.310 Cadet Reloading 101, part 1

[dhtaxi]

No I havent done that Adam but I have examined the barrel internally with a endascope not sure thats the right spelling. Anyway the bore is very dark with lots of pitting and signs of corrosion. There is very shallow rifling from the throat up to the front barrel band after that the bore is almost smooth.
I examined a 8mm mauser and a smle at the same time the rifling on them was deep and the full lentgh of the barrel.
Going to check the rest of my milsurps when I get time.

[dromia]

"Endascope"?? is that what you use for haemorrhoid hunting?

Does sound b******d though.

Shame you didn't have it when you bought the rifle.

[dhtaxi]

Yep your right they normally use them for peering up your butt or sometimes they shove em down your throat but only after they have been cleaned.
You are right should have had it with me when I bought the cadet.
Im hoping I might find a good barrel somewhere.

[Ricochet]

I'd think relining the barrel's a good possibility with a cartridge like this.

[dhtaxi]

But I have used some internal bore gauges to size the bore I am going to have a play cutting a heel onto some cast bullets in different diameters.
For instance I have a mauser 8mm mold that drops out at .323 if I cut a heel on it.
Well it just might work in the worn cadet I have other molds in different diameters I might try.
I have access to lots of Engineering equipment and some very skilled people who like these little challenges while they are doing this they dont have to actually do any work.

[dromia]

Your still going to need some rifling in the thing though Dave.

[The Double D]

How did I miss this thread? This is my kinda thread. And the .310 Cadet is one of my favorite cartridges. I just wish I had one with me here in South Africa

First the bore has 5 lands and grooves and is damned near impossible to get an accurate measurement of the internal diameter unless the slug is measured in a V block. I found an old gentleman who did this.....his name is O. H. McKeegan as I recall (he has since quit). My bore measured .3178.

It's not as hard as you think to measure odd numbered grooves. Fancy V-blocks not required. To measure slugs with odd number of rifling roll the slug between the slack jaws of your dial calipers. Observe the reading. Do it several times. The reading will repeat. That is your dimension. This is an old millwright trick that has been pooh-poohed numerous times, taken to the tool room to be proved wrong and apologized to several times. At least once here on CB.

I have measured a few bores that others called .317 and they all came out .320/.321.

[The Double D]

I am lubing the slugs with Lee's "liquid alox" which leaves them a bit sticky and helps to hold the cartridge together.

I use my Lubsizer to fill the grease groove. But there is a trick to getting the lube in the groove and not in the heel. And, I learned it on this board some time ago.

Fill the bottom holes in the lube sizer die with lead shot. Use a punch to flatten them so they seal the holes. To lube back the pressure off the pump. Adjust so the lube groove in the bullets align with the top holes of the sizer die. Pull pressure on the lube pump to fill the groove then back off the pressure. It take a bit of adjusting to get the correct alignment and the right pump pressure and back off. Once you get the knack it becomes second nature.

[The Double D]

I had originally ordered the longer cases and found I had to trim them to about 1.00" in order to chamber with the bullets I have (from LTD Cast Bullets, www.customcastbullets.com/) So I ordered the shorter ones @ 1.075 but they will have to be trimmed back as well.

The problemis the LTD bullet is not a .310 Cadet bullet. The driving band is to long and if used in correct length brass in Cadet chambers it will stick in the throat. I talked with Wayne Doudna several years ago and he admits the bullet is not right. I even loaned him my CBE mould so he would make the rigth bullets and he still wouldn't change.



LTD's bullet is on the left. You can see the long cylinder area would extend way up in the throat and into the taper. You have to cut the brass way back to make the LTD bullet fit.

[Bad Ass Wallace]

An interesting addition to my Cadet rifles was to recently buy a Winchester 92 fitted with a new BSA 310 Cadet barrel (unfired).

It still has the original 310 chambering but the gunsmith has silver soldered a couple of small ribs to the loading plate to act as feed guides. Darn thing feeds & functions 6 rounds in rapid fire, flawlessly.

There would seem to be quite a few of these conversions done years ago and may be an option for those with a "spare barrel" and no Martini action

[Kabloona15]

Dear JUMPTRAP and other martini cadet fans: I have a cadet in original 310 caliber, and I am trying to remain faithful to the original rounds for this rifle. But I am having problems seating the cast heeled bullets into the cases - I have bullets from an RCBS 310 mould, and Bertram brass, and a set of RCBS 310 dies. When I seat the bullet into the case the neck expands enough that the finished round will not fit into the rifle chamber. What is the trick for seating the cast bullets and maintaining the proper diameter to chamber properly?

Kabloona

[Kabloona15]

I've load for the 310 for many years and settled on the CBE 120gn .317 bullet which is not a healed base type.

I load 4.5gn AP70 which gives just over 1000fps.

There is another "variation" of the 310 that seldom gets mention, many rifles had the chamber reamed and extractor cut deepened to accept the standard 32/20 Winchester. I've found that so altered you have a case that is parallel sided and about 3mm longer than the .310.

This round can be loaded with 310 dies and fired with 5.5gn AP70 for 1200fps. Apart from the headstamp, folks get excited when I tell them it is a 310 Magnum

BAW: I am curious about this CBE 120gn .317 cast bullet - I assume you are loading these into a standard 310 case, correct? My difficulty has been over expanding the case neck when seating the 310/320 heeled cast bullet. Any tips on how to do this and get a round that will chamber successfully?

Thanks Kabloona

[Bigjohn]

It appears that RCBS has an oversize heel on their boolit which expands the case mouth too much to allow the cartridge to chamber.

As to expanding the case mouth, I use a 'LYMAN' type "M" die in the second stage of reloading, only belling the case mouth very slightly to get the boolit to enter when seating.

Here Downunder we are using mainly CBE moulds and I personally have had no experience with the RCBS mould.

John

[Grey Beard]

Finally managed to obtain all the bit I needed to reload for my mint condition 310 martini BSA
Bertram brass head stamped 310 cadet
ADI powder AP100 6gn
Hawkesburyriver projectiles 122gn round nosed 316 diam leads

this combination gives me a consistant 1250 feet per second and took out the recent ANZAC 310 shoot at my club with a score of 100% at 50m and 90% at 100m for plinking.

[broncobirnbaum]

I have a BSA cadet in 310. All original, good condition. Victoria stamps from 1911. I slugged the bore and rolled the five groove bullet in my digital caliber multiple times. At the smallest it measures 318 and it goes as high as 322. I presume that range is due to my poor method of measurement. I am a black powder shooter, so that kind of loading is easy for me. I have some original 310 shells cases that I got off eBay and some cut and head trimmed 32-20 cases. I use lead tips that I bought from GAD. They measure 326 just above the grease ring. I decap the old primers with a hand made and hand held decapper and a hammer. I have no dies for 310 and no shell holder. I dont resize. I fill the cases with black until the powder will be compressed about 1/8 inch when I seat the bullet. I seat the bullet with my thumb and if it is too hard to push in then I push the bullet into the shell by pressing it into a hole that I carved into the side of my reloading table. The hole does not deform the bullet tip shape. Since the tip is a healed bullet, it naturally stops at the right place and since this is a single shot gun, I dont need a crimp. When I shoot these bullets, I dip the loaded tips into a cup of BP lube and then chamber them into the Aussie Cadet. Accuracy is outstanding and many of my SASS club members enjoy shooting this rifle with me.

I kind of wish that this gun had a bit more oomphf to it when fired. I am a long range Black Powder SASS shooter. I have seen some Cadets rechambered for 32 Special, but that does not excite me since it is a smokeless round. I have just recently heard of a few cadets rechambered for 32-40. Now that is a BP round I can have fun with out to 400 yards on steel plates. Does anyone have experiences with 32-40 Cadets?

Bronco Birnbaum

[Myshot]

I have found that with either the outside lubed bullet or the heeled bullet, I get better accuracy when i put the LOADED ROUND THROUGH the sizing die. This crimps the cae into the bullet like 22 rimfires are crimped. My rifle is a BSA model 8, with a parkerhale peep sight. I have found ADI 2205 does not burn well, and I am trying AS30. 1 1/4-1 1/2 ' groups at 50 yards. I use hawksbury 120 outside lubed and hawksbury 128 grained heeled projectiles in Bertram case which I have never had any problem with.

[mzlldr]

310 Military cartridges . I have recently acquired 200 plus rounds which I would like to shoot and then reload the cases . I believe that the cases are Berdan primed . I want to convert the cases to a standard small rifle primer , if this is possible . Has anyone done this successfully before and , if so , would they be kind enough to advise me how to go about it , please . My reason for wanting to do this is that I want to shoot original ( 310 ) loads in my rifle , but I dont want to pay A $ 90 per 100 for new Bertram cases . All advice and assistance will be greatly appreciated .
Many thanks . mzlldr ( Australia )

[JeffinNZ]

Sell the military cartridges and use the money to buy boxer components.

[303Guy]

I'm with Jeff. Converting collectable milatary cartridges to boxer primers is no longer original loads anyway.

[Four Fingers of Death]

310 Military cartridges . I have recently acquired 200 plus rounds which I would like to shoot and then reload the cases . I believe that the cases are Berdan primed . I want to convert the cases to a standard small rifle primer , if this is possible . Has anyone done this successfully before and , if so , would they be kind enough to advise me how to go about it , please . My reason for wanting to do this is that I want to shoot original ( 310 ) loads in my rifle , but I dont want to pay A $ 90 per 100 for new Bertram cases . All advice and assistance will be greatly appreciated .
Many thanks . mzlldr ( Australia )

The 200 rounds of mil ammo would be worth a lot more than $90. You will get to a point in llife where these sort of projects just don't make sense. jansa Arms and Western Firearms sell the brass and usually in lots of 20 cases. It is dearer than most brass, but a couple of packets of 20 will see you a lot of shooting. Most calibres cost $75 plus for 100, so $90 is reasonable. It will take you a long time to wear them out.