Is CCI Standard Velocity enough for Smallbore Lever Action Silhouette

[pdgoutdoors]

The question is in the title. I see alot of people at the local matches shooting mini mags for the extra velocity, so I do the same as a newbie but is it really necessary? My rifle shoots .75" at 50 with CCI standard and about an inch with mini mag target. I would rather take the extra accuracy but not if it will not knock em down.

[NSB]

If you’re shooting rimfire sized silhouettes any std velocity will knock them over. I shot rimfire silhouette for years and it was very rare to hit a target that didn’t go over. Any full bullet impact would take them down. If you’re shooting center fire field pistol targets, sometimes the rams won’t go over, but that’s true even with high velocity .22lr rimfire. Take the accuracy every time.

[Kestrel4k]

and don't forget to complain that some of your targets "weren't going down 'last weekend'";
that way the others will stick with their less-accurate Minimags, lol.

[Bigslug]

I don't know the rules of the game or distances involved, but something else to think on:

While you probably know the distances and will eventually figure out the elevation corrections for your trajectory, a faster round that might not be blown around in a crosswind as much may offer a practical advantage over a slower match round that's only slightly more accurate. Also consider a slower round spends a little more time in the barrel while you're wobbling around on target. If the ammo groups smaller than your smallest target when the rifle is benched on sandbags, the human factor of hitting that target offhand is going to be the far bigger challenge. No sense in spending for the high-grade ammo if Thunderbolts will do (and they very well might).

[Finster101]

My experience with Thunderbolts is they might work IF and that is a big IF they go off.

[high standard 40]

My experience with Thunderbolts is they might work IF and that is a big IF they go off.

I call those Thunderduds

[Bigslug]

My experience with Thunderbolts is they might work IF and that is a big IF they go off.

I shall HAPPILY take all of yours. To the point of the OP's topic, it's a bulk-box round that will reliably knock over empty 12 gauge hulls for me at 50 yards. Have had good luck with CCI Blazer as well. There is a time and a place for the additional Q.C. that goes into the true "match grade" stuff - like when you're strapped up in jacket and sling shooting International Small Bore targets on which the X-ring is smaller than the diameter of your bullet. That may not be required of the LARF game.

When I shot a .308 bolt gun in Highpower, I used discounted pull-down 147 grain FMJBT bullets from surplus NATO 7.62 ammo for my 200 and 300 yard ammo and saved the Sierra Matchkings for 600 based on the logic that I was able to use them to generate a sub-1-MOA load which was all the targets used in the game required, and that running the rifle in standing, sitting, or rapid fire with me as the "flawed human" on the trigger was not going to exceed the capabilities of that round.

I merely state to learn what the competition needs and choose accordingly. No sense buying 91 octane when 87 will do.

[Chill Wills]

The question is in the title. I see alot of people at the local matches shooting mini mags for the extra velocity, so I do the same as a newbie but is it really necessary? My rifle shoots .75" at 50 with CCI standard and about an inch with mini mag target. I would rather take the extra accuracy but not if it will not knock em down.

I play the 22rf lever rifle silhouette game. About 25 years worth. The CCI standard velocity are a very good choice and much better than the Mini Mags. For those of you that don't know, it is a 100 meter game starting with the Chickens at 40 meters. The target are the 50% of full size which are larger than the 22rf silhouette. They are thin and light so they go down fine with standard velocity ammo.

In general, the accuracy is much better than Mini Mags at 40 yards and by the time you are shooting rams at 100 meters the mini mags are of little use and standard velocity is better in wind than the faster high velocity rounds.

So, at roughly the same price, and in every other way, CCI standard velocity is the best choice.

[marshall623]

I shoot CCI standard velocity for chickens and pigs and Agila Super Extra for turkeys and rams . I run 2 different ammo for more of sight setting purposes . Which I think I'm getting flyers when switching , going to try CCI all the way through . But back to the original? , CCI SV will take all targets . I've taken the rams with CCI SV in my 10" Contender and Ruger MK4 .

Sent from my SM-G973U using Tapatalk

[Rapier]

In silhouette shooting at 100 on the pistol size targets, you actually need the 40 grain solids to be 100% on the rams at all times. A 36 grain HP gives up 10% bullet weight, but 12% energy on target. The problem with standard velocity is it changes from super to sub sonic when shot at 100. The change creates a distance zone of unstable performance. Thus you are normally better off at sub sonic only or super sonic only, ammo, from start to finish on a 100 yard or meter match.

Anything will shoot at 25 and most anything will shoot at 50. 75 yards is where the wheat gets separated from the chaff. Plus the 75 yard turkey is the most difficult target, primarily due to its irregular shape, which tends to draw the eye's focus to the target vs the sights.

Most guns will shoot Federal Classic, copper plated 40 grain in the 100 round plastic box. You can use a rim gauge if you wish. Had several guages, found in multiple tests that running the ammo, might give you a target, might.

[NSB]

In silhouette shooting at 100 on the pistol size targets, you need the 40 grading solds to be 100% on the rams. The problem with standard velocity is it changes from super to sub sonic when shooting at 100. The change creates a distance zone of unstable performance. Thus you are better off at sub sonic or super sonic ammo, start to finish on a 100 yard shot.

Anything will shoot at 25 and most will shoot at 50. 75 yards is where the wheat gets separated from the chaff. My unlimited SB gun could write my name is script at 100. I used Federal Ultra Match, the hand made match ammo, no longer made.
Most guns will shoot Federal Classic, copper plated 40 grain in the 100 round plastic box. You can use a rim gauge if you wish. Had several guages, found in multiple tests that running the ammo, might give you a target, might.

You made a mistake here: Std velocity DOES NOT transition from super sonic to sub sonic between 75 and 100 yards. Std velocity is NEVER super sonic at any distance. It’s high velocity ammo that makes that transition.

[jsizemore]

Shot SV in handgun silhouette for years. The only time it had troubles was when the wind came from behind the rams. Lever gun got going about the time I moved to smallbore hunting rifle. Does the lever rifle use the centerfire hunters pistol targets? Those rams could have trouble with SV. You may have to make head or hind end shots. Best vertical is over the front leg but that's too close to center mass.

Oh yeah, what NSB said. I can't see the box from here but I think it says 1070 FPS.

[Chill Wills]

You made a mistake here: Std velocity DOES NOT transition from super sonic to sub sonic between 75 and 100 yards. Std velocity is NEVER super sonic at any distance. It’s high velocity ammo that makes that transition.

100% agree.

JSIZEMORE, Keep in mind the 22rf targets are made of very thin steel. The 22rf targets, even though they are the (large) 1/2 size target, they are much thinner than the 1/2 size centerfire targets. It doesn't take anything to knock them over. A standard velocity 40 grain bullet is a sure deal even on rams. Various lots of Standard Velocity ammo I have chronographed in my singleshots have run 1050's to low 1080's in my rifles with 26 to 30 inch barrels. I have not checked speed with the Marlin 39A to know what it runs.

At one of our local matches we can shoot two rifles, a lever rifle class and a singleshot class. In addition to the Marlin 39A, I shoot a Ballard Singleshot 22rf pictured below.

[high standard 40]

I started shooting silhouette 44 years ago and have shot every version of that game expect air rifle. 1/5, 3/8. 1/2. and full scale....at ranges from Idaho to Florida and from Arizona to Ohio, with rifle and handgun. I currently host matches for Cowboy rifle at two ranges here in Louisiana. I also have been making those targets since the very beginning. During those 44 years I have seen just about every situation that can cause a target not to fall with a good hit on every size of silhouette target. The problem can usually be traced to a non-standard target, a target in poor condition, or the way the target was set on it's stand....or the stand itself. In regards to 22LR Cowboy Rifle, the Ram is supposed to be made from 3/16" steel and there is a standard for the size of the feet and the way the target should be set on it's stand. If that ram target is correct to specifications you should never have a problem knocking them down with standard velocity ammunition. Sadly some ranges cut out targets with no regard to set standards, usually just cutting the targets from whatever metal they have access to. Larger feet and thicker steel on that ram can and will cause an issue. So my suggestion is the ammo you use will have to be determined by which range you choose to pursue the sport. If everything is to specification, standard velocity will not let you down.

[jsizemore]

I didn't shoot that game. I ran matches for IHMSA and NRA hunter pistol matches and NRA smallbore hunter rifle. I had quit running matches by the time cowboy/lever rifle matches started but they were being run with the hunter pistol matches. I thought they were required to use the hunter pistol centerfire targets but that's been 18 or 19 years ago. 22lr SV ammo with a 10" contender was somewhere in the vicinity of 950 fps and with the wind out of the north, which most of the ranges I shot at in N.C. were oriented, in the winter shooters were left frustrated with good center hits. I had my share even when I went to Eley HV solid. Most times it didn't have any trouble. I bought a Marlin Levermatic 57 to maybe get in the game but smallbore kept me occupied trying to move up in classification in both rifles.

[high standard 40]

I didn't shoot that game. I ran matches for IHMSA and NRA hunter pistol matches and NRA smallbore hunter rifle. I had quit running matches by the time cowboy/lever rifle matches started but they were being run with the hunter pistol matches. I thought they were required to use the hunter pistol centerfire targets but that's been 18 or 19 years ago. 22lr SV ammo with a 10" contender was somewhere in the vicinity of 950 fps and with the wind out of the north, which most of the ranges I shot at in N.C. were oriented, in the winter shooters were left frustrated with good center hits. I had my share even when I went to Eley HV solid. Most times it didn't have any trouble. I bought a Marlin Levermatic 57 to maybe get in the game but smallbore kept me occupied trying to move up in classification in both rifles.

There are three versions of the Cowboy Lever Rifle game. CLA uses full size targets with the 30-30 cartridge being in common use. Pistol Cartridge category uses the same targets as the NRA Hunter pistol and 357 Mag is common there and that was 3/8" thick steel for all targets. Cowboy Rifle 22LR specifies 3/8" for chickens and pigs, 1/4" for turkeys, and 3/16" for rams.

[jsizemore]

I'm guessing the full size CLA were shot on the 200 yard range and the other 2 were shot at half size targets on the 100 yard range. There was the 22lr cowboy rifle at Bradford in the early 2000's. I was busy with the handgun thing, not paying too close attention.

Thanks for the info.

[high standard 40]

I'm guessing the full size CLA were shot on the 200 yard range

Thanks for the info.

This is correct

[35 Rem]

The only ammo I've ever used for rimfire silhouette is WW Super-X 40 grain that was loaded to about 1,280 ft/sec. Mainly because the local stores always had it in stock cheap. I wasn't a serious competitor since I was shooting a Kimber sporter but all the guys I shot with used heavy barrel Anschutz rifles. Even they had decided that the same ammo was the best bang for the buck considering it's an off hand contest. This ammo always knocked Rams down when hit halfway decent. I sure hated those Turkeys though because of the irregular shape and actual tiny round target area. Also did not like the fact that rimfire group size is not linear out to 100 yards. 100 yard groups would be nearly twice what 75 yard groups were sometimes.

[high standard 40]

Also did not like the fact that rimfire group size is not linear out to 100 yards. 100 yard groups would be nearly twice what 75 yard groups were sometimes.

This is a good reason to use a higher quality, subsonic ammo. HV ammo suffers from a loss of stability as it makes the sonic transition on the way to 100 yards and group sizes get larger past 50 yards. I have done extensive testing of ammo at 100 yards. Quality subsonic ammo gives better group sizes at the longer distances. But I guess it all boils down to what value is placed on performance expectations in whatever shooting sport a person chooses.