Sizing REAL boolit?

[10 ga]

Have cast for ML for a long time. RBs, REAL and miniboolits. Have cast hard RBs and they are nice. Good penetration etc... Now I would like to cast REAL boolits out of alloy and size them down to shoot them PP and shoot with lube. My REAL moulds, 50 and 58, cast the top bands about .013 to .015 oversize with PB. If I cast with alloy(WW for basic start) how much larger will the bands be? Should I size down in 1 or 2 steps, or more? If I have to size down .02 to use PPs is that OK? Am I wasting my time on this project or do you have other suggestions? Being as I already have the molds it seems the best way to go. Thanks, 10 ga

[Buckshot]

Have cast for ML for a long time. RBs, REAL and miniboolits. Have cast hard RBs and they are nice. Good penetration etc... Now I would like to cast REAL boolits out of alloy and size them down to shoot them PP and shoot with lube. My REAL moulds, 50 and 58, cast the top bands about .013 to .015 oversize with PB. If I cast with alloy(WW for basic start) how much larger will the bands be? Should I size down in 1 or 2 steps, or more? If I have to size down .02 to use PPs is that OK? Am I wasting my time on this project or do you have other suggestions? Being as I already have the molds it seems the best way to go. Thanks, 10 ga

............With a 58 caliber mould and going to WW alloy you'll probably gain about .002" if not a tad more. What 58 cal rifle do you have? How deep are the grooves, and how is the bore configured? By that I mean wide lands, narrow grooves, or vice versa, and are the lands and grooves equal width or are the grooves wider?

Whether or not paper patching will be a benefit also depends on the configuration of the bore. If the Lee REAL is casting the dimensions you mention with lead and the WW alloy is about .002" larger you'll be required to size the slug down that total amount (.015" to .017") PLUS the wideth of the paper patch, or minus a thousandth or so. You'd be looking at sizing down .022" to .026" which is a TON.

You'd be miles better for patching by having Mountain Moulds make you a mould to drop a slug that would be correct for paper patching and your rifle's barrel dimensions.

................Buckshot

[Ben-WSU]

Interesting idea.

I thought one reason to use pure lead was so that the hollow base would expand to seal the gas when the powder goes off. Or, am I mistaken and the REAL bullet does this by being oversized to begin with? Are you worried about that? And, will the down sized and/or paper patched bullet give you a good seal when fired? Seems like accuracy might suffer.

It has been 10+ years since I have shot a muzzle loader, and I have never cast anything for one. Just some questions from a NuB.

[Daddyfixit]

I use WW for my 45 cal Ky BP. with my Lee Rifle Engraved At Loading mould. Just lube n load
Super accurate. It takes a little harder wack to get started - not a big deal - then seats just fine

[Salmon-boy]

Completely off topic here, but:

HOLY JESUS Buckshot, how long have you been shooting? I've been here for just over a year reading your posts (and everyone else's') and every day I'm amazed at the knowledge you've squirreled away in that brain of yours...

Not to detract from the wealth of knowledge available from other members, but to quote a certain Dr. McCoy "My God man!".

Really now, I sincerly thank you for providing your experience for those of us who don't know, or don't know better!

[10 ga]

Buckshot, thanks,
I'll slug the guns to see what I'm dealing with. Have 3 50 cal that I use REAL. The 58 is a Cabelas Sporterized Hawken (rubber butt pad instead of cresent plate and black furniture instead of brass). Picked it up at a real good price when Cabelas discontinued their 45 and 58 cal guns. In the boolits the sizing is mostly the top band. Remember they are not all the same size but the top is largest and progressivly smaller til the bottom fits the bore, so it isn't as much sizing as it looks.

Ben WSU, thanks also;
I have used overpowder cards and cookies with REAL boolits for a long time. Use same with minis but fill the hollow base with soft grease. Use a LOT of lube on my patches when shooting patched roundball too. With the Holy Black it's almost impossible to use too much lube. Only a problem if it gets in the powder and you have a problem with the oiled powder not completly burning.

Salmon boy: You are sooooo right. Sometimes I don't actually search a subject or title etc... but what certain posters have posted. Some of these guys have a great wealth of information and I am glad they will share it.
Also thank Al Gore for inventing this internet so we can all connect......HA HA

Best to all, 10 ga

[HammerMTB]

Some thoughts:
You'll almost surely have to make or custom order a sizer to size .50 and .58
That said, why not custom make the mold, and while you do, make it the size you want/need instead of sizing an existing boolit .020"?
Over in the PP section, Yondering has a post where he made a D-reamer to make his own PP mold. I plan to make one for my 45-70.
Once you slug your guns you'll know what size to make your boolits. No need for lube grooves, they are PP. Use a lube wad under if you want to keep the BP carbon soft, as you well know. I cut lube wads from old wool sweaters and lube, then bag them for use when I'm ready. It saves gooping my fingers when shooting.
Now, you'll have to decide which weight you want to build....
Or multiples of them!