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View Poll Results: Do you think a SA revolver makes a good self-defense handgun?

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Thread: Single Action revolvers for self-defense?

  1. #61
    Boolit Master Groo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by wills View Post
    Can you cite the statute on that?
    Groo here
    This was not in the statute but published in one of the Police mags
    as a rulling by the judge [ It was said he was mad about the bad duds
    coming in with so many holes in them and stated the self defence
    statute had wording about only shooting till the danger was past]
    [ I have incountered this in other Shooting rags and although it seems strange
    I do believe that the current training is causing this]
    We say shoot till the threat goes away but how many times is the threat defigned?
    I myself have done this hunting deer-- " I aimed every shot"
    My friends said that it had to be me shooting as I was the only one who
    could shoot a 44 mag that fast!
    I believe that "Time Dialation" Aka Mind in Turbo occured and time slowed down
    For Me.
    In a life or death situation this can also happen resulting in " I shot him but he didn't go down" What really happens is that the BG did not have Time to
    react to the shot and as Time had Slowed Down for the Shooter it looks
    like the shot had no effect.

  2. #62
    Boolit Grand Master Four Fingers of Death's Avatar
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    I would use a SA if that was what was to hand, but if there was a double action within reach, it would be a no brainer for me. My shooting over the past five years has seen hundreds of rounds through DA revolvers, a few thousand through 1911 SA Autos and many, many thousands through SA revolvers.

    If I was to use a SA Revolver, it would be a 45Colt. Those suckers are the fastest to load, just throw a round in the loading gate and it is all hole! The round seems to self chamber. You have to line up the 38/357s. The 44/40s are good also, but the Colt is the best to reload, big a$$ed holes on the target as well
    "I'll help you down the trail and proud to!" Rooster Cogburn.

    "Slap some bacon on a biscuit and let's go! We're burnin' daylight! " - Will Anderson (John Wayne) "The Cowboys."

    SASS Life Member No 82047

    http://s89.photobucket.com/albums/k228/4fingermick/

    Psycholigist to Sniper; 'What did you feel when you shot the felon Sargeant?'
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  3. #63
    Boolit Master bearcove's Avatar
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    For SD I think you dance with what you brung. I carry when in the woods not so much in town, and lot of times that is a Ruger BH 4 5/8 41 mag. Seems a good choice to me since I've mainly shot rugers since I was 12 years old. I can shoot it without thinking, aiming or not.

    Rather that than be wondering "does the saftey go up or down?"

    Also like S&W DA

  4. #64
    Boolit Grand Master Four Fingers of Death's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bearcove View Post
    For SD I think you dance with what you brung. I carry when in the woods not so much in town, and lot of times that is a Ruger BH 4 5/8 41 mag. Seems a good choice to me since I've mainly shot rugers since I was 12 years old. I can shoot it without thinking, aiming or not.

    Rather that than be wondering "does the saftey go up or down?"

    Also like S&W DA
    Cain't hardly argue with that!
    "I'll help you down the trail and proud to!" Rooster Cogburn.

    "Slap some bacon on a biscuit and let's go! We're burnin' daylight! " - Will Anderson (John Wayne) "The Cowboys."

    SASS Life Member No 82047

    http://s89.photobucket.com/albums/k228/4fingermick/

    Psycholigist to Sniper; 'What did you feel when you shot the felon Sargeant?'
    Sniper to Psycholigist; 'Recoil Ma'am.'

    From my Irish Ancestors: "You've got to do your own growing, no matter how tall your grandfather was."

  5. #65
    Boolit Man John Van Gelder's Avatar
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    I have been a hand gun shooter since I was 14 yoa, that is over 50 years ago. I have carried a bit of everything, and for a number years until my retirement, "carrying" was a condition of my employment.

    On my own time I carried a lot of single actions and never felt handicapped. There was a time when the single action was all there was and it served well. Some of us find ourselves in a position where we can only afford to have one gun and what we end up with is based on budget constraints. My first hand gun came down to a choice between a used Mod 29 S&W and used Blackhawk .44, both were priced a $95.00. It took a considerable amount of time for me to save that up back then. I bought the Smith, just because my dad had one, and that was good enough reason for me, I shot that gun until it was about worn out and then traded it straight across for my first Super Blackhawk, which then became my everything gun.

    There have been lots of double actions, single actions and semi auto since. But back in those days when I had one gun it worked for whatever I needed.

    There is an old saying: "Beware the man with one gun, because he probably knows how to use it."

  6. #66
    Boolit Master wills's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Groo View Post
    Groo here
    This was not in the statute but published in one of the Police mags
    as a rulling by the judge [ It was said he was mad about the bad duds
    coming in with so many holes in them and stated the self defence
    statute had wording about only shooting till the danger was past]
    [ I have incountered this in other Shooting rags and although it seems strange
    .
    Which judge, and what happened on appeal?

    By BOB SABLATURA, Houston Chronicle, November 04, 1998
    One of the officers nobilled in the death of Pedro Oregon Navarro fired his semiautomatic pistol at the 22-year-old man until the magazine was empty, then reloaded and continued firing.
    In all, Officer David R. Barrera fired 24 of the 33 shots discharged in Oregon's southwest Houston apartment July 12, according to sources familiar with the investigation.
    Assistant District Attorney Ed Porter confirmed that Barrera fired most of the shots. While the medical examiner's office could not determine the exact caliber of the bullets that made the 12 wounds in Oregon's body, Porter said, three of the four bullets recovered from the body were fired from Barrera's weapon.
    Porter, who was present on the scene a few hours after the shooting -- and reconstructed it during a walk-through with the officers involved -- suggested that the bullets that struck Oregon may have been some of the last shots that the officers fired.
    "I strongly suspect that was the case," Porter said.
    Richard Mithoff, an attorney representing Oregon's family, said it is "incomprehensible" that one of the officers paused to reload his weapon.
    "They had no grounds to be in the apartment, and no grounds to open fire," Mithoff said. "And if this is true, there certainly was no grounds to reload and execute this guy lying on the ground."
    Aaron Ruby, a member of the Justice for Pedro Oregon Coalition, said Barrera's actions could only be termed "homicidal and premeditated," and probably explain the numerous bullet holes in Oregon's back.
    "If that fact was known to the grand jury, it makes their actions all the more outrageous," Ruby said. "I believe the people of Houston will be stunned when they learn of this."
    Harris County District Attorney John B. Holmes Jr. said state law allows police officers to use deadly force if they believe it necessary for self-defense and can continue shooting "so long as they reasonably perceive" the threat continues.
    "An analogy I use is that if it is OK to kill a guy dead, it is OK to kill him dead, dead, dead," Holmes said.
    Holmes said it is also not uncommon for a police officer involved in a shooting to have no idea how many shots he fired.
    http://www.lulac.net/advocacy/issues/rights/hc11-4.html
    Last edited by wills; 11-27-2010 at 08:25 PM.
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  7. #67
    Boolit Buddy AJ Peacock's Avatar
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    Not with so many better options available.

    I voted NO. Even though I've shot a SA more (10x more) than any other type of handgun. Competed in SASS at a very high level for many years and feel very comfortable with a SA (shooting traditional/2 handed, duelist/one handed, or gunfighter/one in each hand). I'd say with all the options available, the SA handgun is better than only 3 options.
    1) Derringer
    2) Single shot
    3) No pistol at all

    I hate glocks, but carry a G23 because it has the fewest weak points from a self defense standpoint of any readily available handgun. I just wish I was as proficient with it as I am with a SA. I just need to wear one or two out, to get to that level.

    BTW: Here is a video of me winning the Midwest Regional Cowboy Action SASS shootoff in 2005
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4W9vkhHG6vk

    AJ

  8. #68
    Boolit Man John Van Gelder's Avatar
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    AJ Peacock

    I watched the video, not sure why you said "no"

  9. #69
    Boolit Buddy AJ Peacock's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by John Van Gelder View Post
    AJ Peacock

    I watched the video, not sure why you said "no"
    Better options available in the following categories:

    1) Semi-auto's are thinner and thus, easier to conceal.
    2) Semi-auto's are easier to reload.
    3) Semi-auto's have better options for concealment holsters.
    4) Semi-auto's are SIGNIFICANTLY faster to shoot one handed.
    5) Semi-auto's have a lot higher capacity.
    6) Double actions are faster one handed.
    7) Double actions are faster to reload (swing out cylinders and speed loaders).

    That being said, I'd rather have one of my SA's than nothing, but I have much better options. I've NEVER carried one of my SA's concealed, for the above reasons.

    Not to mention, if I ever have to use my Glock to defend myself and others, the police will take my pistol for 2-3 years .

    Losing a Glock wouldn't be a big deal, but I'd really hate to lose one of my SA's

    AJ

  10. #70
    Boolit Master
    canyon-ghost's Avatar
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    I'd think any Single Action with a '4' as a first number would do the job. I happen to own a 41 mag, if it'll shoot accurately to 100 meters, I don't see the first shot as any kind of warning!
    In all, the .41 Magnum would be one of my top choices for an all-around handgun if I were allowed to have only one. - Bart Skelton

    "It is well enough that people of the nation do not understand our banking and monetary system, for if they did, I believe there would be a revolution before tomorrow morning."
    Henry Ford

  11. #71
    Boolit Man John Van Gelder's Avatar
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    AJ Peacock

    As an old retired police officer and fire arms instructor, the one hand thing is not valid in combat one is always encouraged to shoot with both hands, reloading is probably not an issue because most gun fights over very quickly, and one way or another there will probably be no time/opportunity to reload. I have no idea if you were shooting a target or just shooting for time, but that was very fast, that may .45s on a target that quickly should solve any tactical situation. I am not saying that the double action revolver of Semi-auto are not better choices but if the SA was all you had my money would be on you prevailing.

    Thanks for sharing the video, that was impressive.

  12. #72
    Boolit Buddy AJ Peacock's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by John Van Gelder View Post
    AJ Peacock

    As an old retired police officer and fire arms instructor, the one hand thing is not valid in combat one is always encouraged to shoot with both hands, reloading is probably not an issue because most gun fights over very quickly, and one way or another there will probably be no time/opportunity to reload. I have no idea if you were shooting a target or just shooting for time, but that was very fast, that may .45s on a target that quickly should solve any tactical situation. I am not saying that the double action revolver of Semi-auto are not better choices but if the SA was all you had my money would be on you prevailing.

    Thanks for sharing the video, that was impressive.
    Those were all shot on metal targets 5 x 12" round at about 7yds for the pistol and 10x12" at 15yds for the rifle. 8 Knockdowns for the shotgun.

    AJ

  13. #73
    Boolit Man John Van Gelder's Avatar
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    AJ Peacock

    That is very acceptable combat accuracy..

  14. #74
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    John Van Gelder
    It humors me much to see how the tactical handgun hold idea has changed over time.
    I have in my collection a book written by a J Fitzpatrick I think his name was or something close to that. He was a wrench for S&W at the camp Perry matches and he was also a police instructor. He taught a one hand hold and that is what was standard in his day. There is a pic of two officers with duty 38's fired one hand hold at 600 yards at the human torso target and there are no misses after each man fired a full cylinder. He even makes a comment about a two hand hold not being as accurate. My how times change! BTW its a good book if you get a chance to read it. It called "Shooting By Fitz" He was Elmer's mentor.
    OH yes BTW I forgot to mention weather in the field or in town I carry a Ruger single six center fire in either 22 CCM or 32 mag and feel far from naked. When in town I do carry a Bond Arms 45/410 back up too. With those I feel better protected from armed predators than from unarmed ones.
    Last edited by Bullshop; 11-27-2010 at 10:34 PM.

  15. #75
    Boolit Man John Van Gelder's Avatar
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    Bullshop

    Things have changed over time, I have enjoyed the writings of Jeff Cooper, Elmer Keith's books, had a lot of good information and some history as well. I recall an incident where Mr. Keith was reported to have finished off a deer for a fellow hunter at 600 yards with a hand gun, there were a lot of folks in the shooting community that, felt that was impossible. Which in turn spawned an article of some chaps proving it was not...

    I have been known to find a comfortable spot to lie down with a dusty meadow on the other side of a canyon and lob .45 colt slugs at rocks and the like.

  16. #76
    Boolit Master
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    I personally like SA revolvers a lot both in cartridge and cap and ball persuasion. I mostly carry either one of them or a Six inch barreled DA revolver when out in the woods or hunting. I would feel comfortable defending myself with one of them if that was all I had with me. However, for CCW when I go to town I usually take a semi auto DA pistol. I will not carry a SA pistol for two reasons. First if I carry in cocked and locked I have to remember to take the safety off. If I carry it condition 2 I have to remember to cock the hammer. As I am not the sort of person who practices to an extent that mussle memory takes over I avoid the issue by not dealing with it. I have carries just about every type of handgun at one time or another (even a flint lock single shot) but today I carry a DA Auto with a large capacity mag. Usually a 9mm but when size is important I carry a 380. The two guns I mostly carry is a Baby Desert Eagle Compact or a Bersa 380 Thunderer. However I sometimes carry my Glock 17. On rare occations I will carry a DA revolver mostly my SP101 Ruger.

  17. #77
    Boolit Grand Master
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    AJ--

    You'll do fine to ride the river with, I'd say. Regardless of sidearm configuration. Well done, sir.
    I don't paint bullets. I like Black Rifle Coffee. Sacred cows are always fair game. California is to the United States what Syria is to Russia and North Korea is to China/South Korea/Japan--a Hermit Kingdom detached from the real world and led by delusional maniacs, an economic and social basket case sustained by "foreign" aid so as to not lose military bases.

  18. #78
    Boolit Master
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    HI,
    WOW FOUR FINGERS ,that's some shooting.
    Master Funikoshi said you never lose a fight you avoid.
    I do believe in the KISS method,
    stick with what you are good at & know the best.
    So in my case it would have to be revolvers.
    I also practice both R. & L. hand.
    A cool head , determination, & shot placement count.
    In a life & death fight, there is only 1 rule. WIN!

  19. #79
    Boolit Man
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    AJ, Excellent shooting there. It sounds like you and I are in the same school though when it comes to an actual confrontation that warrants armed response - I posted earlier indicating my preference for a gun that's simple to operate under extreme pressure.

    Good luck in an attempt to wear out a Glock. Not pretty, but very reliable and easy to operate, mechanically simple, and easy to shoot. I've seen some range rentals with over 250,000 rounds through them - 9mm mind you. While I'm a fan of SA's, and my favorite handgun is a GP100, a Glock is tough to beat when it really counts.

  20. #80
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    Quote Originally Posted by Groo View Post
    Groo here
    This was not in the statute but published in one of the Police mags
    as a rulling by the judge [ It was said he was mad about the bad duds
    coming in with so many holes in them and stated the self defence
    statute had wording about only shooting till the danger was past]
    [ I have incountered this in other Shooting rags and although it seems strange
    I do believe that the current training is causing this]
    We say shoot till the threat goes away but how many times is the threat defigned?
    I myself have done this hunting deer-- " I aimed every shot"
    My friends said that it had to be me shooting as I was the only one who
    could shoot a 44 mag that fast!
    I believe that "Time Dialation" Aka Mind in Turbo occured and time slowed down
    For Me.
    In a life or death situation this can also happen resulting in " I shot him but he didn't go down" What really happens is that the BG did not have Time to
    react to the shot and as Time had Slowed Down for the Shooter it looks
    like the shot had no effect.

    The first thing to do is stop believing everything you read in gun rags. Same goes for the cop rags. I used to read the cop rags in the crapper at work. 90% advertising, 8% ego inflating, 2% actual fact.

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BP Bronze Point IMR Improved Military Rifle PTD Pointed
BR Bench Rest M Magnum RN Round Nose
BT Boat Tail PL Power-Lokt SP Soft Point
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