lead bullets coated with polymer paint

[kcinnick]

My testing efforts have been put on hold due the a malfunction of my gun that is waiting for repair. but the most recent testing indicates problems with both the pro tec and sandstrom giving me a cleaning job. Not lead but residue in the barrel.

Any Moly coating is going to have that issue.

[Four Fingers of Death]

Any Moly coating is going to have that issue.

You shouldn't get that with Joe Ban's stuff, I have fired thousands of rounds through my cowboy and IPSC guns and hardly ever clean them. No bore deposits that I can see.

i once bought 2000 coated 9mm boolits, fired them off over a few months (the barrels had Lord knows how many through it without cleaning before I started using these). The internals had a lot of crud built up, but the barrel looked ok. I cleaned off the staligmites and staligtites and gave the barrel a swab with Hoppe's. Didn't need much, came out clean after a patch or two and that was powder residue I feel.

[kcinnick]

You shouldn't get that with Joe Ban's stuff, I have fired thousands of rounds through my cowboy and IPSC guns and hardly ever clean them. No bore deposits that I can see.

i once bought 2000 coated 9mm boolits, fired them off over a few months (the barrels had Lord knows how many through it without cleaning before I started using these). The internals had a lot of crud built up, but the barrel looked ok. I cleaned off the staligmites and staligtites and gave the barrel a swab with Hoppe's. Didn't need much, came out clean after a patch or two and that was powder residue I feel.

Joes coating doesn't have Moly in it!

[Four Fingers of Death]

Joes coating doesn't have Moly in it!

As the kids say these days, preeeecisely!

[plamenti]

The user "Simba" PM me, but he has chosen not to receive private messages or may not be allowed to receive private messages. I can't send PM to him and therefore I post the answer here. May be useful.

Mr Plamenti hi ,

First of all , I would like to thank you for sharing us those new technics for who is interested in coating boolits.

Before reading your article I have tried several methods to avoid smoke and leading problem.But now I am going to tray that method which seems so atractive.

I would like to as a few questions :

1) Did you avoid all smoke and leading problem with ''powder coating '' ? .Do you advise or available to use in IPSC for minor power factors (like minor 9mm 125PF ) any loosing of performance ?

2)How did you solve below problem ( you mentioned in cast boolits ) ? The problem occured removing from oven or removing after paint ?


" sometimes the paint is thick and I have a problem with removing the boolits from the tray, some of the coating breaks off.

3) After painting/coating you resize the bullets again ?

I will be very happy if you reply that message

Thanks and regards

Hi Simba,

my answers one after another:

1. I didn't avoid all of the smoke, but I'm very satisfied from the result. Here is a video from my last IPSC competition.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7X_-cs1cOe8
I'm shooting with 147 grain painted boolits and you can see the smoke. But I'm using very low quality powder for shotguns - here the good powder like Hodgon or IMR is very expensive and we are using a cheap powder for shotgun (for hunting). I had no leading problems after about 220 shots. No major problems with the leading after 400 shots too (tested in the training sessions).
I'm shooting in Production devision and my PF is about 132-135. The accuracy is very good - 2-3 inch group at 25 meters. Here we have a lot of shooters in Standard devision, who are shooting in .40 cal with 180 or 200 grain polymer painted boolits in major PF (about 180-185 ). No problems with leading and according the powder - with the smoke. Same thing with .38 SA cal.

2. I solve the problem by the removing with nuts . Just be careful by the conveyance. See the pictures (here are 125 grain boolits, but with the 147 grain is the same, just haven't pics):






3. I found, that the best way is to resize the boolits twice - once before and once after polymer coating. First I'm using .355 sizing die set (from CH4D) and after the painting - .356 sizing die set (Lee).

Hope this help.

[Hang Fire]

Looking good there. Glad to you guys persevering in improving the process.

[simba]

The user "Simba" PM me, but he has chosen not to receive private messages or may not be allowed to receive private messages. I can't send PM to him and therefore I post the answer here. May be useful.

Hi Simba,

my answers one after another:
....

Hope this help.

Thank you very much MR Plamenti that is very kind of you to sharing those details.

My another question ;
Do you or any of your friends who uses same boolits (may be same material like dynamic arms bullets ) any chance to try Hodgon-Vithaviori etc. powders to test the smoke ? I am so obsess about to get same standard with factory ammo...

Regards

[Silver-Silver]

any chance to try Hodgon-Vithaviori etc. powders to test the smoke ? I am so obsess about to get same standard with factory ammo...
Regards

Simba,
Why not give it a try! The process has been outlined for you. You just need to get out there and coat the bullets and try any powder you would like. Anyone who is obsessed with trying to replicate a jacketed factory round knows sooner or later they are going to have to try their ideas. You can't expect plamenti or any other person to spend their hard earned money to help you out with your obsession. It sounds like he is happy with what he has and good for him for publishing his findings for everyone to read and learn from.

Get out there and try it !

[plamenti]

My another question ;
Do you or any of your friends who uses same boolits (may be same material like dynamic arms bullets ) any chance to try Hodgon-Vithaviori etc. powders to test the smoke ?

I tried Hodgdon Titegroup - great powder, little bit fast for lead boolits, but the results was great. The smoke was in normal bounds. Unfortunately I haven't video or pics.

Here is my last approach - I paint the boolits at the rear side. The result is TPSP - Total Paint Soft Point . The accuracy is very good, almost smokeless especially with good powders like Titegroup. I painted yesterday 1K boolits and here are the pics

Line up the boolits:




Painting:


After baking ready for sizing and reloading :

[MrMagoo157]

Let me first say I am a newbie here and this is only my second post. I must also admit that I have never cast a single bullet but have nearly 20 years experience as a machinist, so I do understand a lot of what is discussed. It is amazing for me to see the amount of time and energy spent trying to find the "Holy Grail" of boolit coatings and I applaud those that have made strides in this area. I guess what we are all looking for is a coating that will allow jacketed bullet velocities/accuracy without a TON of time spent applying the coating or removing it from our barrels. I have a new challenge to produce .224" bullets for my 223 Rem blasting habit but have found swaging to be too time consuming and expensive. Jacket bullets are somewhat scarce, especially in the cheaper 7-10 cent/ea range. So, I have decided to look into casting a spitzer style bullet at ~60 grains and find the proper coating to allow 2500+ fps. Can anyone with this experience steer me in the right direction? Saeco/Redding has the bullet mold but I may have to go custom if the sizing issue is a problem because I plan to size and coat without additional steps. Any idea or help is appreciated.....Thanks

[docmagnum357]

SandStrom 28a? "tumble lubed " in a Cement mixer? Sized afte the coating " looks right? " I think I have it. Can you get the Sandstrom in different colors?

I already have everything I need to make this happen, and i am not in a hurry.... i will be happy if I can coat a fair sized batch of boolits that will work in my Progressive machine. I love cast Boolits, but i hate not bein able to use the progressive press to the fullest potential.

I will try to make careful notes and add my 2c worth here, too. I may have a Lee 6 cavity 2r 125 modifie to remove the lube roove if this works. I want to keep up with what the cost is, too. Might as well buy jacketed or pkated if it is expensive.

I am also looking at trying to buy scrap range lead from a nearby indoor range( or two) . I use mostly wheel weights and my own recoverd handgun bullets( I am a CCH instructor, we shoot about 15k rounds a year here,just minimum for qualifying) .

This could make the dfference to a small professional like me, take shoting to a real living wage instead of a pating hobby. I can try a bunch of bullets for not much investment with the SandStrom 28a. Will advise.

[koger]

Folks, on the above mentioned rumors, had a glock 21 blow up a case, mild load, and blow a firing pin and extactor using my own cast and loaded ammo, know everything was right. Also had a drop of sweat one hot afternoon drip off my forehead when looking over the top of my casting pot, was rewarded with molten lead blown everywher, face, shirt arms, and rest of desk. Made me be more careful than ever on both respects.

[Hang Fire]

Uh, I think the above post, #472 was intended for another thread.

[olaf455]

3. I found, that the best way is to resize the boolits twice - once before and once after polymer coating. First I'm using .355 sizing die set (from CH4D) and after the painting - .356 sizing die set (Lee).

Hope this help.[/QUOTE]

What size does your barrel slug at? In other words how much smaller than your barrels bore diameter is the first sizing? What is the diameter of your bullets after the second sizing?

I am planning to powdercoat some bullets myself, and this information will be quite helpful, thank you in advance.

Olaf

[windwalker]

here in western australia we have a mob called Westcastings Projectiles
i have used there bullets and are the only ones that you can shoot at 2700 fps with the mag ones,they have a agent in the USA here is there web site you will find the usa dealer at the bottom of the page.
Bernie
http://www.rpgfirearms.com.au/WESTCASTINGS.htm

[Hang Fire]

Thanks for the info.

[Wal']

Nobody's asked the question as yet, but whats going to happen to all the home brew lube makers when this hard coat lube takes off.

And believe me, when you get to use them [hard coat lubed boolits] there won't be any going back to old liquid lube.

[Four Fingers of Death]

The coated bullets have pretty much dominated the pistol shooting scene here since the mid 90s,but there are still a lot of guys who cast their own and even some bullet makers who will supply traditional lubed plain lead boolits. Especially popular for blackpowder. The gunshops still seem to sell moulds and we have a custom mould maker that does a roaring trade.

[Wal']

You're right FFOD, but the only reason that there are still a few using the traditional lubes here is that we don't have the population here in Australia to develop a home kit to coat your own cast boolits.

But given a short time in the USofA & once this method of coating boolits with the hard cast lube [read no more sticky fingers] takes off.

I'm sure with the sheer population in USA there will be many backyard DIY designs come on the market for us home casters.

Australia doesn't have the shooting population to develop a home design DIY hard cast luber, but the USofA sure does.

[Four Fingers of Death]

You can buy the same stuff the commercial casters use from Joe Ban in Sydney (he is the only supplier because he developed it himself) if you want. He is happy enough to give you all of the info you need to get er done.

Compared to producing normal lubed cast boolits, it is a huge PITA I feel, but can be done at home if you are into self flagellation, have tons of spare time and don't have enough to keep you occupied.