lead bullets coated with polymer paint

[HI-TEK]

HI-TEK,
How long does your coating last in its constituent parts? A liter sounds like it should last me a lifetime based on quantity. Just wondering if the materials will be good for that long.

TIA

Thanks for contact. I suppose if you make 100 projectiles a year, 1 litre should last you a while.
1 Litre coats about 35,000-45,000 projectiles.
I have had coating sit around for 8 years, it darkened and became more viscous, but seemed to work OK. The final colours were darker due to aging.
I have never had a situation where a user has coating left after a few months.
If your production is that low, you really should be sending your casts to a coater to coat for you. It should cost you much less and the product should be good as you have no experimental losses and need for recycling of faulty product.
Alternatively, you can get all your mates to combine their lot and do a combined batch to maximise costs and production efficiency.
I do not know what else I can tell you, but to expect a coating to last forever is a little over the top.

[seedeeze]

My 1st post here.

HI-TEK,

Very interested about this polymer coating, forgive me but I have quite a few questions.

How are colors added? If no color is added, what would it look like when applied to cast bullets? Can we add our own colors either pigments or dyes? Let's say I'm in a remote location and I coated a thousand bullets and let them dry, but my oven breaks down a few hundred bullets into the curing process, is it okay for the uncured bullets to stand for a few week before curing?

Sorry again for all the questions.

[HI-TEK]

My 1st post here.

HI-TEK,

Very interested about this polymer coating, forgive me but I have quite a few questions.

How are colors added? If no color is added, what would it look like when applied to cast bullets? Can we add our own colors either pigments or dyes? Let's say I'm in a remote location and I coated a thousand bullets and let them dry, but my oven breaks down a few hundred bullets into the curing process, is it okay for the uncured bullets to stand for a few week before curing?

Sorry again for all the questions.

We supply the coatings with the colours already added.
We also supply a product that is called Natural. This coating contains all the things to make it work but not coloured. This Natural coating, turns yellow, to yellow tan when baked and can look like a golden type colour after final cook.
If you coat projectiles, and then leave them without cooking, is OK. It does not hurt the coating. I have had a user leave a bucket full for 6 months, then cooked the product and they turned out fine.
Generally, because cooking costs money for power, makers try to put through as much as possible when the oven is hot, so not to waste energy. I suppose for smaller manufacturers this may not be a problem.
It only takes about 10 minutes to bake each coat, and generally two very thin coats is enough.
There is no Natural coating in US at present only pre-coloured coatings are available.
Hope I answered your questions adequately.
Joe

[prickett]

Thanks for contact. I suppose if you make 100 projectiles a year, 1 litre should last you a while.
1 Litre coats about 35,000-45,000 projectiles.
I have had coating sit around for 8 years, it darkened and became more viscous, but seemed to work OK. The final colours were darker due to aging.
I have never had a situation where a user has coating left after a few months.
If your production is that low, you really should be sending your casts to a coater to coat for you. It should cost you much less and the product should be good as you have no experimental losses and need for recycling of faulty product.
Alternatively, you can get all your mates to combine their lot and do a combined batch to maximise costs and production efficiency.
I do not know what else I can tell you, but to expect a coating to last forever is a little over the top.

HI-TEK,
Thanks for the response. You need to realize that the vast majority of folks on this site are casting for their own personal use, not as part of a business. Shooting 1000 rounds per month would result in 3 or 4 years worth of coating. So, my question (which I exaggerated to say a "lifetime") really meant 4 or 5 years. Based on your response, it sounds entirely possible for the product to last that long.

I hope to buy my first liter in the next month.

Thanks again.

[HI-TEK]

Hi,
Thanks for quick reply. Yes I gathered that from the huge number of enquiries for small quantities.
If you buy a one litre pack, as long as you mix it well.
Decant what you need to coat, dilute this with solvent to suit, add catalyst and mix.
The rest, keep as cool as possible, and out of sunlight, in tightly sealed bottles, to keep the product from losing solvent and or getting more air into package.
I believe that this should be fine.
I would appreciate your comments when you use the coating.
Did you see the U-Tube videos, for home users, made by a guy in US ?
It gives you an idea how easy it is with a simple set up.
Joe

[garym1a2]

Mine came in today, black color. Just a simple question on mixing. The instructions say mix 1:5 and also 5 parts acetone. Is this mix by weight or volumne? Or does it matter?

[HI-TEK]

Hi
Thanks for contact.
It really does not matter with dilutions if you use weight per weight or volume to volume ratios.
The idea is to dilute coating to suit your needs, to cover projectiles with the smallest volume of diluted coating to achieve the cover with a very thin coating each time. Once coated, do not disturb allow to dry well.
Then, bake at 190C for about 8-10 minutes.
Attached is video on how to do it, they use the dark green but the methods are the same.
Also attached is coating data.
YouTube videos:
Part1
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VevKJgHseWc
Part2
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NU7PbbtbAtE
J & M Specialized Products Pty Ltd
A.B.N. 97 078 037 653
Phone 02 65569004 Mobile 0412 140 821
Email: jandm@blue1000.com.au
PRODUCT DATA AND APPLICATION
HI-TEK-LUBE SUPERCOATS
For standard, 1X, 2X and LC Black, GREEN & Metallic types.

HI-TEK-LUBE SUPERCOAT’s are a range of heat cured coatings, specifically suitable as dry film lubricants for metal components. On steel, the coatings offer corrosion protection as well as lubrication in areas where normal lubricants cannot be used.
Typical areas where product can be used, in wet, corrosive, dusty or contaminating environments, at elevated temperatures.

DESCRIPTION.

HI-TEK-LUBE SUPERCOAT’s , are solvent based, self-lubricating, paint type coatings, and require specialized Catalyst and heat to fully cure.
Products may not adhere well to polished Stainless steels or Aluminium.
Hi-Tek-Lube Supercoats do not contain any PTFE, Fluoro polymers or Teflon.
Once heat cured, the product range offers excellent lubricity, Impact resistance, and excellent deformation capability, as well as corrosion protection.
The extreme lubricity and durability of the cured coating, allows excellent metal separation and lubrication.
Heat cured coating has excellent heat tolerance and heat reflectivity.
The coating has in built capability to react to high energy input applications to further harden and keep separated metal surfaces without softening or becoming sticky. Heat will not soften correctly cured coating, and excessive heat will produce an extremely hard coating.
The cured coatings is suitable for use in service temperatures of around 150 Degrees Celsius, with intermittent use up to 250 Degrees Celsius.

TYPICAL APPLICATIONS.

Limitations for use depends on the ability to have the coating being heat cured on to the components at curing temperatures.
Until coatings are heat cured, even when dry, the coatings can be easily washed and recycled back into production, with solvents like Acetone, or Methyl Ethyl Ketone.

This phenomena is used as a quality control aid, for curing indication, during manufacture of coated components.
Properly heat cured coatings, are not removed with MEK or Acetone even if the coating is soaked in these solvents.

COATING SUGGESTIONS
AND CATALYST WELL BEFORE USE.
Measure out coating, add same amount of dilution solvent, and add required catalyst to diluted mixture.
For example take 100 mls coating, add 100 mls Acetone and add 20 Mls Catalyst.
Prior to using catalysed and diluted mixture, additional solvent may be added to dilute coating if required to allow the coating to coat more product with very thin coating.

Use about 20-30 mls of Catalysed coating mixture to tumble coat onto approximately 1000 projectiles.
Tumble only for 10-15 seconds, and just long enough to coat.
Whilst wet, drop coated projectiles onto drying mesh or trays and air dry until touch dry.
Do not disturb whilst drying is taking place.
Do not tumble dry the projectiles as it will produce unsatisfactory results.
After completely dry, shake tray to loosen projectiles, and place totally dry projectiles into oven and cook at 190C for about 8-10 minutes. Do Not overload each tray, to ensure even heating and curing.

When cooked, take out of oven, cool, and then recoat with same mixture. Repeat all as above.
It is better to apply and heat cure, two or three, very thin diluted coatings, dry totally, and then cure with heat after each coating, to obtain acceptable appearance of finished coating.

When properly heat cured, the coating lubricating quality does not appear to suffer, even if coating film appearance is blotchy or uneven.

As a general guide, curing approximately 5-15 minutes between coating at 180-200 degrees Celsius is essential, as uncured coating will be removed by next coating, if previous coating is not properly cured.

Once the desired coating appearance is reached , then final cure should be held at 180-200 degrees for about 6-8 minutes.

NOTE. Do not use thick coatings, or try to coat with one thick coating, it will simply not work well..

Do not over heat or over cure product for excessive periods, as coating becomes extremely hard and brittle, and colour will also darken.

Thick application of coatings will also “weld” metal object together during heat curing, and thick coatings dry slowly, produce undesirable touch marks and may produce uneven and irregular surface after cure.

Thick coatings, also detracts from flexibility of the coatings, and coatings may chip or crack when sizing or impact testing is carried out.

Best results are produced by application of two or three very thin and diluted coatings. Each coat requires drying, and after thorough drying, coating is to be bake cured after each application.

Individual testing of curing requirements, must be determined by user, for optimising each end use application.
Once you determine best product using your processing methods, you then have to reproduce exactly each step on going, to reproduce same results required.

Diluents suitable for coating is Methyl Ethyl Ketone, Acetone, and blends of MEK/Iso- Propyl Alcohol and or Acetone.

IMPORTANT NOTE.
ONLY THOROUGHLY AIR DRIED COATINGS MUST BE HEAT CURED AS UNDRIED COATING IS EXTREMELY FLAMMABLE AND VAPOURS, MAY CAUSE EXPLOSION IN THE OVEN.

CAUTION
The coatings and solvent diluents are highly flammable and coating are and ovens must be away from coating area with adequate ventilation to eliminate any danger of fire from evaporating solvents.

No sparks or flames or smoking near uncured or wet coatings or near solvents.
Avoid skin contact, eye contact and clothing contact, and have adequate ventilation to remove vapours, and appropriate solvent mask is recommended to avoid solvent vapour inhalation.

Do not Spray or Atomise coatings. Application is best achieved by tumbling process.

CURE TIME (indications only) Approximate
TEMPERATURE CURE TIME
180C 10-15 minutes
190C 8-10 minutes
200C 6-8 minutes

NOTE: Time for curing, should start, when the temperature of the product, reaches the desired cure temperature, and heating rate is controlled by ability to circulate hot air in oven.

If loading an oven, say with 50kgs of metal, the temperature of the metal may take some time to reach the set oven temperature, and is directly related to and limited to heating capacity, and air circulation around the objects to be coated.

It is essential to determine optimum conditions, for type and capacity of equipment to be used for the heat curing cycle, to achieve the desired for “actual” cure times, as recommended above.

It is recommended that all ovens are fitted with extremely good air circulation fans, to optimise even cure rate and to maximise fast and even heat transfer to cure coating.

FOR FURTHER TECHNICAL ADVICE PLEASE CONTACT MANUFACTURER.

Hope it gelps.
Joe

[HI-TEK]

Hi,
As Promised, I contacted our customer about your requirements for a small quantity.
The Person to contact is Otmar Bartsch on email, otmar@gmx.ch. He may arrange to supply some of the product that is currently under way in a container to Europe.
It may be a few weeks before it arrives, I am not sure of actual sailing time for the ship.
If you please contact Otmar directly, to arrange matters.
I would appreciate your results.
Joe

[Hi-Performance Bullet Coatings]

For those that had kits on order they go out today.
Thanks for your patience.
Donnie

[bmiller]

Great news!
Thank you
Brian

[fixerupper]

Thanks Donnie....!!!!

Kevin

[TES]

Can you powder coat in a barrel. Like barrel plating?

Also HI-TEK Is the coating susceptible to temperature ranges during storage? I live in a very cold dry climate that tends to effect things differently than most places.

[HI-TEK]

Can you powder coat in a barrel. Like barrel plating?

Also HI-TEK Is the coating susceptible to temperature ranges during storage? I live in a very cold dry climate that tends to effect things differently than most places.

Hi,
As product is solvent based. it should not freeze until you get to below -32C areas.
Cold, should preserve the integrity of the resin system. As long as it is kept in closed container out of sunlight, it should be fine.
We have re-dissolved non catalysed air dried coatings, and re-used them to coat projectiles.
The only problem has been determined, is that pre-catalysed systems will start to Gel at continous temperatures of 35C and above.
Curing at these conditions is slow, and Catlysed system can be used over 2-3 days, but it is not recomended that you just leave it and expect best results after longer storage.
Catalysed system can be cooled to slow such Gelling, so it stands to reason, that cold, should also help stabilise any slow Gel formation reactions and extend use times.

I really have not had any one trying to use this stuff in constant cold conditions.
Low humidity is not a problem and should help with coating to dry quickly.
Joe

[TES]

Sorry. Would the finished product after coating and cooking degrade or shrink in cold temps. We regularly get in the negative temps during winter and I would hate to have the coating harden and shrink or become Brittle. Some folks do actually store ammo outside of the house.

[HI-TEK]

Sorry. Would the finished product after coating and cooking degrade or shrink in cold temps. We regularly get in the negative temps during winter and I would hate to have the coating harden and shrink or become Brittle. Some folks do actually store ammo outside of the house.

Hi,
Sorry, I thought you were referring to the coatings solutions with your enquiry.
I really cannot answer your question, as I have previously never had come accross any one that had stored cured coated projectiles in sub zero conditions.
I suppose, the only way to really test it is to place some in a Freezer, and then have a look at them after storing there for 1- 2, or 3 or more weeks.
Joe

[TES]

Donnie,


Any help here?

Thanks,

Tayler

[garym1a2]

I fired mine up last night and coated a hundred 155gr 30 cal bullets and another hundred 230 gr 45acp bullets. today I loaded 21 of them in my 300 blackout and ran them thru my AR I built. Useing half with 15 gr of IMR4227 and the other 10 with 16gr of IMR4227. Accuracy seemed normal, function was 100% feeding good including bolt lock back on empty. The barrel was fairly easy to clean. My bolt is kind of crudy, but that could be since it was from my .223 m&P. I have a new bolt to try for it next. In the next week or so I hope to have more results when I can get some brass made. Since the Hi-tek material is rather easy to use I could see a big labor saver coming with it for my USPSA glock loads.

I got some bullet coating on order this week from Bayo bullets. I plan to try them for my 155 blackout, both with gas checks and without gas checks.

[HI-TEK]

I fired mine up last night and coated a hundred 155gr 30 cal bullets and another hundred 230 gr 45acp bullets. today I loaded 21 of them in my 300 blackout and ran them thru my AR I built. Useing half with 15 gr of IMR4227 and the other 10 with 16gr of IMR4227. Accuracy seemed normal, function was 100% feeding good including bolt lock back on empty. The barrel was fairly easy to clean. My bolt is kind of crudy, but that could be since it was from my .223 m&P. I have a new bolt to try for it next. In the next week or so I hope to have more results when I can get some brass made. Since the Hi-tek material is rather easy to use I could see a big labor saver coming with it for my USPSA glock loads.

I am glad that you had success, the coatings have been used with glocks for years on straight alloy coated with various coloured versions of my coatings.
I have heard that many now, do not use gas checks as it is not needed. I wish that I could have gathered over the years, the many different end use and results, from the many, that use the coated alloys.
Looking forward to more of your results.
Joe

[Hi-Performance Bullet Coatings]

Donnie,
Any help here?
Thanks,
Tayler

TES,
I have sent bullets to all 50 states and not received any complaints. Best I could to test that for you is put some in a freezer and test them. But you guys see temps colder than that.
TES, PM sent
Donnie

[garym1a2]

I decided since it was raining yesterday afternoon to coat a bunch of my bullets. The stuff is rather fast to use once you get going. I coated 2000 9mms, 800 45's and about 900 30cal in just a couple hours. Hold-up being the 2-tray convection toster oven. It seems to me just a dab of the material goes a long way. The process is a lot like the tumble lube process for bullets will Alox, only will the paint you do not end up with sticky bullets.