bp and trapdoor

[adrians]

hi ,iv,e been using smokeless for a while but now i want to shoot bp in my original 45.70 1873 trap ,i,m a complete nothingness when it comes to bp so ,what should a newbie use as far as powder and wads and all that stuff? please make it simple to start with ,i can only consume so much of your info at any one time ,,,.
joking aside can yall put me on the "right" track to start to use bp.
thanks adrians.
oh! i forgot to mention i have once fired starline brass rem 91/2 primers and cast with the lee 457-405-f with ww lead.

[SharpsShooter]

55 grains of Goex cartridge grade or FFg., a .060 Walters vegetable wad and a black powder friendly boolit lube. Seat the boolit snug against the powder and have at it. That lee 405 may be a bit undersize for a trapdoor, but if that's what you have been using with smokeless.......continue on.

SS

[Larry Gibson]

You should invest in Spence Wolf's Book; Loading Cartridges For The Original .45-70 Springfield Rifle And Carbine. That book will give you 95% of the information needed for loading BP loads in the Trapdoor. It can be got at www.the45-70book.com. I also suggest you get the special 5 die Lee set of dies from them or the componants to upgrade your dies.

I shoot a lot of BP through my 3 TDs and enjoy them a whole lot. If you follow Spence's advise and directions it is very hard to go wrong. That book is a wealth of information on not only loading for the TD but in understanding and shooting it also.

Larry Gibson

[adrians]

thanks fella,s i intrnd to get the wolfs book but until then i just needed the "basics"so to speak to get the experience of popping a bp load off at the range..i,m going this weekend but it will be with smokeless until i buy all that i need for bp.
my wife is over my shoulder right now and she just said very nicely THIS STUFF BETTER NOT BREAK THE BANK and she ended with ok honey,she,s a keeper lol,
thanks again and keep the advice comming ...

[Nobade]

My '73 likes 70gr. Goex CTG trickled in with a 3 foot drop tube, compressed with a compression die so the Lee 405HB seats with the lube grooves covered. Bullet is as cast, stick-on wheelweights) lubed with Emmert's. Large pistol primer. This load shoots to the sights out to 500yards, and is as accurate as I am capable of seeing. That bullet carries enough lube to shoot all day without wiping. Lighter loads do not track with the sights.

[StrawHat]

+1 on the Spence Wolf book, lots of good info from the man who wrote the book on duplicating the original load.

[mastercast.com]

When you shoot BP you need to soften/anneal the part of the case that holds the bullet...if not done, it will not obturate and seal the chamber..accuracy will go to patterns instead of groups.

This is one of the best kept secrets of BP rifle shooting.

You heard it here, not from Mike Venturino.

If you read the "STARLINE" brass site, they will tell you almost the same thing.

If the "DUKE"(Mike Venturino) ever gave you that information, I must have missed it in all of the periodicals that I suscribe to.

"The Duke"......Michael Venturino......NOPE! There is always one "DUKE" and he is not the one. I do not care what his horse was named years ago. There is only one "Duke" and that is John Wayne, not Mike Venturino.

[NickSS]

The lee bullet you have may not work as well as you would like as it does not have very deep lube grooves. If you want to use it go ahead and see how it does but you may have to make lube wads to put in under your bullet.

[missionary5155]

Good morning
Do yourself a favor and slug the throat area. Get a proper fitted boolit in there and accuracy will happen.
My 1884 shoots best with a .463+ even with a 40-1 mix.

[mastercast.com]

Good morning
Do yourself a favor and slug the throat area. Get a proper fitted boolit in there and accuracy will happen.
My 1884 shoots best with a .463+ even with a 40-1 mix.

The "KEY" to accurate shooting of BP cartridge loads is to anneal the cases the length of the bullet. Proper diameter is also important. Perhaps your 1884 shoots best with .463 is because that seals the bore with regard to the case mouth. Give that a little thought.

If modern cases are not annealed properly, they will not seal the chamber when shot. You will get soot all over your cases, and they will not shoot worth prunes. Modern cases like those from "Starline" are manufactured with "High Pressure Loads" like those from "Buffalo Bore Ammo" in mind.






When annealed properly, the case will seal the bore, and you will have no soot on your cases.(Black powder or low pressure smokeless loads.)

[Springfield]

So how does soot on my cases affect accuracy?

[bigted]

as a newbeee as well i would guess that the soot on the outside of the case is a sign that the case is not swelling enough to seal the chamber...therefor not giving the same preassure to the boolit shot to shot. therefor affecting the final accuracy you will get. problem solved with annealing the cases in the oven in a pan of water. correct??? im just gleaning the info myself to start this exact procedure...only diff is going to be im be shooting a sharps repro and a marlin cowboy

[montana_charlie]

as a newbeee as well i would guess that the soot on the outside of the case is a sign that the case is not swelling enough to seal the chamber...therefor not giving the same preassure to the boolit shot to shot. therefor affecting the final accuracy you will get.

You appear to understand the issue.
CM

[chuebner]

Annealing new cases is definitely the answer. I found out the hard way with a batch of new Starline I neglected to anneal and just loaded my normal recipe with BP for my Pedersoli Sharps. Cases had soot halfway to the head. Won't do that again. My M1888 trapdoor slugs at .450 X .462 and I shoot a beagled 457125 that drops at .463. Alloy is 30:1.

[John Boy]

... but until then i just needed the "basics"so to speak to get the experience of popping a bp load off at the range.

Might want to start reading this freebie ... Introduction to Black Powder Loading