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Thread: H&R Handi-Rifle strength?

  1. #21
    Boolit Master peter nap's Avatar
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    Looks like you got the answer Leadman!
    Quick is a walking database.

  2. #22
    Boolit Master

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    Yes, I was correct in my earlier post. Thanks to Quick for confirming this.

    Awhile ago I posted about some problems with data concerning IMR4895 and the 30-30 in the IMR pamplets. My friend used a pamplet that showed too hot a load (35grs.)but he continued to fire it. The primer made a depression in the breechface and closed up the hole for the firing pin enough that the pin would not retract. Basically the gun is ruined. This was an older H&R combo gun, 30-30 & 20 gauge with snap on forend. It was a nice gun, was mine at one time.

    What would a 270 or a 280 due to a cast iron reciever?
    Last edited by leadman; 01-19-2010 at 12:39 AM.

  3. #23
    Boolit Master

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    I think bolt thrust is what you need to worry about. A 12 gauge has around 6,000 pounds of bolt thrust. A 308 is closer to 8,000 pounds. Figure it like hydraulics, area of cartridge just in front of the rim times chamber pressure. The old cast iron frames will work with most black powder cartridges because of the lower pressure. The 223, while having high pressure, has a small area. If hand loads are hot enough to flatten primers then a cast iron frame will be damaged.

  4. #24
    My nephew has one. Very accurate, neat little gun. It will not extract ammo with steel cases. Other than that, not a bit of problem.
    Be careful, the toes you step on today may be attached to the butt you have to kiss tomorrow.

  5. #25
    Boolit Master JIMinPHX's Avatar
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    I got my .223 Handi a long time ago. It didn't come with any warning against using military ammo. That thing ate a steady diet of Nato headstamp ammo for years. I've never had a problem with it, except that it doesn't shoot accurately with ammo heavier than 55 grain. The green tip stuff goes through the paper sideways at 50 feet. Mine came with a 1:12 twist barrel. Some later ones came with 1:9. As long as the breach is closed up good & tight, she is a good strong rifle. I hear that the newer ones come with a warning against using military ammo. I don't know if they changed the rifles, or if they just changed lawyers.
    “an armed society is a polite society.”
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  6. #26
    Boolit Master
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    I stand corrected

    I swear I read in there somewhere that you shouldn't use military ammo. I must have been dreaming.

    Anyway, you can download a manual here for your new rifle if you don't have one already:

    http://www.hr1871.com/documents/manu...FLE_MANUAL.pdf

    Chris.

  7. #27
    Boolit Mold Fieldmaster's Avatar
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    Where is this information on Greyberd I have been trying to find this all this info about my H&R Shikari 45-70gov frame swap plus the other info on H&R/NEF rifles where exactly is it could someone give me a link to lt please

  8. #28
    Boolit Master
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    Try: www.go2gbo.com and scroll down to the NEF/Handi Rifle forum. In the FAQ you will find tons of info, plus sign on and the members are more than willing to help out. I'm too lazy to scroll back to the post concerning a rechamber of a .44Mag Shikari to .445SM, but it is not the best idea. That model has the old cast iron frame, in addition the barrel lug is silver soldered on. It may last forever with reasonable loads, maybe not, don't want to find out. My recently purchased .44M came on the SB1 frame, I rechambered to .445SM but only shoot those with the barrel installed on an SB2 frame. GW
    "If you can walk with crowds and keep your virtue,
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    And, which is more, you'll be a man my son!" R. Kipling

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  9. #29
    Boolit Master
    troyboy's Avatar
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    445 Sm at published load data is a non issue.
    "It is better to die on your feet than to live on your knees" Looking for an RCBS Ammomaster and H&R shotgun barrels regardless of condition

  10. #30
    Boolit Master
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    Quote Originally Posted by kbstenberg View Post
    I would like to ask a question. But please dont bite. Why do all of you like the Handy Rifle? The consept is good but i find the weight rediculous. Most bolt guns dont weigh that much.
    Kevin
    Not all HandiRifles weigh the same. I have a 30-30 and it is very light, my 243 is pretty light too. It all depends on the barrel contour and length.

    Tim
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  11. #31
    Boolit Master
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    Peter Nap, which hammer would I need to go get from Numrich to get rid of the transfer bar in my 2 Handi rifles?

  12. #32
    Boolit Master

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    Did we really just resurrect a thread that had died almost 5 years ago? That's what I call making good use of the search function!

  13. #33
    Boolit Bub
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    I'd be interested in any help/hints of a trigger job on my Handi-Rifles. I have an older "Topper" in .30-30 and a newer (15 years old) .357Rem Max. Both are capable of excellent minute-of-head-shot-deer accuracy, but the danged trigger pull is 8 miles of dirt road. I have had some issues with light strikes on the primer too, never knew it was a common (or at least known) issue with the transfer bar and trigger control.

  14. #34
    Boolit Master
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    All of my Handis have been changed from ejector to extractor, I AM a hand loader and HATE hunting brass.
    It is a 10 minute job to convert ejector to extractor, there are pictures on the forums,I have posted one at least twice.
    My bull barrel .223 has the later 1/9 twist and have no problem with 63 and 70 gr bullets.
    I do shoot mostly the Lee bator 53gr gc.
    drinks, NRA life, TSRA life, SAF life, CCRKBA, GOA, JPFO, CBA, Def-Con.

  15. #35
    Boolit Master GhostHawk's Avatar
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    First, Graybeard outdoors seems to be the home for all things Handi.

    http://www.go2gbo.com/forums/hr-centerfire-rifles/

    Look in the FAQ section.
    There is LOADS to be read and learn there.

    I recently bought a 2004 built Ultra in .223, before I sent the action back to the factory to be fitted for a couple more barrels I did a quick look at the trigger.
    It wasn't what I would call a bad trigger, I'd say in the 4.5 to 5lb range. No I don't have a gauge but I do have a pretty accurate trigger finger.

    With the barrel set off to the side I decided to try one of the methods described in the FAQ. Putting forward pressure on the hammer, (But also being ready to catch it so it didn't slam into the frame) I pulled the trigger.

    Each time I did this I could feel it getting smoother and lighter. I may have done this 8-10 times total. I would recomend testing often, it is I think easy to get too light.

    I have now what I'd guess is a 2.75 to 3lb trigger, just about right IMO. Some guys do like them lighter, but I'll leave it here until I've had a chance to shoot it more.

    I would also take an emtpy case, minus primer, and fill it with hot melt glue, or melt down a bottle cap and drop it into the primer hole.
    I've made a few of these and they seem to work great for home made snap caps.

    I would use this every 2-3 times to test trigger pull. Shouldering the gun with barrel on, off hand on the forearm and no hand on the hammer makes a big difference in how it "feels".

    I got mine just about 1 time lighter than I should have I think.
    It certainly changed the pull quickly and easily. But very easy I think to go to far unless you test often.

  16. #36
    Boolit Master

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    Quote Originally Posted by GhostHawk View Post
    ... But very easy I think to go to far unless you test often.
    the trigger engagement on handi's is only surface hardened, and i also do the "almost dry fire" trigger smooth out (with some powdered graphite), which is why i have an extra handi hammer and trigger on hand, just in case.

  17. #37
    Boolit Mold
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    Quote Originally Posted by XWrench3 View Post
    i own a handi-rifle that is chambered in 223 remington. it is a bull barrel model. i inherited this gun with no paperwork, so it is not like i did a bunch of investagation before buying it. before i get myself in trouble with it, i figured i would ask a couple of questions. since it is a bull barrel, i would think that it would be fine to use N.A.T.O. military rounds in it, am i correct? also, again, since it is a bull barrel, i would think that loading near the top of the PUBLISHED load data would be ok, of course watching for pressure signs like normal. again, am i correct? i guess, i am assuming that there is more steel all the way around the full length of the barrel, thus it sould be stronger. maybe i am mistaken? i would also asume that since the "frame" of this is used all the way up to a 45/70, i shouldnt have to worry about that part of it with a 223. one last thing, anybody know what twist rate this thing has? i tried the tight patch thing, and it looks like ABOUT a 1 in 12, but i am not real sure. i got a couple of different readings, depending on how "tight" the patches were.
    I wouldn't recommend shooting 5.56 nato ammo out of it. They are slightly different and loaded hotter. You can shoot .223 from a 5.56 but not the other way around. If you reload you can use 5.56 brass if you run it through a .223 die and use .223 rem load data. The handi rifles also don't tend to like max loads i would start a grain or two under max. I just scored in .500 S&W and some dies, hopefully one day i will be able to afford some brass and bullets. Lol

  18. #38
    Boolit Master
    Tom W.'s Avatar
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    An old thread for sure. I have ( or Had ) two, a 30/30 and a .270
    I Will suggest that you keep a close eye on the length of your brass, as ( at least in my .270 ) the brass had plenty of room to stretch. I also couldn't load a decent handload that would surpass the cheap WalMart Remington factory loads. I don't know , or at least remember, where my .270 wandered off to. I believe it's at my son's house, sitting in his safe.
    The first 11 shots on game with the .270 resulted in 11 dead deer, without having to look for them....
    I never killed anything with the 30/30 but targets, altho my youngest son has harvested quite a few with it....
    Tom
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  19. #39
    Boolit Bub
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    I have a number of H&R/NEF rifles. All shoot very well with standard loads, but a 22 Hornet barrel I picked up used does like to hold on to the brass most times. Expect I should polish the chamber a little. Didn't know about the extractor conversion. Will have to look that one up.
    Do have one of the last Rem built .500 S&W's that I haven't shot yet. Picked it up fairly cheap at a gun show. Barrel looks as big as a 20 gauge. Maybe people thought it was a shotgun!

  20. #40
    Boolit Master
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    NATO rounds are not loaded hotter. Their pressures are tested using a different protocol. Pressures are taken with different equipment and measured at different locations on the case. This affects the difference in the numbers.

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Abbreviations used in Reloading

BP Bronze Point IMR Improved Military Rifle PTD Pointed
BR Bench Rest M Magnum RN Round Nose
BT Boat Tail PL Power-Lokt SP Soft Point
C Compressed Charge PR Primer SPCL Soft Point "Core-Lokt"
HP Hollow Point PSPCL Pointed Soft Point "Core Lokt" C.O.L. Cartridge Overall Length
PSP Pointed Soft Point Spz Spitzer Point SBT Spitzer Boat Tail
LRN Lead Round Nose LWC Lead Wad Cutter LSWC Lead Semi Wad Cutter
GC Gas Check