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Thread: Improving accuracy

  1. #61
    Its been pretty well covered from top to bottom in one way or another. After reading everything a few things I would like to point out. 1st is your eye dominance, are you right handed and right eye dominant? I bring this up because I was a right handed shooter and after being injured in Iraq I had my right hand amputated. After I started going to the range and being dismayed by the results I got a tip that instantly made my grouping get better. I am right eye dominant but now shooting left handed and by putting just a SLIGHT "gangster tilt" I.E. Turning the gun to the right the sight were now inline with my dominant eye. Front sight, is key as well. Another trick I found that has helped is using the top of the sight, not the line or dot on your sights but the actual top of the post. If you are still shooting left and are right handed the pistol Correction chart says that you are now using too little trigger finger. Of course practice, dry fire strength and practice are all key as well but have been covered and will not beat a dead horse anymore. FWIW I am shooting a Glock23 and find it to be a great pistol, since my injury I have had to relearn the basics and done most of my shooting with the 23. One last note as far as .22's go since you have a glock I picked up an ISSC m22 its a .22 glock look alike. While it is hammer fed and does have a safety the feel and trigger are about as close to Glock as youre going to get. Its a bit picky with ammo but still way cheaper than .40, it works for me. Well thats my 2cents worth happy shooting
    "A veteran is someone who wrote a blank check for up and including their life." -anoyomous

  2. #62
    Boolit Master 1bluehorse's Avatar
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    Just as in golf.......grip it and rip it....

  3. #63
    Boolit Master DrCaveman's Avatar
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    I know this thread is old, but being a sticky I thought this was the best place to go.

    I was testing my boolits and loads yesterday, and I was cycling between 3 guns: ruger lcr 38, smith model 19 4", and ruger gp100 6". As the day progressed, my accuracy in EACH gun suffered. Maybe some of this had to do with fatigue, but I am curious how many guns you all shoot during one session, especially when you are testing new loads. I think I may have overwhelmed my scientific sensibilities by opening too many variables. My thinking was that I wanted to see how these loads shot in my three favorite wheel guns, but after a while I was missing the 10" target at 20 yds.

    Is this normal? I know the sights/POI aren't the same for each, but I thought I could switch around and be proficient. Maybe just expecting too much of myself, too early. Lcr has only about 500 rds, gp100 prob just cracked 1000. Who knows with the smith but I've put about 1500 through her.

  4. #64
    Boolit Bub The Amateur's Avatar
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    Hmmm, lots of variables to account for. How accurate are your powder charges? Any leading in the barrels? What is your pulled boolit dia. after loading into your brass? Are you holding your breath? Don't! (I know this sounds bass akwards but, I just breathe normally when shooting pistol. Try it!)

    I shot a 3" group from my .45ACP at 25 yrds. last weekend. Moved target in to 7 yrds. and shot a 1.5" group of 12 shots. My wife's 9mm didn't do too well because of case swaging. I fixed this problem yesterday by modifying the expander die insert on my lathe. It was shooting a 3" group at 7 yrds. and had a bunch of barrel leading. My pulled boolits measured .352"! The bore slugged at .3575" so they must have been bouncing around in there!
    73, KC5CQW

    Hard work usually pays off in the end but... Procrastination pays off right now!

  5. #65
    Boolit Master taminsong's Avatar
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    In IPSC matches, I can't finish a 32rd course, my wrist aches and my trigger fingers seems too heavy to pull the trigger. I noticed it a lot of times. I was using a Ruger GP100 6inch.

    Reading from above, I think exercising my fingers is the solution, but sometimes too lazy to that!

  6. #66
    Boolit Master BCRider's Avatar
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    Taminsong, your mention of your wrists aching after a stage or at the end of the day is the indicator that you are simply holding the gun too hard.

    Ease up with the pressure and replace it with a good "full contact" sort of grip that is simply as hard as what you would use for shaking hands with a good friend. You want to support the gun, not leave impressions in the grips....

    Once you ease up on the pressure on grips you will find that your trigger finger doesn't get as tired. By overly gripping the gun you're tensing all the muscles through your forearm and that is where all the tendons for your fingers pass through. Pressure on the tendon jackets from the overly hard grip will produce that feeling of strain and exhaustion.

    In short "relax and have fun". It sounds cliche but it's the answer to shooting both faster and with greater accuracy at the same time.

  7. #67
    Boolit Master
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    Its been 40 years since I shot in competition, but I entered the sport never having fired a pistol before.

    I learned very quickly that hovering over the bullseye and then squeezing the trigger off, while still hovering was the only way to shoot good. In my first year I was winning in competition with other guys who had shot for years.

    I know that physical strength has a huge benefit in shooting off hand. At the time I was very strong. One of the things I did to strengthen my shoulders was to hold weights out to the side at full length. I could really hold them a long time. I just never got tired.

    Things aren't quite like that anymore :wink and as a result I can't hit a thing. but I thought this might help you younger guys. Oh yeah, I did tons of fry firing too. Makes a big difference.

  8. #68
    Boolit Master Wal''s Avatar
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    What works best for me is first your stance, I have just skimmed through this thread, sure its been mentioned.......what I mean is rather than fight your gun when sighting, try closing your eyes & bring the gun up to your perceived firing position, keep moving yourself around......staying within your shooting bay of course, until you come up on the target centre.

    Then hold on the black & squeeze, the gun should release & punch a hole at least in the black, breathing should take care of itself, & should just come natural.

    Pretty much works for me.


    "Think for yourselves and let others enjoy the privilege to do so too."

  9. #69
    Boolit Master
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wal' View Post
    What works best for me is first your stance, I have just skimmed through this thread, sure its been mentioned.......what I mean is rather than fight your gun when sighting, try closing your eyes & bring the gun up to your perceived firing position, keep moving yourself around......staying within your shooting bay of course, until you come up on the target centre.

    Then hold on the black & squeeze, the gun should release & punch a hole at least in the black, breathing should take care of itself, & should just come natural.

    Pretty much works for me.

    Thanks Wal, Yeah, I will be trying that, soon as I can get the time and ammo around.

  10. #70
    Boolit Master BCRider's Avatar
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    What Wal posted was suggested to me by a long time bullseye shooter. I found that when I did that little setup drill prior to taking gun in hand that my groups shrunk by a noticable amount. This being for one handed bullseye style shooting. For two handed isosclese triangle stances it's pretty much square on.
    Witty saying to be plagarized shortly.....

  11. #71
    Boolit Buddy yoter's Avatar
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    Breathe, focus on the front sight, squeeze the trigger and practice, practice, practice!

  12. #72
    Boolit Master Wal''s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by yoter View Post
    Breathe, focus on the front sight, squeeze the trigger and practice, practice, practice!
    Spot on.


    "Think for yourselves and let others enjoy the privilege to do so too."

  13. #73
    Boolit Mold
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    Two things that I found over the years that helped me, along with all the things mentioned on the first couple of pages, was

    1) To be completely honest with myself. After proving that most of my guns are more accurate than I am, I had to start realizing and fessing up that the problems were with me and to continue to work on my fundamentals. Dry firing is a great way to do this.

    2) A combination of follow through and calling the shot placement before my eye had a chance to see where it hit. Being able to correctly call the shot placement means you are seeing the sight picture when the trigger breaks. Having your eyes open when the trigger breaks and not blinking was covered earlier. You also have to be honest, this forces you to admit you made a mistake which is not a bad thing. After all as long as you learn from your mistakes you are getting better.

    After starting to use these two tips I started to find when I was jerking the trigger and started working on, and am still working, eliminating that.

    Some one mentioned earlier using a few dummy rounds for autos or an empty chamber or two for revolvers, this is a great way to see if you are flinching. I do most of my practice shooting by myself so it is hard to not know which chambers are empty, and I find when shooting my revolver I count the rounds as I fire them and stop when I get to 6. If I stop counting the rounds fired and I don't know when I fire #6 then when I drop the hammer on #7 I sometimes find that I indeed did pull the shot.

    Being afraid of the recoil and or noise can be large contributors also. Again being honest with yourself, are you nervous. If so that is fine, just slowly fire a couple of shots into the back stop or other safe area, and each time think about what you just felt. Did it hurt, are you still in one piece? If it did hurt then you need to consider your grip, stance and even if the caliber is to large and make what ever adjustments are needed to get you comfortable. I found with my wife and kids they were indeed nervous and this helped them calm down a great deal.

    As mentioned before start with close targets and gradually move back. Gradually does not always mean move from 15 to 25 yds. That is all most twice the distance you were shooting at. You may start at 5 then move to 7 then to 10 or if you are doing better than you thought you could move a little farther. The trick is to not move so far as to have your groups open up to much to fast. This causes discouragement and if your not careful you may find you start beating up on yourself and start blaming the equipment you are shooting. A discouraged student is very reluctant to continue to learn at that point. Stop, walk away for a while or even come back in a day or two but do not continue until you have had a chance to calm down.

    These are some of the things I continue to use today to help improve my shooting skills.

    Durwood

  14. #74
    Boolit Master FergusonTO35's Avatar
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    I usually practice with my handguns at a distance of 12-15 feet. If I keep my eye on the front sight I can keep the elevation correct within an inch or so. For the life of me I cannot overcome pulling my shots one to three inches to the left at this distance. The effect is the same with my Glock 19 and 26, S&W 10-5, Ruger Service Six, and Taurus 82. The only help I have found so far are the typical accuracy tricks that apply to any gun: good reloads, changes to the trigger mechanism for better pull, better barrels for the Glocks. These help in the sense that the gun groups tighter but the pull to the left is still there.


    At this point the only thing I can think of is that I need to change my grip and/or trigger pull. My miserable neurological system will not allow me to squeeze the trigger, my trigger finger does not respond to very fine motor skills commands and sometimes even goes numb when I try. Seriously, I can't even do it on my buddy's Remington 700 with 1.2 pound target trigger. A quick, deliberate press is the best I can do. From reading different things online I think maybe changing the way my trigger finger engages the trigger could help. The usual correction target suggests that I am using too much trigger finger. Maybe if I engage the trigger face with the very tip of the finger under the nail as if I am making a guitar chord that could help me pull it straight back. Any other suggestions? Maybe learn to shoot left handed?
    Currently casting and loading: .32 Auto, .380 Auto, .38 Special, 9X19, .357 Magnum, .257 Roberts, .30 WCF, .45-70 Gov't.

  15. #75
    Boolit Master

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    I watched a guy shoot many years ago that totally intrigued me. He was shooting a 45 cal glock with a laser on it at 15 yards and just going around the hole and eating it out as he went. When he got done shooting I asked him how he was able to shoot like that. He said the laser was because his eyesight was going but he learned to shoot in the Marine Corps. He was the captain of the pistol team when he retired. He gave me a few pointers, pretty much all of the comments above. But, the one thing he said that was the most important was shoot, shoot, shoot. I told him that my goal was to be able to shoot as well as him. He told me with practice he knew I could. From that point on I shot an average of 1000 rounds per week. This was in '95. Proper technique and repetition develops muscle memory.

    We saw one another about every weekend at the range and became good friends. He was an investment banker and had some really nice toys! Anyway, long story short, I eventually got to the point that he claimed that I was better than him. I don't necessarily think that's true but I was able to hold my own against him. With him shooting the laser you could really see how steady he was. That dot barely moved on the target. That's good technique and solid muscle memory.

    Practice all that you can afford but also find a mentor. Pick someone that shoots REALLY well. Ask them to evaluate you. You don't want to form bad habits. I instructed for many years later for law enforcement and border patrol. The biggest problems I saw were ego's getting in the way of learning proper technique. Men had a tendency to think that they were born with the innate ability to shoot a gun. My best students have always been female. They don't have an ego, no preconceived notions and they have a much lighter touch. They listen and take instruction well.

    You obviously have the right attitude. With that attitude you WILL get better. Your choice of pistol is fine. The comment about a lighter trigger is valid. Glocks typically came with an 5#, 8# or 12# (NY) trigger back when I bought my first one. I put a 3 1/2# trigger kit in mine. It helped tremendously. When I started competing I went to the 1911 and shoot nothing but since. That's just personal choice. It just fits better in my hand.

    Have fun!

  16. #76
    Boolit Master FergusonTO35's Avatar
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    Thanks. I have the 3.5 connectors in both my pistols, they are too hard for me to even make minute of bad guy accuracy in stock form. I would say I fire around 60 handgun rounds a week. I should probably dust off the Single Six and put alot of .22's down range to build muscle memory and work on my grip. Rimfire ammo is somewhat available here again so I suppose I should take advantage of it.
    Currently casting and loading: .32 Auto, .380 Auto, .38 Special, 9X19, .357 Magnum, .257 Roberts, .30 WCF, .45-70 Gov't.

  17. #77
    Boolit Master FergusonTO35's Avatar
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    Spent some quality time with my Taurus 82 and Glock 26 today. One thing I found that really helps is to rest the trigger guard of the pistol firmly atop the trigger finger of my support hand. This adds alot of stability.
    Currently casting and loading: .32 Auto, .380 Auto, .38 Special, 9X19, .357 Magnum, .257 Roberts, .30 WCF, .45-70 Gov't.

  18. #78
    Boolit Master tazman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by FergusonTO35 View Post
    Spent some quality time with my Taurus 82 and Glock 26 today. One thing I found that really helps is to rest the trigger guard of the pistol firmly atop the trigger finger of my support hand. This adds alot of stability.
    I have found that to be true also. It also helps to counteract my tendency to push the gun to the left when pressing the trigger improperly.

  19. #79
    Boolit Master FergusonTO35's Avatar
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    A little more progress to report. I've been shooting my fixed sight Taurus 82 alot lately. I've found that if I take my left thumb and keep it firmly pressed against my right thumb when firing this counteracts the tendency of my trigger finger to push the muzzle to the left. Was doing a little shooting at 15 feet yesterday and actually bullseyed it a couple of times. Onwards and upwards, hopefully.
    Currently casting and loading: .32 Auto, .380 Auto, .38 Special, 9X19, .357 Magnum, .257 Roberts, .30 WCF, .45-70 Gov't.

  20. #80
    Boolit Master popper's Avatar
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    my tendency to push the gun to the left when pressing the trigger improperly.
    Try firm grip at the front and back of the grip, not the sides. Tips of fingers do NOT have pressure on the grip, else trigger pull will tighten those finger tips and pull left..
    Whatever!

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