel" is that you're shooting for.

My experience anyway.

As stated, don't use H110 in anything other than max loads.

I use 2 powders for .44 Mag: H110 and Unique.

[44MAG#1]

With the deranged people around nowadays it would seem like you would be more understanding not taking back an "unopened" can of powder.
Who is to say you or I am not one of them that would just like to cause havoc and could have possible opened the can an dumped some Bullseye in it just to do something mean?
If i were a dealer I probably wouldn't take back powder either. Or ammo too.
It is what it is in this day and time.
Its not like the seal couldn't be put back almost perfectly.

Think about it.

[desertwheeler]

Yeah, I get it....but the guy who sold it to me had no idea what he was talking about. I told him what I wanted and he just said "try this." I guess ultimately I have to take the blame for not doing more homework. (And this gives me the excuse I need to get that Ruger SBH...can't go tearing apart my Model 29 with screamer loads of H110...)

So I've been looking at the data for using Unique. The web site says to use CCI primers, and they caution against using anything else. How much of a difference will it make? Do others here use primers other than those recommended by the powder makers?

[462]

You do have at least two reloading manuals that you've read at least twice, right? If not, you need to re-group and buy them.

[Safeshot]

If you use Win 296 or H 110, be sure to use MAGNUM Primers. Magnum primers are a "given" in all of the load data that I have seen for these powders. I like these powders for the .357 Mag and the .44 Mag.

If you use the Lee Auto Prime, Lee recommends only Winchester or CCI primers be used.

The advice concerning getting a loading manual is good. I would recommend at lease TWO. The LEE and the Speer are good to start.

Just some suggestions.

[44MAG#1]

desertwheeler said:
"can't go tearing apart my Model 29 with screamer loads of H110...)"
Who said you had to use screamer loads. that is where you need to learn more about reloading from recognized loading manuals before jumping to conclusions.Example: Speer number 14 says with a 240 gr Jacketed 22.0 to 24.0 gr H110 velocities from 1362 to 1451.
Hodgdons lists with a 240 gr jacketed 23.0 gr at 1431 fps @ 25,200 CUPS to 24 at 1522 fps @ 36,200 CUP's which is under SAMMI spec on pressure. this from an 8.275 inch test barrel which will give higher velocities than a revolver.
Screamer loads??? Who said that???
Sure your M29 will last longer at 1200 than 1300, longer at 1100 than 1200, longer at 800 than 900 and longer if it is never fired.
Best thing to do is get some books.
Always take anything said by no matter who says it with anywhere from a grain of salt to a sack of salt. Always reference any load data given to you by double checking against reliable test data regardless who gives it to you. I don't care if it is you most favorite and trusted person in the whole wide world. Mistakes in memory happen.
Also best to study before trying to absorb anything asked on the INTERNET.
I would say many use primers that are different than the recommended primers. I have and do. Especially if the loads are mild pressure loads.
That is the reason one "works up" a load. To look for anything suspicious in nature with anything concerning the load.

[Rocky Raab]

A change in primer with all other components the same can - in the worst case scenario - raise pressures by as much as 10,000 psi. That is especially true if switching from a standard primer to a magnum OR THE OTHER WAY AROUND! That last may seem counter-intuitive, but lots of things in reloading are both true and counter-intuitive.

Do pay attention to the manual and try to duplicate their recipe exactly. If you can't, at least stick to the same TYPE of component: standard or magnum primer, cast or jacketed bullet, brass or nickled case, and so forth. Always begin with the Start load because even that just might turn out to be warm in your gun with your components. A few shots at that level costs little and may save you a lot!

[44MAG#1]

Here I go flapping my big jaws again or better still flapping my fat fingers. If we named all the varibles in load data that could make a difference and the proposed amount of that difference we could make a thread just on that that would take up much space and never solve anything.
1 Changing lots of the same powder can make differnces.
2 Changing lots of the same primer can make a difference.
3 Changing from a thin case to a thicker case and vise versa can make a difference
4 Changing brands of bullets in the same weight can make a difference.
5. Changing seating depth can make a difference.
6 Changes in temperature can make a difference.
7 Changes from one gun to another can make a difference
8 Amount of crimp can make a difference.
Many things can cause differences. these are just a few of that I recollect.
Still i reload. Still I shoot.
We keep these things in mind so as to be careful. Just like we practice defensive driving we practice defensive reloading by "working up a load" and watching for abnormalities by observing signs of abnormalities if we know what to look for.

[Rocky Raab]

"Defensive reloading."

I LIKE that!

[desertwheeler]

desertwheeler said:
"can't go tearing apart my Model 29 with screamer loads of H110...)"
Who said you had to use screamer loads. that is where you need to learn more about reloading from recognized loading manuals before jumping to conclusions.Example: Speer number 14 says with a 240 gr Jacketed 22.0 to 24.0 gr H110 velocities from 1362 to 1451.
Hodgdons lists with a 240 gr jacketed 23.0 gr at 1431 fps @ 25,200 CUPS to 24 at 1522 fps @ 36,200 CUP's which is under SAMMI spec on pressure. this from an 8.275 inch test barrel which will give higher velocities than a revolver.
Screamer loads??? Who said that???
Sure your M29 will last longer at 1200 than 1300, longer at 1100 than 1200, longer at 800 than 900 and longer if it is never fired.
Best thing to do is get some books.
Always take anything said by no matter who says it with anywhere from a grain of salt to a sack of salt. Always reference any load data given to you by double checking against reliable test data regardless who gives it to you. I don't care if it is you most favorite and trusted person in the whole wide world. Mistakes in memory happen.
Also best to study before trying to absorb anything asked on the INTERNET.
I would say many use primers that are different than the recommended primers. I have and do. Especially if the loads are mild pressure loads.
That is the reason one "works up" a load. To look for anything suspicious in nature with anything concerning the load.

I'm running on a super limited budget. I don't want to buy books if I don't have to. (SWMBO has made it very clear I've spent too much already.) I'm only reloading for my 357 and my 44. Why buy a book that covers all of the calibers? The powders I bought have all of their reloading data online. While I was at the gun shop, the guy helping me took out the Lyman manual and we looked at it together. At least the same info if not more is available on the powder web sites. Is there anything wrong with going by that?

By screamer loads, I just meant full-house magnums. My only point of reference is the Winchester white box mags sold at Walmart. I would prefer to tone my loads down a little from those. I don't know if that's possible with the H110; it doesn't sound like it is.

The M-29s aren't built like the Ruger 44's. This is well-verified. Why not have a little caution and sense about using it? Besides helping the gun to last longer, I don't want to shoot high powered magnum rounds anyway. I don't feel the need to. Ideally I would like to shoot a magnum that is somewhere between the special and the standard manufactured magnum like the Winchesters I was shooting.

I admit I'm not even to first base with casting and reloading. That's why I'm here, asking questions. Thanks for helping me out.

[462]

In the interest of safety -- yours and others who may be around you when you're reloading and shooting: If you are disinclined to buy a reloading manual, just how do you propose to learn the safe and proper way to go about reloading? Please, don't say You Tube, the Internet, or some guy at a gun shop or a sporting goods store.

Please!, buy a manual. Cruise over to the site's Swappin & Sellin forum and post a Want To Buy/Want To Trade thread. Perhaps you have something that's of interest to someone who has an extra manual.

[desertwheeler]

462, I appreciate your advice. Tell me what is in the manuals that I can't find on the official web sites of the powder companies. I need to be enlightened....

[357Mag]

Desert -

Howdy !

For a 158SWC in .357Mag, I recommend 14.5gr WW296 ( H110 same thing ) and SP Magnum primer.

Have not found a more accurate and flexible load in over 35yr of .357Mag use in "N"-frames.

With regards,
357Mag

[Smoke-um if you got-um]

Ditto on getting at least two reference manuals and study the loading tables before making any decisions. I find myself going to my Hornady and Lyman Manuals more than any of the others I have. Lee has a manual that is very informative but needs updating as the load data is getting a little old. There is also excellent data available on the Internet with a little searching. With that said I've used more Bullseye than any other powder except perhaps Unique over the yrs in both 38/357/44 cast loads with excellent results. My only complaint is that Unique is not as powder measure friendly as I would like. Over the past couple of yrs Tite-Group has become one of my favorite powders for both 38 and 357 cast and jacketed loads. It meters great and charges are dead on every time I check. H110 is a finicky powder that I have used in 44 mag 240 grain jacketed loads and a few 357 158 jacketed bullet loads. I shot up the few pounds I bought yrs ago and have not purchased any since. Accuracy was mediocre and the muzzle blast and flash was horrendous. The few times I loaded H110 in the 357's it was only with 158 jacketed bullets and again the results were dismal. I never even tried cast with it. 2400 is an excellent powder for full throttle jacketed loads in the 357 and 44 magnum but did not burn cleanly/completely in heavy jacketed 38 loads. While 2400 is an excellent powder, there are many more suitable powders for both cast and jacketed 38/357/44 mag. applications. The man that sold you the 110 probably had it on his shelf for quite sometime and saw an opportunity to move it out the door. I don't know anyone who uses in it any 38 special load. When powder was much less I was more prone to experiment. The cost of powders these days limits my ability to experiment or keep separate powders for specific loads. The powders that can do most everything well are the ones on my shelf now. They may not be the best choices for light target or heavy hunting loads but they do both in an acceptable manner. Tite-Group powder fills that niche for me.

Mike

[badbob454]

i like AA #9 for all my pistols/handguns 9 mak to 454 casull/ or the variant WC80 burns a little slower than #9 but test (your batch( first there are 3 speeds of wc820 burns clean and doesn't seem to be position sensitive

[badbob454]

462, I appreciate your advice. Tell me what is in the manuals that I can't find on the official web sites of the powder companies. I need to be enlightened....

safety tips, and reloading guidlines, and warnings, instructions, etc. ,etc. read it and save a gun or more important your eyesight or a hand if you dont and hot load a rifle and blow it up , happens even with the experienced

[desertwheeler]

Thanks, guys. That is helpful.

[44MAG#1]

"At least the same info if not more is available on the powder web sites. Is there anything wrong with going by that?"

Nothing wrong with that. Just as long as it is a recognized source not something someone threw together.

"By screamer loads, I just meant full-house magnums. My only point of reference is the Winchester white box mags sold at Walmart. I would prefer to tone my loads down a little from those. I don't know if that's possible with the H110; it doesn't sound like it is."

You are correct H110 is not designed to be downloaded very much. If you would have looked at Hodgdons reloading data center you would have seen that. But, at the time you may not have know it existed. Winchester loads standard SAAMI specs loads. I've shot them and you are right most don't need the full magnums most of the time. What do you mean by a little 100 fps, 150 fps, 200 fps, 300 fps? What? That could go a long way in knowing what powder you want. 2400 will be okay in both if you want know off a couple hundred or slightly more. It is also capable of giving magnum performance too.

"The M-29s aren't built like the Ruger 44's"

Most people know that I would assume that has been familiar with the 44 mags.

" Why not have a little caution and sense about using it? Besides helping the gun to last longer, I don't want to shoot high powered magnum rounds anyway."

As above in my other posts I said to be cautious. We all would like our guns to last forever too.

"Ideally I would like to shoot a magnum that is somewhere between the special and the standard manufactured magnum like the Winchesters I was shooting"

So you are looking for roughly 1050 fps. That should be easy to pick a powder that will do it.

"I admit I'm not even to first base with casting and reloading. That's why I'm here, asking questions. Thanks for helping me out."

Remember to VERIFY any data given to you by anyone no matter who it is by using a recognized source.
Better still "buy some books" SWMBO will get over it in time. Mine has. Yours will too.

[462]

Desertwheeler wrote: 462, I appreciate your advice. Tell me what is in the manuals that I can't find on the official web sites of the powder companies. I need to be enlightened....

Desertwheeler,
The various powder companies’ Internet sites provide only loads, they do not get into the safety aspects nor the actual process of reloading. Furthermore, the companies that publish reloading manuals -- Lyman, Hornady, Speer, Sierra -- do so only in book form, not on the Internet.

If you were to post a question asking, “I what to start reloading, what is the first piece of reloading equipment that I should buy”, the majority of the responders will say a manual.

At the outset, you were ill-advised. If you had purchased a manual, instead of a pound of H-110, you would have known that it wasn’t the powder for your intended purposes. Now, you have powder that cost twice as much as a second-hand manual, and you may never use the powder. How much more of that are you willing to endure, because you don’t want to buy a manual?

Again, PLEASE, buy a manual.