My homemade Golden powder!

[2TM101]

$5/lb using 22 gr works out to a powder of cost of $15.71 for 1000 rounds. I do not know how long it takes to make 3 lbs but your numbers indicate a batch size of 1 lb. Say an hour????

Cost of HP38 delivered from Powder Valley (it is in stock) is $655 for two jugs. 3.2 gr of HP38 will match or exceed your results. Powder cost for 1000 rounds works out to $18.72.

A savings of $1/hr. for an inferior product.

The risks and effort do not make sense. Smokeless powder can be stored for decades without degradation. I understand the benefits of having something if commercial powder becomes scarce, but doing this to save money does not pencil out.

In my case this got started when California introduced background checks for ammunition and I had to make a 50 mile round trip to pay someone $25 to hand me a box. So I started reloading again after decades of not doing it. Then I looked at the hazmat fees that prevented me from buying single pounds of powder, and I started making that.

And then making powder, primers, bullets and crafting ammunition became a lot more fun than actually using it. I used to spend $12-15K a year flying and now I'm on medications that prevent me from ever doing that again. Saving money isn't an issue anymore.

[HamGunner]

This is getting interesting. If we're not careful we may end up reinventing Pyrodex.

That would not be a bad thing, especially if it works well, is cleaner burning, and is safe without the sulfur, which certainly aids in making Pyrodex just as much a nasty fouling and corrosive mix as Black Powder.

Edit: And of course, if buying the ingredients in larger volume, the price would surely go down somewhat. But, like stated, saving money is not the driving factor.

[ofitg]

Apparently they found that out in 1788. I don't use Potassium Chlorate in anything. What I love about this picture is Barthollet is standing there totally unharmed with a *** expression and everyone around him is killed.

Potassium Chlorate is still being used, in items that need the extra reactivity - for example, in kitchen matches - with additives which control/moderate the combustion -

https://images.homedepot-static.com/...ce0a4230f3.pdf

For the past few years, it has become popular for people to make their own H48 and FH42 primer compounds (used by the U.S. military in the early 1900s).
The military continued to use potassium chlorate (with lead thiocyanate instead of sulfur) for small arms primers into the 1950s -

https://www.northwestfirearms.com/th...ixtures.58110/

[2TM101]

Cost of HP38 delivered from Powder Valley (it is in stock) is $655 for two jugs. 3.2 gr of HP38 will match or exceed your results. Powder cost for 1000 rounds works out to $18.72. A savings of $1/hr. for an inferior product.

Totally valid argument if I was just loading cartridge guns. But I have discovered (Oh Horrors) that for me at least making this stuff is actually a lot more fun than using it.

[2TM101]

I chrongraphed my three different mixtures of alternative powders today, along with Goex and my recent TP(Toilet Paper) powder. I cooked the Golden, but milled and pressed (corned) the others.

I have a batch made up of your "Gray" that I milled for a few hours mainly to make sure it was mixed as well as it could be. Plan to finish it this weekend but I have a question:

With Black Powder the Sulfur is what holds it together when its pucked. when I tried to puck "White Powder" it did nothing, the resulting puck just crumbled back into powder before I even had it out of the die. With "Gray" what is functioning as the binder?

[HamGunner]

With "Gray" what is functioning as the binder?

I certainly have not a clue. It was not ceramic hard, but did form a fair puck. Ground easily, so I ground it with the grain grinder on a coarse setting for several cycles to get as much 3F as I could. It made a bit more fines than normal Black.
\
It might be useful to add a little bit of Dextrin.

[2TM101]

I certainly have not a clue. It was not ceramic hard, but did form a fair puck. Ground easily, so I ground it with the grain grinder on a coarse setting for several cycles to get as much 3F as I could. It made a bit more fines than normal Black.
\
It might be useful to add a little bit of Dextrin.

I do have dextrin somewhere. If I remember correctly the added amount is very little and I am actually at just the right stage to put it in. I milled it for about 6 hours and its all still in the ball mill jar.

Which now has me wondering about something else. Homemade Dextrin is just baked corn starch. When I made powder that mainly consisted of corn starch - it didn't bind at all. It granulated very well once cooked - but then took several days to dry - and in a food dehydrator at that. But it didn't hold together at all coming from a ball mill.

So now I'm wondering what actually happens to corn starch when you bake it that turns it into Dextrin.

[indian joe]

I do have dextrin somewhere. If I remember correctly the added amount is very little and I am actually at just the right stage to put it in. I milled it for about 6 hours and its all still in the ball mill jar.

Which now has me wondering about something else. Homemade Dextrin is just baked corn starch. When I made powder that mainly consisted of corn starch - it didn't bind at all. It granulated very well once cooked - but then took several days to dry - and in a food dehydrator at that. But it didn't hold together at all coming from a ball mill.

So now I'm wondering what actually happens to corn starch when you bake it that turns it into Dextrin.

dunno the science but it turns from corn starch to glue
You want the colour change through straw yellow to light brown (about the colour of a dried walnut hull)

[Super Sneaky Steve]

I do have dextrin somewhere. If I remember correctly the added amount is very little and I am actually at just the right stage to put it in. I milled it for about 6 hours and its all still in the ball mill jar.

Which now has me wondering about something else. Homemade Dextrin is just baked corn starch. When I made powder that mainly consisted of corn starch - it didn't bind at all. It granulated very well once cooked - but then took several days to dry - and in a food dehydrator at that. But it didn't hold together at all coming from a ball mill.

So now I'm wondering what actually happens to corn starch when you bake it that turns it into Dextrin.

I've tried all kind of binders, including home made starch. SGRS is by far the best. I use 3% and my screened powder is rock hard.
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...?ie=UTF8&psc=1

[Nobade]

I've tried all kind of binders, including home made starch. SGRS is by far the best. I use 3% and my screened powder is rock hard.
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...?ie=UTF8&psc=1

How do you use this? Do you add it in the ball mill or afterward before making the dough ball? How does that work with golden powder, add while cooking?

[2TM101]

I've tried all kind of binders, including home made starch. SGRS is by far the best. I use 3% and my screened powder is rock hard.
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...?ie=UTF8&psc=1

Currently unavailable on Amazon. But I do have some from Skylighter I got after watching your youtube video about it.

I do not know for sure if the "Gray" powder will need it, this is my first batch of the stuff. I may try pucking it as is and if it doesn't work I will add the SGRS, run it for about 10 min to mix it in and then puck it again.

Side note I discovered Magnesium (atomic number 12) and Manganese (atomic number 25) were both named after the same Greek town. There are FOUR elements named after the same Swiss town.

[Super Sneaky Steve]

How do you use this? Do you add it in the ball mill or afterward before making the dough ball? How does that work with golden powder, add while cooking?

Golden powder doesn't need a binder. It will get hard as a rock once the water cooks out.

For BP I add it to the jar after the mill time is over and mill for an additional 10-30 minutes. Just to mix it, it's already a fine powder.

To screen add pure water. I like to get it good and well saturated to make sure all the starch is activated. At that point it will need a few hours to dry out a little or you'll just press long snakes out of your screen. When it starts to fall off the screen I know it's ready. I bought a metal syringe I've been meaning to try to press it out. The starch makes it more sticky and harder to press.

After 24 hours I'll break it up and sort, just to get the dust out which is not much. My granules are on the larger side, but they are less dense so they still burn good and fast.

[indian joe]

I've tried all kind of binders, including home made starch. SGRS is by far the best. I use 3% and my screened powder is rock hard.
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...?ie=UTF8&psc=1

Steve
Dextrin aint always Dextrin
Vettpilot reckoned rice starch was way better than Dex - I Got a bag but have not used it yet - if you are using 3% rice then I reckon GOOD dextrin is little different

my story
my first try at Dextrin was ok (kind of) I used 5% like some recommend - it worked like we would expect (that was about the first twenty pound of powder)
I cooked a new batch of Dextrin and used it at 5% in the meal intending that for screened and intending to try pucks with no Dex
So ground a bunch of meal with the 5% in from the get go then went to process some screened powder one day -- it was black glue !! - a bloody great mess. just way tooo gooey gluey so in order to dilute the dextrin percentage back to useful (2%) I ground a whole heap more meal with none and mixed / reground till I had it right -

2% Dextrin is plenty if the Dextrin is good - if 3% rice starch is needed then its no better than (Good) Dextrin is my story.........

[indian joe]

How do you use this? Do you add it in the ball mill or afterward before making the dough ball? How does that work with golden powder, add while cooking?

I put it in the mill at the start of the grind - proly dont matter but cant see the point of leaving it out till last (unless you do a stuff up like I did with too much of it )

[Nobade]

Thanks guys! I haven't tried making any screened powder yet, thought I'd give it a go to see how that works.

[2TM101]

I put it in the mill at the start of the grind - proly dont matter but cant see the point of leaving it out till last (unless you do a stuff up like I did with too much of it )

I was wondering why it was added later myself. May as well be part of the original blend if it doesn't do anything while it is still dry. From what I understand neither Dextrin nor SGRS do anything at all until you add water, and the amount of water added for Pucking is not enough for the SGRS/Dextrin to work. Or is this wrong?

For Black Powder I don't see any reason to make screened powder once you have a functioning puck die & press. For these alternate powders that are Vitamin C based, the main fuel seems to be a plenty good binder, especially when cooked.

[Sandro_ventania]

dextrin or any other binders are only suitable for sieved BP. For Golden powder, Crimson powder and any other variant based on potassium nitrate and ascorbic acid, no binders are needed. Speaking of which, I'm about to test another variant...the yellow powder!! This one promises to be better than the crimson one and the one with manganese!

[owejia]

Posted this in the wheelgun revolver section, thought it might get more discussion here. Would the golden powder do ok loaded in 45LC brass/over powder wad/walnut tumbling media/over shot card glued in with finger nail polish? This is for shooting the carpenter bees. Compressed powder with over powder wad would take up about half of the cartridge with the rest being filled with walnut media. Probably less than 10' shots. Any thoughts, opions. Haven't made any of the golden powder yet but have the necessary ingredents.

[Hellgate]

Looks like a good bee killer but I would test several rounds against some thin cardboard or paper at various distances to be sure there is no solid projectile of either powder or media. A crimp might help. You'd also get an appreciation for the pattern size and effective range.

[2TM101]

dextrin or any other binders are only suitable for sieved BP. For Golden powder, Crimson powder and any other variant based on potassium nitrate and ascorbic acid, no binders are needed. Speaking of which, I'm about to test another variant...the yellow powder!! This one promises to be better than the crimson one and the one with manganese!

Pyrotechnic Yellow powder's true formula is a 3:2:1 ratio of Potassium Nitrate, Potassium Carbonate, and Sulfur. But to make it good you have to melt it together which is an extremely dangerous thing to attempt. It will also blow up if you attempt to grind it. I have to assume you mean something else.

The reason "Golden Powder" was called what it is. This formula existed first.