IMR Trail Boss and the .45-70

[Last Spike]

Interesting article in Handloader 237 about IMR's Trail Boss gun powder - looks to be useful in a wide number of chamberings from .38 Special to the .45-70. The author, R.H. Vandenberg, gives one load for 300 grain cast boolits with a charge of 16.5 grains giving a velocity of 1337 fps in his Marlin 1895 Cowboy with 26 inch barrel. Pressures are said to be safe in trapdoor rifles. He also mentions using 405 grain cast boolits but no load given. Bulk density of Trail Boss is given as 0.328 gr/cc. The 300 grain cast boolit load gives load density in the low 80s percent wise using my specific case capacity figures.

I'm thinking working up loads for 350, 405, and possibly 450 grain cast boolits would make for an interesting winter project once this powder makes it up here to Canada.

Any comments? Has anyone else tried Trail Boss? Be interesting to compare it to Accurate Arms XMP 5744.

[Ed Barrett]

I would like to try some Trail Boss loads, but every place between here and Kansas City says they can't get any from their distributor. How is the availability in the rest of the world?

[jethrow strait]

Nada mas til later in October is the word on distribution around here.


Have tried it in some handgun applications as per the existing data---mixed results accuracy-wise. Did best in the 44-40 close to max. Got the impression that it would peak quickly if pushed much beyond Kboy loads.

That's the first I've heard of rifle applications. Have to check it out.---jethrow

[KCSO]

Iask about Trail Boss once a week. Doc Carlson of Upper Missouri is the bigest powder dealer in Nebraska and he can't get it either.

[Sky C.]

Trail Boss had made it to shelves here in CO. Buddy of mine picked up a bottle for each of us to try. Now just need time to get to the range and see what it'll do.

[35remington]

The IMR Smokeless Powder Reloader's Guide has data for Trail Boss in rifle and pistol calibers.

For 45-70:

300 grain cast FP
16.5 grains 1285 fps 20,900 CUP
405 grain cast FP
13.0 grains 1007 fps 25,600 CUP

These are maximum loadings. They also list for 25-35, .30-30, .32-40, 38-55 and .40-65.

They caution not to use filler materials with Trail Boss. Before I got the Reloader's Guide and found out about filler materials, I used it in my .25-20 with, you guessed it, filler.

That may sound odd with a powder that's designed to fill the case, but I was interested in protection for the plainbase bullet rather than improving load density. Dacron was used.

The result with dacron was LOWER velocities than without-like 150 fps. That is, a load without filler that would obtain 1150 fps would get around 980 to 1000 fps with the filler. Trail Boss appears to need some room in the case, or has some other requirement that filler alters, as ignition and burn characteristics must be affected. Believe me, I couldn't use much dacron because there wasn't much room for it, but even a minor amount of change in loading density by using filler drastically altered velocities downward. At least in the .25-20.

[Last Spike]

The IMR Smokeless Powder Reloader's Guide has data for Trail Boss in rifle and pistol calibers.

For 45-70:

300 grain cast FP
16.5 grains 1285 fps 20,900 CUP
405 grain cast FP
13.0 grains 1007 fps 25,600 CUP

These are maximum loadings.

35rem, did the Guide mention what brass and primers were used with this mix?

Thanks!

[35remington]

No mention of case or primer is in their data, for either rifle or pistol.

[MikeG70]

Hi, Ed Barrett,

I live NW of Springfield and my old home town is St. Joseph. Please let me know if you are still around.

Good shooting,

Beer Baron

[PacMan]

Worked with it a little in my .41mag. Velocity was not checked as i do not bother until i find accuracy.
I did not like how dirty it left the brass at all.To get any accuracy i had to go to a higher than recomended load using their formular and the accuracy went south past about fifty yards.Showed absolutly no signs of presure but still had dirty brass and cylinder.Not as bad but still dirty.

It may have some use later but for now i see none for me.

[Gunlaker]

No mention of case or primer is in their data, for either rifle or pistol.

Go to the Hogdon's web site. They have load data for .45-70 and Trail Boss. Their loads use WW brass and CCI 200 primers.

Chris.

[mattbowen]

I have used Trailboss with very good results and I use it in my Handi rifle but I worry about the pressure in my Sharps so I use 2400 in it. I have shot it in the sharps and shot 1.25" groups with it but I don't want to feed it a steady diet of the higher pressures.

[stubshaft]

I have used Trailboss with very good results and I use it in my Handi rifle but I worry about the pressure in my Sharps so I use 2400 in it. I have shot it in the sharps and shot 1.25" groups with it but I don't want to feed it a steady diet of the higher pressures.

Trail Boss has a MAX pressure of 24K with a 400gr boolit.

[mattbowen]

Stubshaft;

By Hogdon's website ( http://data.hodgdon.com/cartridge_load.asp ) their max for a 405gr boolit
is 25600cpu and not knowing what the actual specks of the rifle are I like to play it safe (I had one miss hap happen years ago and don't want another). I always try to err on the side of caution

[zuke]

I use it in my 1895Marlin with 2 different bullet's but the same powder.
I used their idea to get my max load for my 350 and 450 grain bullet.
Went to their reccommended starting/minimum load and found the common number's from there.
LEE perfect powder measure to charge the case's and I'm off to the press!

[45r]

Haven't tried TB in 45-70 yet but 5744 works so well in my GS and XLR I haven't been in no hurry to try TB.I've tried it in other stuff and it works OK but the velocity was slow and I got better accuracy from other powders.If I was wanting a subsonic load for a 45-70 TB would probaly be pretty good.I've seen groups other shooters have shot that was accurate but the velocity was only around 1050fps with a 405 grain boolit.That would still work well for shots not too far away.I've read TB is recomended for PB boolits only.