would you rebuild using a drill receiver (03a3)

[ENFIELD303]

I just spent a ton of money on surplus new G.I. replacement parts to build using a cleaned up drill receiver but am getting some mixed results, some say yes and some say no and some even say they already built, shot and stand by them.

what do you guys think?

[Storydude]

Are you heat-treating the rec. again?

[ENFIELD303]

Are you heat-treating the rec. again?

nope, got nothing to do it with

[Storydude]

Way I look at it?

It was turned into Drill duty for a reason.

[JeffinNZ]

Way I look at it?

It was turned into Drill duty for a reason.

Yes and no. I have a SMLE that was marked DP (drill purpose) when I got it and it is absolutely fine. Sometimes rifles become DP as they are obselete. I know of a large number of No4 Lee Enfields about to come up for disposal that have NEVER been fired but are DP. They were in storage when NZ converted to the FAL and have been DP ever since. Plan to get me one of them.

[NoDakJak]

Personally I would use it. When I attended Gunsmith School in the dim, dark past we were informed that the steel in the O3A3 was completely different than that used in the earlier Springfields and was similar to that used in the Model 70 Winchester. I certainly would not have it reheat treated unless it has been annealed for soe reason. I have built a half dozen sporters on the O3A3 and the steel is tough to drill and tap. Definetly drill and tap it before you barrel it. That way you don't have a blind hole to work with. Use a carbon steel tap rather than a high speed steel tap. If you break a tap (likely) you won't have a blind hole to work with. we were taught that a sharp blow could shatter a carbon tap but i have never had any luck with that. The bottom of the hole can be plugged with modeling clay and the hole filled with Coca Cola. Two or three doses of this is supposed to eat the sharp edges off the tap and allow it's easy extraction. Maybe!!!! I have always been too pressed for time to try this. The quick and dirty way is to use the smallest welding tip and melt and then blow the tap from the hole. You can not do that in a blind hole. I love Springfield Sporters but have to admit that Mausers are probably stronger and easier to work on. I have built several dozen of them. I still think that the Springfield builds into a beautiful rifle though. Neil

[ENFIELD303]

Personally I would use it. When I attended Gunsmith School in the dim, dark past we were informed that the steel in the O3A3 was completely different than that used in the earlier Springfields and was similar to that used in the Model 70 Winchester. I certainly would not have it reheat treated unless it has been annealed for soe reason. I have built a half dozen sporters on the O3A3 and the steel is tough to drill and tap. Definetly drill and tap it before you barrel it. That way you don't have a blind hole to work with. Use a carbon steel tap rather than a high speed steel tap. If you break a tap (likely) you won't have a blind hole to work with. we were taught that a sharp blow could shatter a carbon tap but i have never had any luck with that. The bottom of the hole can be plugged with modeling clay and the hole filled with Coca Cola. Two or three doses of this is supposed to eat the sharp edges off the tap and allow it's easy extraction. Maybe!!!! I have always been too pressed for time to try this. The quick and dirty way is to use the smallest welding tip and melt and then blow the tap from the hole. You can not do that in a blind hole. I love Springfield Sporters but have to admit that Mausers are probably stronger and easier to work on. I have built several dozen of them. I still think that the Springfield builds into a beautiful rifle though. Neil

yeah but were they drill rifles you did work on?

[Bob S]

"would you rebuild using a drill receiver (03a3)"?

No.

Ask Kirk Paradise about his experieince with one. If he had not caught the stretch or set-back when he did, it would have failed in the same manner as your Nat'l Ord.

Resp'y,
Bob S.

[jonk]

Most of these had the barrels plugged and welded, and had the mag cut offs welded to the receiver. All this transferred high amounts of heat to the receiver, ruining the heat treatment.

Ergo unless you have the facility to evenly and reliably re-treat the receiver, no I woudln't do it. Even then re-treatment is spotty at best.

[ENFIELD303]

Most of these had the barrels plugged and welded, and had the mag cut offs welded to the receiver. All this transferred high amounts of heat to the receiver, ruining the heat treatment.

Ergo unless you have the facility to evenly and reliably re-treat the receiver, no I woudln't do it. Even then re-treatment is spotty at best.

yeah i'll just scap the receiver and use the parts.

btw, my mother in law lives in chardon, right down the road from your area. small world lol

[Bret4207]

There are drill rifles and Drill Rifles. I have seen former American Legion parade rifles referred to as "drill rifles" and I've seen the ones with welded barrels and bolts. (I've also seen another type of "drill" rifle and those have 37 scope mount holes drilled in them, but that's another story) IMO I'd want to determine exactly what you had. I wouldn't hesitate to use an old Legion rifle, but wouldn't use one that had been de-milled. As another poster said, any welding and I'd pass it up.

[mike in co]

welll....i just purchased a reworked drill rcvr. i agree with welding having the posibilities of lots of heat, but the recvr i have had very little actual welding. the bbl to rcvr weld was a very small tack weld...no penetration to the threads. this is the working end of the rcvr( a bbl still threads in and out smoothly). there is more welding at the cutoff, but again not large, and up high away from the working end.

i have no issues with my rcvr...your milage may vary.

mike in co

[TAWILDCATT]

arc welding only carries a short way.I have a garand carbine.and there are many out there.this was cut in two and welded back together.I checked with rock island arsenal,the gov arsenal.and they told me not to reheat after I had it annealed.as garands had surface case hardning.it is an excellent shooter.shoots 308.

[35 Whelen]

I have an 03A3 that is a former drill rifle (with a NOS barrel installed)and I have had zero problems with it. Granted, I've fired almost no jacketed loads in it. I've seen the cut-off welds on these receivers and can see where mine was welded. I've been welding off and on for nigh-on 30 years and can say with certainty that a weld such as those I've seen on the bolt cut-offs could hardly affect the heat treating of the receiver especially given the distance from the cut-off weld to the area of the receiver where the bolt lugs lock in. There's just not enough weld there. As far as the rod welded in the barrel, is it welded at the muzzle or the chamber end? Even if at the chamber end, I cannot imagine it being possible to get enough of a weld up in there to cause excessive heating of the receiver.
35W

[Bob S]

The weld at the cut-off is not an issue. The barrels were welded to the receiver ring at the bottom. The welding was probably done by apprentices for training, since it was non-structural. The only purpose for this weld was to ensure that the receiver could never be used again. The welds I have examined vary from a single tiny cold lap (which is probably not destructive), to massive blobs, to huge puddles with undercut that looks like too much current and too slow wire feed. In about 99% of the cases I have seen, the HAZ in the receiver ring was big enough to be destructive ... and that's exactly what was intended when the rifles were DEMILLED.

There are those out there who will sell you a "remanufactured" drill rifle and not bother to tell you what it is; there are some that will sell you the same rifle, and try to bamboozle you into thinking "it's OK". Some of those guys will even stamp your repro stock set with repro stamps. It's scary. Be careful out there ......

Resp'y,
Bob S.

[35 Whelen]

As always, thanks for the informative post, Bob. After reading your post I disassembled my rifle and checked the underside of the receiver. There was a remnant of a weld that extended back on the receiver ring maybe 1/8" and was no more than 3/8" wide. It was a very light, poor weld and didn't appear to have penetrated the receiver much at all. There was no undercutting either.
35W

[Bob S]

As long as you know what to look for, and you're comfortable with it. I would recommend frequent checks with headspace gauges after firing with service-equivalent ammunition to assure that the receiver has not been annealed enough to stretch or allow the bolt lugs to set back into the locking shoulders. I know of one aquaintnece that has (had) a rebuilt drill rifle that streched sufficificiently to accept a Field Gauge after a relatively small number of "service" cartridges were fired. Had he not caught this, more and more of the case head would be unsupported until a cartridge case would rupture and wreak havoc upon the rifle and the shooter ... as the originator of this thread unfortunatley discovered the hard way. (Slightly different issue, commercial cast receiver that had been annealed prior to drilling and tapping for scope mount ... end result was the same. )

Since this is a "cast bullet" board, it's probably appropriate to say that such a too-soft action would probably last indefinitely with very light cast loads (as long as nothing is double charged), but that should not justify continued use. When the current owner is gone, the rifle will likely pass to someone who will shoot it with service ammunition, or worse, stiff jacketed-bullet reloads ... and eventually have an accident.

Just my two cents.

Resp'y,
Bob S.