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Thread: 12GA FH Slug Tester --

  1. #21
    Hello Ed and All!....Ed, it lookd like you got here before Ole' Dixie Slugs! Greg pointed me this way and said the fellows here were a great group! Looks different than some places we have been, right?
    Anyway, Cissey has your order of .730"-600 grs bullets ready to go and also count what you are/have been getting......seems like they all go out with some extra slugs!
    As you know, all our stuff is tested in the "Bone Box" by John Linebaugh/Todd Corder of Cody. We will be sending some loaded Predator II's (.730"-600 gr. hard cast heat treated hollowbase) out there for testing. The .625"-500 gr loads tested even beyonf expectations.
    It nice to be over here as thse folks will better understand what Big hard cast can do!
    I am still trying to get the webpage updated and get the obsolete stuff off....this is the third and last time I am going to try!
    Capt. Giddens has come abord Ole' Dixie and will be testing long range potential the .625"-500 gr load first. Five shots will cut each other out at our 50 yard range (the longest we have here at the shop) and I will post the results.
    Regards to All.....James@Dixe Slugs
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  2. #22
    Slug Master
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    James-Slugs got here. Easily got 2000 fps with them in
    NEF. They are 600 gr hardened hollwbase slug for smoothbore.
    Cases eject easy.Should get more in NEF(about 2200)as we test
    loads.Ed.

  3. #23
    Ed and All........Those 600 grs bullets are what we load in the Predator II for rifled barrels. I don't advise their used in a smoothbore unless they are shot in a true cylinder barrel......no choke. They are too hard for other chokes!
    However, in a smoothbore barrel that has been customized ........no choke and good sights, the make a awesome load. The balance is correct for point on impact from a smoothbore barrel, but they really shine in a rifled barrel.
    We have tested them up to 1550'/" with Alliant Steel (within acceptable pressure) in our Remington Express 870's/Hasting barrels. In that weight gun, recoil is rather severe. We have established a velocity of 1450'/" as our standard. That velocity is a good balance of velocity/recoil in the average weight hunting gun. The bullet has a BC of .146 in case abyone wants to run up the trajectory on their computor program.
    I am also concerned at some of the speculative velocity fogures that are being posted on some other forums! You and I know our chronos tell the real story!!!!!
    I really think the people on this forum have a real world grasp on what a proper designed hard cast can do on game........others sure don't! Keep up the ggod work!
    Regards to All, James@Dixie Slugs
    Last edited by Dixie Slugs; 08-11-2006 at 09:52 AM.

  4. #24
    Boolit Master
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    hubel458:

    Impressive machine work on those cases.

    I've got a WVa. made barrel toward a .72 cal m/l, but, am hung up on getting the initial stock shaped.

    The bore is: 38:1, .735" x 1 1/8" oct x 38" long and weighs a flat 7 pounds by itself. I also had him cut a foot off it to make a 12" pistol barrel to match for some ungodly off the wall brain fluctuation I had at the time. Beautiful bore's. Also, paid $25 extra per barrel to have them relief bored for loading ease.

    Had a buddy bore out a Lee 1oz 12ga slug mold to .735". I forgot all about grease groove's so it's smooth sided w/rn. Hard cast 1115gr. With a really slick hollow point 1/8" deep x 3/8". The HP was a fluke as I cast the first one's without the sprue plate on, stuck the ProPot's nipple down in the hole and just as it set up, twisted the mold sideways and that formed the hollow point. What ever good a hollow point would do on a 3/4" dia slug I have no idea, but, it looks slick!! hehe!

    Although I haven't made them. Have designed inserts for the base plate of differing thicknesses to make the slug shorter, or longer as desired. The Lee's center cavity set up locates on a ring groove near the bottom of the cavity. These inserts will have that ring to locate them, a center screw to hold them to bottom plates d&T on one side of the blocks bottom.

    I've thought since the bore of the mold is smooth and exactly bore dia, it should be larger by a little bit. That I'd bore some light groove's in the mold's ID kind of like a REAL bullet, only very thin dia so as not to get too big for the bore til it's test fired. Can always enlarge them if needed.

    Ed, IF you'd like to see one of these slugs, they are not very good casting as things were cold, but, you can get the good general idea. Just send your mailing address to my e/mail and I'll send you one to keep and study. It's my own design and I'd like to see the idea used so would be happy to share it. georgeld@hotmail.com

    The barrel maker said to figure a max load for it: 250gr FFg and 1400gr slug. But, to start off light and build up til I can't stand the recoil, and he'd bet I'd be a lot less charge.

    Here's a great link for BIG bore BP's;: www.octobercountry.com

    They make only big m/l's, up to 2 bore, that's half pound round ball.

    Have in mind the finished gun would be around 12-14lbs, stock will be hard Oregon Maple with a butt of 2" x 7 1/2" high and a nice thick pad. IF these things don't tame it down, will load it up with mercury reducers and weight. I talked to the guy that makes them and they've been wanting an excuse to make much larger one's than the 4 -8 oz jobs they supply to Brownell's.

    Hope this gives some more ideas.
    George so I can:

    Gun Control is NOT About Guns!
    It's about CONTROL!
    Join the NRA Today

    Lm: NRA, NAHC, NAFC, N***/WS

  5. #25
    Slug Master
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    George- Thanks -I will give them a look.
    And see if they can be hardened for high
    speed.
    James- Yes I will tell folks that the slugs
    will need straight, no choke bores. I knew that
    and assumed others would, but best to tell them.Ed

  6. #26
    Ed and All.......Another interesting factor on the Dixie Predator II-600 gr bullet......This bullet was also designed, when cast from pure lead, also for use in the Pedersoli Double Muzzleloading .72 cal rifle. Since it is more or less squared, it groups at the regulation of the barrels in that gun. It works like a Minie in the gun when cast from pure lead.
    Capt. Giddens will be testing the bullet at longer ranges in a custom rifled barrel within the next few weeks.
    I see a growing interest in shooter/hunters casting/reloading for their rifled barrels. The Lee Key Slug (one ounce) has been tested and will work very good, if loaded correct, for most hunting situations in both rifled and smoothbore barrels. In rifled barrels the slug works best when cast hard and using a Federal 12S3 wad. Straight wheelweights are plenty good enough in most cases. However, when hunting wild hogs, I suggest they be heat treated. Reloading this Lee Key Slug, the shooter/hunter can keep his cost down and practice more.
    The main thing is to open up another use of cast bullets, besides handguns and rifles.......Regards, Janes@Dixie Slugs
    Dixie Slugs (dixieslugs.com)-Home of the Dixie Terminator

  7. #27
    Slug Master
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    We are getting a big replica 1887 12 ga levergun,
    to test our cases in. Looks like fun.Ed.

  8. #28
    Banned charger 1's Avatar
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    Well I'll be hated for this. But gotta say it. The more boards I see this on the more I think thats pretty much all its good for. The NEF I have Ed that I carry over my shoulder at 5.5 pounds and hurls a .620" 7/8 ounce bluforce at 2060 for one holers at the 100 is not likely to be seen on every board blowing buckets up right beside them,but is very likely to be seen in the field. Like I told you on gunnuts,before internet I plugged a big piece of 1" wall tubing and built a 4" punt gun that mounted in my truck(which used to rock when fired) and splatter a field of geese at 100+ yds. It soon ended up in the scrap. I guess if we'd a had dig cams and forums back then it mighta got a bit more useage,but still ended up in the same place. Welcome just the same. You seem like an intelligent fella....

  9. #29
    Slug Master
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    I just do this for fun. I Don't have time to hunt.
    Would only hunt if the game was such that it needed
    huge power.Just finding what is possible is the
    hobby. Like shooting holes in cars with BMGs, you can't
    eat it, but sure is a blast.Ed

  10. #30
    Banned charger 1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by hubel458
    I just do this for fun. I Don't have time to hunt.
    Would only hunt if the game was such that it needed
    huge power.Just finding what is possible is the
    hobby. Like shooting holes in cars with BMGs, you can't
    eat it, but sure is a blast.Ed
    Everybody needs a hobby

  11. #31
    Boolit Grand Master
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    Yes, welcome aboard Hubel!

    Now, this is just totally cool. I wouldn't want to drag around a 25# deer rifle, but having spent a week shooting Foster and Brennecke slugs out of Rem 870's with 14" and 18" barrels, I think my "leading edge 12 gauge technology" curiosity element got satisfied sufficiently.

    When I feel the need for this sort of entertainment, I just warm up some 45-70 handloads and fetch along the Ruger #1. That cures me.
    I don't paint bullets. I like Black Rifle Coffee. Sacred cows are always fair game. California is to the United States what Syria is to Russia and North Korea is to China/South Korea/Japan--a Hermit Kingdom detached from the real world and led by delusional maniacs, an economic and social basket case sustained by "foreign" aid so as to not lose military bases.

  12. #32
    I think some have overlooked what Ed has accomplsihed with his experiments. I see little difference is seeing how high the envelope can be pushed with hard cast heated slug/bullets in 12 bore......than the same experiments with the huge hand cannons being touted on various forums.
    For one thing......Ed has buried forever the idea that a cast bullet (of proper design) is limited in velocity! He has also proven that a properly loaded 12 bore is only limited to one's recoil tolerance. He has also proved that certain lubes work!
    Ed has bever said he was recommending his work for the hunter.......only showing his results.
    I remember back when a lot of people thought Elmer Keith was nuts!........who needed a handgun for hunting? Times have show changed since then!
    The general publis have no idea of the questions I recieve from various law enforcement groups abour ammo for 12 bore type firearms, hand held and mounted.
    Everything for use one barricades (like cinder block walls) to Fiberglass Dope Boats!
    So........I say to Ed......Kepp going!.........Regards, James@Dixie Slugs
    Dixie Slugs (dixieslugs.com)-Home of the Dixie Terminator

  13. #33
    Boolit Master At Heavens Range 2007 cherok9878's Avatar
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    Just my own personal thoughts.......I think what Ed is doing is interesting. He is taking a process to the very limit of endurance and recording his findings. I can't think of the guy's name, and girl, that flew around the earth nonstop. The plane that was used has brought new ways of building aircraft wings to the fore front.
    There is probably a nich somewhere in law enforcement or the military that Ed's work would fit in nicely. I would still like to be present when that thing is touched off..................larry

  14. #34
    Boolit Master wills's Avatar
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    Dick Rutan and Jeana Yeager
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Burt_Rutan
    Last edited by wills; 08-26-2006 at 01:48 PM.
    Have mercy.
    A haw, haw, haw, haw, a haw.
    A haw, haw, haw

  15. #35
    How true! If there were not those that pushed the envelope, where would we be?
    Of course, I have other reasons to be interested in Ed's work. He has proven beyond a doubt that Dixie's alloy, heat treating, and lube will work far beyond the velocity levels of what we make/ship to our customers. This is of the most utmost importance when dealing with dangerous game.........Dixie's goal in loads!
    Regards, James@Dixie Slugs
    Dixie Slugs (dixieslugs.com)-Home of the Dixie Terminator

  16. #36
    Slug Master
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    Fellow above proved the point. Stating a 7/8 oz at
    over 2000 fps was the thing, but remember for
    years a 1 oz foster at 1200 was all we had,
    in slugs for 12 ga........No one felt threatened by
    increasing performance to 2000 fps with 7/8 oz.Ed

  17. #37
    Boolit Buddy jar-wv's Avatar
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    Can't see much of a NEED for it, but I'm kinda facinated by it, much like the fascination of the guy that climbs skyscrapers with a suction cup. "cause it's there". Also seems like a good opurtunity for Dixie Slugs to get in a bunch of plugs.

    jar

  18. #38
    Banned charger 1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by hubel458
    Fellow above proved the point. Stating a 7/8 oz at
    over 2000 fps was the thing, but remember for
    years a 1 oz foster at 1200 was all we had,
    in slugs for 12 ga........No one felt threatened by
    increasing performance to 2000 fps with 7/8 oz.Ed
    In a useable form

  19. #39
    Slug Master
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    My regular chamber length setup in NEF getting
    600gr at 2000 is easy to use, just add 3
    lead bars to the butt.Comes from factory with
    a steel bar in butt.With our cases much
    better power compared to plastic. And cases can
    be reloaded many times.Ed

  20. #40
    Banned BluesBear's Avatar
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    Since when does NEED matter?

    It's desire that holds the greatest importance?

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Abbreviations used in Reloading

BP Bronze Point IMR Improved Military Rifle PTD Pointed
BR Bench Rest M Magnum RN Round Nose
BT Boat Tail PL Power-Lokt SP Soft Point
C Compressed Charge PR Primer SPCL Soft Point "Core-Lokt"
HP Hollow Point PSPCL Pointed Soft Point "Core Lokt" C.O.L. Cartridge Overall Length
PSP Pointed Soft Point Spz Spitzer Point SBT Spitzer Boat Tail
LRN Lead Round Nose LWC Lead Wad Cutter LSWC Lead Semi Wad Cutter
GC Gas Check