PPC Revolvers

[YoungGun88]

Hey all,

So while I'm not a "new shooter", the way I see my shooting has changed. Less is more, make more shots count. Smaller groups.
While at the indoor range the other night, dialing in some ladder loads to settle upon a charge for my gun, a guy I've gotten to know comes in. He typically shoots 1911's and some 22 pistols, which have been setup for 25yd competition slow fire shooting. He no longer competes, but likes the slower pace with it.
Anyhow, I'm rambling(something I can do a lot!)... He pulls out not just one, but TWO highly customized S&W revolvers. Big ol bull barrels on em. It tickled my fancy, so I meandered down the line and asked him about them. One was customized by Bill Davis, and the other by Alan Tanaka.
He used to compete in PPC matches(a sport I've recently been introduced to thanks to YouTube), and I'm a bit taken back by the pistols themselves.

I didn't get to shoot either of the pistols, but figured I'd ask about this type of setup, and those of you who might have experience with it, your thoughts.

cheers,
Dan

[45DUDE]

Everyone I shoot with has at least one. We got too old to shoot them. I have one and don't shoot it. They are excellent bench guns for testing different ammo even if you don't shoot fast. Some have Douglas barrels with 1x10 twists. If 38 special only I like the K frame style frame and the L frame for 357. My shooting buddy has one with a N frame setup. You don't have to worry about recoil.

[Greg S]

Look on GB. You can find old customized PPC pistols at pretty reasonable prices these days. I pushed an auction one Sunday morning and picked up a quasi 686 framed gun with a red dot tube sight. This is a perfect set up for my aging eyes.

[NSB]

I had two Bill Davis guns at one time. One was a Ruger SS .357 and the other was a SW model 27. Both guns would shoot around 1” ten shots full power .357mag loads. I shot a lot of deer with those guns. When I was shooting three gun matches my race gun was back getting some work done and I used my Ruger SS in its place. Even shooting it double action and only able to shoot six shots between reloads, I cleaned the event twice and missed one plate the third time before getting my auto back. Great guns.[ATTACH=CONFIG]321638[/ATTACH

[YoungGun88]

Being in California, that somewhat "limits" my options, if paper is required for a transaction. According to Alan Tanaka's website, he is local to me. Perhaps I'll give him a call. It's interesting, because like many other hobbies I have had/still have during my adult life(being 35 at present), I've always found out about certain things a bit later than their heyday. It's ok, I still like shooting film, still like darkroom printing, still like shooting old guns, and now I'm learning to cast my own. But with the power of the internet, it lets me learn even faster than I could have "back in the day"

-Dan

[fecmech]

A plain old K38 is more than adequate to compete in PPC. I simply added a much higher front sight to be able to "6 O'clock" the head on the silhouette and have the shots fall in the 10 ring. The stock K frames had excellent DA triggers

[garandsrus]

Most PPC guns are heavily modified and very accurate. Almost all of the shooting is double action only so many of the guns have the hammer bobbed so they only shoot double action. The trigger pulls are very light and smooth. The guns are heavy and the loads light so minimal recoil.

[rintinglen]

I got a Bill Davis Model 10 back in the day that was the car's meow. I was shooting PPC and had gotten tired of taking my Python in to be retimed. A Sheriff's Deputy of my acquaintance had just had his third child and was getting out of the game and had the afore mentioned model 10 for sale. 6 inch, bull barrel, a Bomar rib, bobbed hammer, a superb DA trigger pull, my scores went up. That was the most accurate revolver I have ever owned. Sadly, my own family's needs came first and I had to drop out as well and sell my wonder pistol to help with household expenses, but I really enjoyed it while I had it. You'll be very hard pressed to find a revolver as accurate.

A stock K-38 would not keep you in the running if you were shooting against the likes of John Pride and the rest of the LAPD Pistol team. Those guys were good.

[Forrest r]

I/ve owned/shoot a Schneider custom for a couple decades now. It's built with a s&w model 10 frame & a douglas bbl that has a 1 in 11 twist/.353 bore. This revolver has a fantastic trigger.
[IMG][/IMG]

Had the triggers worked on these 3 dan wesson model 15's/357mags. Put heavy aftermarket bbl shrouds on them. Along with 1 in 10 twist bbl's and muzzle breaks. They got a diet of 170gr/max loads in 357 mag cases for bowling pins, steel and range play.
[IMG][/IMG]

s&w sells an excellent "tuned" revolver.
https://www.smith-wesson.com/product/l-frame-170319

Did some horse trading and picked several years ago when they were $1200. The trigger in these rivals that Schneider custom. The full scope mount rail on the top of the bbl shroud doesn't interfere with the iron sights. It's caveman simple to install a scope & being long the shooter has multiple choice on where to mount the scope or reddot. This aids in setting the revolver up for a comfortable hold/eye relief combo. Moving the optics around can affect the revolvers balance. It has adjustable/removable weights that are designed to tune the revolver to the shooters needs for point ability & shot recovery. They also aid in counterbalancing the weight of the optics.
[IMG][/IMG]

It's a pure joy to own an accurized tuned action revolver. Of the 4 of those revolvers pictured above I'd choose the box stock 586 competitor over the other 3. The combination of the smooth action, built in rail, adjustable weights and accuracy is hard to pass up.

[YoungGun88]

s&w sells an excellent "tuned" revolver.
https://www.smith-wesson.com/product/l-frame-170319

Did some horse trading and picked several years ago when they were $1200. The trigger in these rivals that Schneider custom. The full scope mount rail on the top of the bbl shroud doesn't interfere with the iron sights. It's caveman simple to install a scope & being long the shooter has multiple choice on where to mount the scope or reddot. This aids in setting the revolver up for a comfortable hold/eye relief combo. Moving the optics around can affect the revolvers balance. It has adjustable/removable weights that are designed to tune the revolver to the shooters needs for point ability & shot recovery. They also aid in counterbalancing the weight of the optics.

It's a pure joy to own an accurized tuned action revolver. Of the 4 of those revolvers pictured above I'd choose the box stock 586 competitor over the other 3. The combination of the smooth action, built in rail, adjustable weights and accuracy is hard to pass up.

Well, it looks as if that model IS on the CA-compliant roster. Hmm, I was looking at their "V-Comp" model, which is 8 shots of 357
https://www.smith-wesson.com/product/n-frame-170296

I'm going to give Alan Tanaka a call and see if he has any recommendations based on my stated needs/use. It appears he now offers the updated sight rail design from Aristocrat, which have a built-in rail for scope mounting.
I was looking at the S&W V-Comp as a potential option, as it's CA compliant(grrr, our damn "approved" roster, total bs), but would require being special ordered. High demand, according to my LGS who seems to prefer Colt pythons based on what they have in the cases...
https://www.smith-wesson.com/product/n-frame-170296

[Forrest r]

I went with the s&w l-comp
https://www.smith-wesson.com/product/l-frame-170170

[IMG][/IMG]

It suits my need as a ccw in the winter.

Nothing better than a comped 357mag and hot loads. I'm using a 170gr/1200fps load in that 2 1/2" bbl'd 586 l-comp.

I owned a python back in the late 80's, didn't take long to send it down the road and bought a s&w 586 and never looked back. When they came out with the "new" pythons I handled/tested a 6" version. Accuracy was nothing to write home about. That python did +/- 2" groups @25yds with several different brands of ammo. Others have tested the pythons and found the same thing. An example:
https://www.gunsandammo.com/editoria...-review/375565

I'll stick with the s&w 686 competitor. Playing around with the competitor @ 50ft looking for loads that can consistently hit shotgun shells @ 50ft. Not hand/cherry picked targets by any means. Simply 6-shot groups @ 50ft testing loads. Tested 2 bullets and 6 different loads. These were the best 3 out of the 6 loads tested.
[IMG][/IMG]
Ended up using these 2 (38spl) loads for 50ft competitions.
[IMG][/IMG]

Playing around at the 25yds line using 3 different bullets and 2 different loads (5.5gr/6.0gr) of bullseye in mixed 357mag brass.
[IMG][/IMG]

Same loads (5.5gr/6.0gr) and 2 different bullets/mixed brass @ the 50yd line.
[IMG][/IMG]

That's nothing more than blammo ammo in the 686. When I use quality brass the groups tighten up. But with blammo ammo:
1/2" @ 50ft
1" @ 25yds
2" @ 50yds

Is worth looking into a factory tuned s&w.

[Wild Bill 7]

I have a heavily modified S&W 14-2 heavy barreled and a trigger that’s very light. Very accurate also. I bought it from a deputy who used to compete and had other interest so I got it. Its chambered in 38 special.

[JRD]

This thread strikes me at just the right time. I've never done PPC competition and am unlikely do start. However, I enjoy shooting informal steel at my club and am a big S&W revolver fan. I shoot a lot of 38 wadcutter loads and lately I've developed a hankering for a S&W customized as a PPC revolver just to shoot for fun. I'm thinking a Model 10 or 14 with a custom bull barrel, yoke detent, a Bomar or Aristocrat rib, and a super slicked up action would be really fun to play with.
I've got my eye out for one now...

[corbinace]

This is my photo entry. A Model 10. There is just something about a great DA trigger that tickles me.

[YoungGun88]

Spoke with Mr. Tanaka this morning, he was very gracious with his time. From what he told me "I might retire before I could get to your build, it's around 3-4yr wait right now"... Well, that sorta put a damper on me getting a gun built to my desires. Money aside, he did offer to let me handle some of his own competition guns he setup for when he shot PPC back in the day. He did mention "it's a dying sport" which I understand. Seems like most of the competitive sports have been bullied into obscurity with tightened budgets, both of law enforcement departments as well as standard civilians. I'm 35, no kids or spouse, yet. Might as well invest into the toys and tools before those things happen, so 3-4yrs might come sooner than one thought, haha.

Anyone with a 686 frame laying around, not getting used ?

[StrawHat]

Here is my Davis Revolver that took me into the winners circle.





I had been using a S&W Model 15 and doing well enough with it. Toward the end of the summer season one of the better shooters who had been shooting against me, asked if I wanted to use his revolver in the off season. Sure! When spring came around I saw him and he asked what I thought of it. I told him the were two wide spots in the bore but it was about 10 points and 15 X’s better than my Model 15. He said give me $xxx.oo and it is yours! I asked what he was going to use and he said he was retiring. I had to make two payments but it was mine!

Kevin

[Der Gebirgsjager]

I knew Bill Davis personally, and saw many of his modified revolvers on the firing line. He not only beefed up standard revolvers, but came up with the Smolt (cross between a Colt and Smith) and some other hybred revolvers. Still, I myself used a standard S&W Mod. 14 6" with an action job, as did many others, and did well enough not to be ashamed. It started off as the Police Practical Pistol Course, but became less practical as the years passed with competitors trying to gain an edge with new bells and whistles. Seriously, how practical would it be to carry one of those ribbed, bull barreled revolvers on duty for 8-12 hours? Heavy! Then, with the gradual takeover of semi-autos the game changed beyond what the original participants recognized as the PPC. Good memories, though, and I've still got my Mod. 14.

DG

[Bigslug]

There's much fun to be had with "as produced" DA revolvers. While a heavy-underlugged GP-100 or Smith 686 may not have the sex appeal of a "built" PPC gun, you can master the same fundamentals with the same type of loads. If you ensure uniformity of cylinder throats and fire-lap out any frame crush, you'll have a platform capable of accuracy that the typical human is not.

The name of the DA revolver game is keeping the sights aligned while pressing the trigger cleanly. There's a lot of satisfaction to be found in developing that to a high level of proficiency using the "stock" combat gun that mainly differs from the full race gun in amount of weight up front and stock springs chosen for functional reliability under all conditions.

Nothing at all wrong with building the sports car - but worth studying how the standard car is "failing" you first.

[Der Gebirgsjager]

That is exactly right.

DG

[YoungGun88]

That’s a nice looking gun, 45Dude!

I stopped in at my local powder supplier last night, Phillips Wholesale. While speaking with the proprietor, he informed me that up until a year or so ago, Aristocrat sights were just a couple doors down from him in the same business park. Small world.