12GA FH Slug Tester --

[hubel458]

I am visiter here. I have the means to test
how good big lead slugs work, as far as leading
barrels and terminal performance.Ed

[cherok9878]

welcome, hubel458, to the hallowed halls of casting. Most everyone here has experience overflowing, (not I). Expand somewhat on your latest endevor!
again..........welcome

[hubel458]

Cherok- Two others and myself over on AR forums developed a
super 12ga Paradox type shotgun/rifle cartridge.We solved the problem of weak brass cases, by putting 12ga rims on bmg
brass, and using cases in couple guns full length.I put
mine in a Savage 210 in picture above, with heavy barrel and stock.We also tested shortened versions in NEF 12ga Ultra
Slug gun and 12ga Encore. Rob one of developers, who had
original idea and gave it the name 12Ga From Hell, has his
on a big Borchardt falling block.In the Savage I can get a hardened Dixie 730 gr slug out at 2700 and a hardened 600
gr out at 3000 fps.Ed

[lar45]

Hi Ed, good to see you over here. Is that 12 FH built on the Savage action? Have you tried it with brass/copper bullets? What kind of pressures is it safe to? I haven't been to the AA big bore forum in awhile to keep up on it.
I believe that there are a few guys here that got 12 bore molds when www.mountianmolds.com was making them.
I tried lathe boreing a 12 bore mold, but didn't get very far. That was before I converted to CNC, but I never got back to it. My thought was to make lube grooves and driving bands in equal steps in a long/deep mold. Then make a base plug that could be moved up and down to make different weight bullets. Also the base plugs could be made for plain base or hollow base.
Here are some cast slugs that came out from 750 grain to over 2000.

They are definatly not pretty. I was getting lots of chatter when boring the mold, but have since tightened up the axis' when I did the CNC conversion.

How much reinforcement of the stock did you have to do?
Looks too cool.
later.

[hubel458]

Lar- yes I used Savage 210 12ga action.Bolt has 3
locking lugs. I calculated what safe bolt thrust
is based on action thickness and hold loads to 35k psi.
Used heavy Pacnor barrel, gun is 25 lbs.Used a heavy weighted
maple stock ,w ith crosspins going through a steel
bedding block and a barrel ring at front of stock.
Tested Bridger 750 gr banded brass slugs to 2500 fps.
Rob got them to 3000 in Borchardt.Here is pic of 3
slugs in cases and bmg case with rim turned off, threaded for
the 12ga rims shown..Ed

[hubel458]

Been testing 600 gr hollowpointe hardened slugs and here
is what one at about 2800 fps does to a 6 gal
pail of water.Ed

[Bucks Owin]

Holey moley!

Now THAT'S "terminal performance"!!!

Dennis

[waksupi]

It hurts, just thinking of touching that one off. I do believe I could develop a serious flinch, shooting that one very much!

[versifier]

At 25lbs, I wonder how much it does kick? I notice there's no recoil pad on it.... Those homemade artillary shells are impressive looking. I bet they'd stop a small imported car. How long are the finished cases? Have you used it on live game?

[hubel458]

Cases are 3.85 inches long. The gun has a thick recoil pad,
proper shaped stock. 25 lbs, and it shoot easy.Haven't used
it on game. Maybe will deer hunt with slugs later.In a little while I will have a bunch
12ga rim pieces to supply those who can take them and
thread the case themselves.Rims are precision made
and if case has original rim turned down and stub
threaded 5/8 by 24, rims go on easy.Just add
loctite.Ed

[cherok9878]

Ed!!!!!Shooting Deer with this round would equate to hunting squirrels with a .458. This thing would probably penetrate "TWO" Elephant lengthwise. You give a whole new meaning to BIG BORE! Knock your self out guy, please keep us informed of your progress. I would love to be present when this thing is touched off!!!

[hubel458]

Got a Nef ultra slug gun using a shortened version of
our case.Got 600 gr hardened slug up to 2000 fps.
Not bad for NEF break action with weight added.
Being some guns need to much work
to fire bmg primers, it easier to
do the following with adapter bushings.
Here is picture of cases for primer
comparisons.1st is regular bmg
primer. 2nd is adapted to a shotgun primer.
3rd is adapted to large rifle primer.
Of the 2 adaptations, large rifle is
easier to do, just ream out pocket, thread in adapter, but adapting shotgun primer
you have to deepen the original primer
pocket a little, then thread and screw in
a bushing.These two primers give about
100 fps less than bmg primer.Ed.

[hubel458]

Anyone wanting to get into 12ga bigbore NEF shooting;
Nef 12ga Ultra slug gun at gunshop $225 US.Add weight to butt and forearm. Get a thicker pad.
Get a box of 10 brass cases from Rocky Mtn Cartridge
for 60 bucks. These cases use shotgun primers, have thick
base like our case, have thick sides to fit chambers
right, No chamber work needed, use as is.
As you fire these cases they work harden, and can go faster.
600gr at 1750 fps possible,at first.. that's 4000 ft lbs.Ed

[guninhand]

Anyone wanting to get into 12ga bigbore Get a box of 10 brass cases from Rocky Mtn Cartridge
for 60 bucks. These cases use shotgun primers, have thick
base like our case, have thick sides to fit chambers
right, No chamber work needed, use as is.
As you fire these cases they work harden, and can go faster.
600gr at 1750 fps possible,at first.. that's 4000 ft lbs.Ed

hubel 458,

I have a fully rifled and magnaported barrel for my Benelli M1. How do you calculate max psi for that gun and the psi of a loaded round? What diameter slug do you use and who sells the mold? Could a Lee or Lyman 12ga mold be opened, and deepened, to get the right diameter and a heavier slug?

Should I go to A15.com big bore section for most complete answers?

[hubel458]

WE figured heavy barreled NEF good for 20,000 psi
slow powder loads. Depending on muzzle thickness of
Benelli maybe 15,000 psi. There is guy in Greece
with Benlli Nova that is doing a heavy alloy barrel
which should take 25,000 psi.Formulas are real long and not simple to write out here.I will be getting some Rocky Mtn cases and get loads developed and chronoed and let folks know what
possibilities their guns have.I use hardened .730 cast
Dixie 600gr slugs. A casting expert I am not. I think molds
can be reamed out if needed.Others here will know
for sure.Ed.

[guninhand]

Looks lik I'd have to stick with loading manual maximums for 3 inch slugs. Tks for reply.

[Buckshot]

.................hubel458, welcome to the board. Yeesh! I wouldn't shoot one of those on a bet. Way cool looking though! So what do you do for fun?

..................Buckshot

[hubel458]

Buchshot-They shoot easy. They have proper weight
and balance..Testing stick powders in NEF, short version of our
case. Case is 3.07 inches long.
Using 600 gr hardened slugs. Got 1700 fps
with 215 gr of RL-25. Cases eject easy.Gun roars,
but is working good... Still tight.Ed

[hubel458]

Testing Savage with long case-Got 2550 with
320gr WC-855H special ball.730 gr slug.
Same slug,
300gr of RL-25 got 2400. 300 gr of RL-22
got 2800. 280 gr of W-760 ball got 2900.
Will hold more 760, but pressures around 40k on last
two loads mentioned.Savage extracts easy,
bellers like a tank gun.Ed

[hubel458]

We are going to test smooth bore slugs, made for that purpose by
Dixie Slugs.And will soon have a replica 1887 lever gun
to test our cases in.Modern forged reciever, able to
take high pressures.Ed