Best .44 boolit for black bear?

[fatelk]

A friend of mine is a wildlife guy, and in the course of his duties has to occasionally dispatch a bear. He wants to load up some good bear medicine, and I told him I'd help with some bullets.

I have molds for 250gr SWC, and a new Lee 310gr mold that I haven't used much yet. For Oregon coast black bear, what's a good slug? Should the boolit be hard or softer for expansion?

I'm not a hunter, and he doesn't really know either. Any ideas?

[Bucks Owin]

A friend of mine is a wildlife guy, and in the course of his duties has to occasionally dispatch a bear. He wants to load up some good bear medicine, and I told him I'd help with some bullets.

I have molds for 250gr SWC, and a new Lee 310gr mold that I haven't used much yet. For Oregon coast black bear, what's a good slug? Should the boolit be hard or softer for expansion?

I'm not a hunter, and he doesn't really know either. Any ideas?

.44 Spl or mag? I'll assume mag, I'd pick 250 for either but the 310 would be good in the mag if accurate. I never had much luck in that regard with the 310 Lee. RCBS 250K was very accurate in my .44 mags....BTW, Expansion isn't especially needed, a long leaky hole is...JMO

[Slow Elk 45/70]

Fatelk, you can't go wrong with the 250 "keith" style semi wadcutter...no problems with black bears...I use 20gr 2400 when I am hunting these critters with a RBH pistol . I like to mix my alloy 50/50...wheel weights and pure lead....they will expand without shattering on bones...usually...nothing is completely fool proof...if you know where the bears vitals are and place the boolit accordingly...Dead Bear...good luck

[randyrat]

I'm betting the 310 will penetrate better than the 250 gr bullet. If it was me i would go HEAVY. Bears die easy and fast with 2 bleeding holes (one in and one out).
Maybe it's like asking which cannon ball would you like to be killed by.

[MrMajestic]

There are a lot of good weights in between those two. I like the LBT design in 270 or 300 grain. What ever makes the prerequisite two holes, one in and one out. For bear I would be more concerned with penetration over expansion especially when you are starting out at .430, oh and your life could depend on it!

[Dale53]

My experience with handguns on big game has been limited to white tail deer. They grow pretty big in Ohio (corn and bean fed). A 250 gr Keith will shoot through a large deer end for end, regardless of what's hit and put a 3/4" permanent wound cavity all the way. I have been in on 35-50 "autopsies" on black bear. The average black bear is not all that large. However, there are some monster blacks that get really large. The Keith is adequate for that job.

However, the Lee C-430-310 RF was designed by Frank Siefer and I for just that purpose (bear hunting). It's super wide meplat and heavy weight kills very well. Several members of our local club, who have shot the Lee bullet extensively, claim that it is the single most accurate bullet they have fired from their .44 Magnums. I have had excellent results with it through two S&W's and one Ruger Red Hawk. At a 100 yards I am able to keep most bullets on a playing card. Some have reported even better results. I limit my use of 300 gr bullets in my Smiths. Extensive use may increase the wear on a Smith. I typically choose the Red Hawk for most of my 300 gr bullets.

Neither is a bad choice for the purpose. If you use the Lee 310, load it as long as the particular revolver will allow you. This results in greater case capacity and will allow you to get the best performance with the least amount of pressure.

FWIW
Dale53

[Blammer]

Here are some to look at for design wise.


IF I were to dispatch a bear from 50 yds and closer, I'd use this one.



OR I'd pick a big heavy with a really big meplat. The Lee 310 is on my top of the heap list. I also have a 280gr really big meplat one not shown, I'd probably pick that one.

My recommendations probably are horrible because I don't hunt bear, but this is what I'd lean towards.

as far as hardness? I'd go with standard WW's air cooled.

[George Tucker]

250 Keith bullet for me, or one of the LBT bullets.

[outdoorfan]

Personally, I'd go with the Lee 310 and drill a HP in it. Make the HP about 2/3 the length of the nose and around .125-.15 in diameter. Alloy would be 50/50ww/soft air-cooled loaded to between 1100-1200 fps.

[fatelk]

Lots of great info, thank you!

I forgot to mention, the gun is a really nice, older model 29. I'm thinking we'll work up some loads with both boolits, and see which shoots better. He's definitely leaning towards the heavier boolit. It sounds ideal for him if it shoots well.

I've always been a model 29 fan (I have three), but I do understand about them not liking the pressure levels that some others can take. Another friend has a Dan Wesson .44 Mag, and I had to be real careful to never shoots the loads that he had worked up for his gun, in my gun. They were fine for his DW, but I once shot a couple in my Smith, and the cylinder kind of jumped backwards or something (wouldn't advance right), and the brass was sticky in the chambers.

I keep my max loads well under book max now, and they work fine.

[trap shooter]

owm moulds are great i like the 310 gr with imr 4227 david moss mould i hunt bear wild boar with ruger super redhawk

[Lloyd Smale]

either will work fine for a black bear.

[1Shirt]

Either would be fine, but if I had my druthers would go with heavy lee.
1Shirt!:

[twotrees]

I cast some of these up out of Lyman #2 alloy. CCI Mag prime,r Rem cases 21 gr of "OLD" 2400.

Complete straight penetration on an old 8 inch dia. Telephone pole (A cutoff from our back stops) Distance 50 yards, Gun Ruger Super SS Blackhawk 7" barrel.

IF I was to bear hunt again, that would be on my hip. I can't think of where I would need more penetration.

Expansion None. Except for the smear on one side of the nose, and rifling marks, I could have loaded it again !!!

Good Shooting,

[jhrosier]

I fired fifty of the Lee 310s over a full load of H110 last weekend, from my 4-5/8" SBH.
Sprained my pinky finger with the pinky-under-grip hold. Took most of the hide off the side of my thumb and got some pretty good brusies on top of my hand from the hammer. It is a real handfull of romp and stomp, even with shooting gloves and a two handed hold.
The good news is that I fired several 1-1/2" five shot groups at twenty five yards.
I wouldn't hesitate to take on a bear with these loads.

I don't think much of it for plinking though.

BTW, This load was not bad to shoot in the 7-1/2" or 10-1/2" SBH. The shorter barrel makes the recoil feel a lot worse. I was curious to see if the load would shoot better in the short barrel than in the longer one, and it did.

Jack

[fredj338]

Unless you are talking huge bears, the 250grLSWC would be enough bullet. Nothing wrong w/ the 310grLFP, but the 250gr will be a bit easier on that nice old M29. I save the 310gr for my RBHH.

[Larry Gibson]

A 250 gr "Keith" SWC cast of WW + lead at 50/50 or 1/20 tin/lead alloy over Keith's favorite load will do very nicely on Oregon BBs out of that M29. I've been there and done that (I am an Oregonian after all )

Larry Gibson

[44man]

One thing missed. What revolver will the boolit be used in?
The larger boolit is not kind to S&W's and the recoil beats them too much and can give a failure when a shot is really needed. Stay at 250 to 265 gr for a S&W.
The Lee 310 is a HAMMER from a SBH, make them hard, expansion will limit penetration. Water dropped WW's work fine.

[fredj338]

One thing missed. What revolver will the boolit be used in?
The larger boolit is not kind to S&W's and the recoil beats them too much and can give a failure when a shot is really needed. Stay at 250 to 265 gr for a S&W.
The Lee 310 is a HAMMER from a SBH, make them hard, expansion will limit penetration. Water dropped WW's work fine.

Exactly the point I made. The 300gr+ bullets are tough on lighter framed M29. If I do shot them, it's at about 1000fps.

[CJR]

Black bears can get big. Here in PA we have the largest black bears in the world. About two years ago, I helped haul out a 500+lber. My buddy put it down with three 308 jacketed HP bullets. When we opened him up, there were no exit holes, only entrance holes. He had a layer of fat, white as snow that was about three inches thick. Another buddy took a 545lb black bear and it required two magazines (8 rounds) of 30/06 to get the job done.

In my last hunting camp we had a 638 lb sow that was regularly drug-darted and weighed by Game Wardens. Likewise, an 800 lber was shot up the road from our camp. Supposedly, the Game Wardens have been drug darting a 900lber., but I can't verify that. While scouting last summer, we kicked out a 500lber, feeding on blueberries, and it had a beautiful coat and wide head. In hunting season he was taken.

The Keith 250 gr. 429421 is an awesome penetrator in a 44Mag. There have been tests done in gelatin blocks where penetration reached 48-52 inches. Likewise, shooting this bullet into water tanks showed it out shot 30/06s and 375 H&H Mags. Years ago, I did some penetration tests by shooting this bullet into a frozen sand bank. After digging in about three feet, I gave up and never did recover one bullet. Though I cast LBT LFN 320 gr. bullets, I always use the 250gr. 429421 in bear country. We've had a couple of hunting camp members get chased by some black bears and it's always nice to have a 44Mag along.

As mentioned sometime before, my standard load is 25 gr. IMR 4227 behind theWW/WQ Keith (a Lyman accuracy load years ago)w/LBT blue lube, sized to 0.4305 inch. It works for me! Once you get a chance to feel some of the muscle/bone structure and ligaments like steel you get a whole new respect for black bears. When they can bite back, there's no such thing as overkill. In my view, penetration is the key and you need to be breaking bones/breaking them down and putting big bleed holes through black bears and forget about shocking power (wide metplat bullets). We had a car hit a black bear in the Poconos and the car was totaled, but the bear just ambled off. So much for shocking power. Likewise, forget about the saying, "black bears are timid". If I'm not mistaken, black bears have killed more humans than any other type bear. Likewise, you're not going to outrun them. They've been clocked at 40 mph.

Best regards,

CJR