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Thread: 9mm Hornady "Critical Defense Ammo"

  1. #1
    Boolit Master
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    9mm Hornady "Critical Defense Ammo"

    I have NO IDEA where this goes on this forum...please, someone put it where it will be read.

    I read on another forum that 9mm "Critical Defense" ammo was experiencing "Failure To Fire"...I carry a Walther PPS 9X19 pistol loaded with that ammo(at least prior to today)....I went outside to the range, and shot all 15 of the rounds that I had been carrying with that pistol...ALL FIRED.(One 8 and one 7 round magazine)

    I then went to the ammo locker, and took out the remaining 120 rounds of Hornady "Critical Defense" 9X19 ammo with the same 115 grain FTX bullets. I loaded them in the Walther Magazines, and attempted to fire them. I had 38 out of 120 rounds fail to fire!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    I put those same 38 rounds that failed to fire in pistols of different manufacture...CZ, Browning, Glock, Colt, Kahr, Rorhbaugh, Springfield, etc.. They still would not fire, after repeated hits from all of those firiing pins from different pistols.

    Hornady "Critical Defense" ammo is over $1.00 a shot(after taxes).......I would expect better from them for that price.


    Mike

  2. #2
    Boolit Master Ricochet's Avatar
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    Smile

    That's scary, especially given the name of it!
    "A cheerful heart is good medicine."

  3. #3
    I'm A Honcho! SPRINGFIELDM141972's Avatar
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    I believe I would be contacting Hornady and expressing my extreme unhappiness. That kind of failure rate is unacceptable in self defense ammunition. I would imagine they would like the rounds back for examination.

    Regards,
    Everett

  4. #4
    Boolit Master
    lwknight's Avatar
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    Eventually the anti-gun people will push lead free primers to a standard. The lead free primers could also be desighned to be self destructing after about a year. And already are less reliable than what has been on the market.
    That way, the amount of ammo anyone has can be controlled.
    Another reason to stock up.

    This thought is worth what you paid for it. Money back guarantee.
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  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by lwknight View Post
    Eventually the anti-gun people will push lead free primers to a standard. The lead free primers could also be desighned to be self destructing after about a year. And already are less reliable than what has been on the market.
    That way, the amount of ammo anyone has can be controlled.
    Another reason to stock up.

    This thought is worth what you paid for it. Money back guarantee.
    Ummmm, no.

    Chemicals just do not "go" inert after a set amount of time.

  6. #6
    Boolit Master GabbyM's Avatar
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    Your life is in the hands of a low cost bidder.

  7. #7
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    Lowest bidder? Who's bidding? This isn't military ammo.

    Anyway, ONE Failure to fire in self defense ammo is absolutely unacceptable.
    "I have enough ammo and guns to shoot my way into Nevada." - California resident.

  8. #8
    Boolit Master blaster's Avatar
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    Quote:
    Originally Posted by lwknight
    Eventually the anti-gun people will push lead free primers to a standard. The lead free primers could also be desighned to be self destructing after about a year. And already are less reliable than what has been on the market.
    That way, the amount of ammo anyone has can be controlled.
    Another reason to stock up.

    This thought is worth what you paid for it. Money back guarantee.

    Ummmm, no.

    Chemicals just do not "go" inert after a set amount of time.

    Ummm, yes.

    Chemicals can and do "go" inert after a period of time. Unless of course you can store them without the presence of any other atoms, high energy particles, gravitational energy, thermal energy, electromagnetic energy, mechanical energy, etc. (an impossible task here on earth). In the case of lead free pimers there are several ways that they can loose reactivity. Many contain Barium nitrate (or allied compounds) and zinc. Zinc can react with the oxygen present if the shell or chemically available thereby at least partially compromising its usefullness as a reducing agent. Mag tech claims a 10 year shelf life on their lead free ammunition http://www.magtechammunition.com/docs/MSDS2.pdf.

  9. #9
    Boolit Master


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    And I suggest to everyone to NEVER buy lead free.

    At least that way they wont want to manufacture them. Not profitable.
    "I have enough ammo and guns to shoot my way into Nevada." - California resident.

  10. #10
    Boolit Master

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    Quote Originally Posted by GabbyM View Post
    Your life is in the hands of a low cost bidder.
    In this case it is not so low a cost. Something with the Hornady name on it should deliver 100% performance.

    Shiloh
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  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by blaster View Post
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by lwknight
    Eventually the anti-gun people will push lead free primers to a standard. The lead free primers could also be desighned to be self destructing after about a year. And already are less reliable than what has been on the market.
    That way, the amount of ammo anyone has can be controlled.
    Another reason to stock up.

    This thought is worth what you paid for it. Money back guarantee.

    Ummmm, no.

    Chemicals just do not "go" inert after a set amount of time.

    Ummm, yes.

    Chemicals can and do "go" inert after a period of time. Unless of course you can store them without the presence of any other atoms, high energy particles, gravitational energy, thermal energy, electromagnetic energy, mechanical energy, etc. (an impossible task here on earth). In the case of lead free pimers there are several ways that they can loose reactivity. Many contain Barium nitrate (or allied compounds) and zinc. Zinc can react with the oxygen present if the shell or chemically available thereby at least partially compromising its usefullness as a reducing agent. Mag tech claims a 10 year shelf life on their lead free ammunition http://www.magtechammunition.com/docs/MSDS2.pdf.
    I can tell you with 100% assurity that the Primers I'm currently firing are older than me(35) and every one has gone BANG so far. These were received in an Estate sale 4 years ago, and stored under unknown conditions.

    The Ammo makers themselves have said that "time sensitive" primers are unable to be made.

  12. #12
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    When I decided on a self defense cartridge (45 acp 3" barrel) I tried Hornady and Winchester along with a couple of others. The best performance over a chronograph was some stuff made by Taurus the pistol folks from Brazil. It has PMC nickle plated brass, Barnes solid copper flying ashtrays of 185 grains and some powder from Hodgdon along with WLP primers. The box even lists the components. Average is 950 fps out of 3" carry pistol and a bit over 1000 fps out of my 1911s and XD. Once chosen I laid in nearly a thousand rounds of this stuff and as I only shoot ten a month or less I'm good to go. I find it for sale once in a while on Cheaper than dirt and Sportsmans guide for less than fifteen bucks a box and will probably order some more just to play with it. In all I've fired about three hundred rounds of this stuff and never had a failure to go bang. The hornady and winchester just didn't make it past the chronograph tests.
    Marty-hiding out in the hills.

  13. #13
    Boolit Master
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    They tried green ammunition during the Clinton years (that was a big contributing factor to the first Great Primer Famine) and found out it wasn't worth it. The ammo was unreliable and it didn't last long on the shelf. Conspiracy theorists knew the Zionist Occupation Government was developing junk ammuntion for the masses and keeping the good stuff for the UN troops who would soon place the US under martial law.... or something like that. Anyway, even Al Gore eventually had to give up on the idea.
    Warning: I know Judo. If you force me to prove it I'll shoot you.

  14. #14
    Boolit Master blaster's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Storydude View Post
    I can tell you with 100% assurity that the Primers I'm currently firing are older than me(35) and every one has gone BANG so far. These were received in an Estate sale 4 years ago, and stored under unknown conditions.

    The Ammo makers themselves have said that "time sensitive" primers are unable to be made.
    I'm not arguing that primers can't last a long long time. The point of the above comment was to demonstrate that the lead free are untested for true longevity. They have only been on the marked since the late 1990's. Given that yours are 35 years old they were made with compounds in use since circa 1830. I can however tell you with 100% assurity that no priming compound can last forever. Thus chemical degredation sensitive primers are always made. If you dont believe me keep some of those primers forever and test them.

  15. #15
    Boolit Master
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    Anything can be designed to go inert after a set time. Especially plastics. And certain types of plastics can be used as primers.
    Sent from my PC with a keyboard and camera on it with internet too.
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  16. #16
    Boolit Master
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    Failure by design. Old primers may stay good for a hundred more years. I have ammo loaded myself in 1980 and its all still good. I have new Magtech and CCI primers that have FTFs in like 2 percent.
    If your refrigerator is 20 years old, it may last another 20 years.
    If you bought it in the last 10 years, prepare to buy a new one soon.
    That my friend is by design.
    Lead free primers are not old nough to know how long they last. Why do you think that all LEO agencies do not carry ammo that is over 1 year old? I mean not even stored in a controlled atmosphere.
    If you have pre Y2K primers, cherish them. I have had no misfires with Remington primers made 2 years ago.
    Sent from my PC with a keyboard and camera on it with internet too.
    Melting Stuff is FUN!
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  17. #17
    Boolit Master



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    Buy all the Wolf primers you can get your hands on. They're made in Mother Russia with good old fashioned components.
    Marty-hiding out in the hills.

  18. #18
    Boolit Master sheepdog's Avatar
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    This is why I use Corbon DPX.

  19. #19
    Boolit Master Ricochet's Avatar
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    Smile

    Primers that are unreliable and will go bad after a while certainly can be made and have been. That's why we don't have mercury fulminate primers anymore, they deteriorate quite rapidly in warm and humid storage conditions. But designing them to predictably go bad after some set period of time would be very difficult, practically impossible considering the wide range of conditions they may be stored and used in.
    "A cheerful heart is good medicine."

  20. #20
    Boolit Master fredj338's Avatar
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    THis just reinforces the need to test your carry ammo, at least one full mag from each carry mag. Sure, anything can happen, bu that would certainly be a minimum before trusting your life to it.

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