Auto Repair Bill Sticker Shock!

[Idaho45guy]

I bought a 2003 Subaru last weekend from an elderly couple that stopped driving when Covid hit. Legacy Outback wagon with 265k miles. My son-in-law is a Subaru fan and said it looked like it needed CV Joints, a new timing belt, fluids changed, and a detail. $1200. Couldn't pass it up. Subarus are worth their weight in gold around here and anything under $6-7k is very high miles and suspect repair history. Same as this one, but for $1200.



Bought it, drove it into town, and really liked it! Took it to the gas station and filled the tank with ethanol-free gas, then was driving it to the car wash to degrease the engine and get the grime off when it suddenly died in traffic. Couldn't restart it. It would sort of start and just stumble. Figured it was just a clogged fuel filter from the last of the old gas.

I towed it to the most reputable shop in town that my family had used before and they said they were booked solid until December, but would at least try and diagnose it and see what it needs.

I stopped by yesterday and talked to the mechanic. He said it needed new head gaskets, timing belt, fuel pump, CV Joints, axle stub shaft, all new brakes and rotors, couple of dashboard lightbulbs replaced, and a couple of other little things.

I was adding it up in my head and figured around $3500. Nope. Over $6,000!

I told him I was reasonably capable of repairs and he suggested I do everything except the timing belt and head gaskets. He's a Subaru guy and said he uses special head gaskets and that not getting the new belt on correctly will destroy the motor.

I checked around and his charges are inline with what repairs go for these days. Just incredible! At least he gives a 10% veteran's discount.

[Nobade]

With Subarus of that era, you can pretty much expect to need to do head gaskets. And to pull the engine to do the job. Look into using WRX head gaskets, they won't fail. It's not that bad of a job but you do need to be prepared for it.

[barnabus]

id sell it and cut my losses

[dverna]

That sucks but where can you buy a decent used car for under $8k?

If the rest of the car is in good shape, I would make the investment.

[brokeasajoke]

Head gaskets are normally $1200-1500 around here. Axles are $100-150 per. But, now it's probably good until the end of its useful life.

[Lloyd Smale]

id look at it logicaly. look around your area and see what it would sell for. i wouldnt put any more than that into it. granted if its worth 8k and you have 10k into it you probably will run longer reliably because you did all that work but i still wouldnt put more into it then its worth. id rather cut my losses and try to get my money back parting it out

[Sasquatch-1]

The wife bought a 2004 Forrester brand new. Within the first 50,000 or 60,000 we had to replace the head gasket. We haven't had any problems with that since. Timing belt needs changing every 100,000 miles. As mentioned, if it goes the engine usually goes. The biggest problem we have had is we have gone through several rear bearing. And my wife's biggest complaint is the drivers side seat warmer has stopped working. We will be hitting the 200,000, mile mark in the next couple of months.

[Martin Luber]

That’s the laundry list, what’s needed just to make it start?

[georgerkahn]

256,000 miles on it! Wowsers!!! My wife was in need of a new car -- her Ford Fusion was at the point where monthly repairs were sure to, in near future, be similar -- if not more -- than payments . We went to a dealer she had dealt with for years, and he had two units of interest - and almost made us chuckle with the bovine excrement pouring forth from his mouth. He actually said that with the Auto Strike no cars will be available in but a very few months (hey -- we're taking used cars!), and, the topper -- his mother has exact same model Ford as he was showing and that she professes it to be the best car she's ever had!
We went next door, just for kicks and giggles, to a Suburu dealer where she test drove and fell in love with a 2024 Suburu Legacy Limited! It took a week to get finances in line, and after that week she drove it home!
I just hope we are as lucky vis mileage as your prior-Suburu car owner was: again, 256,000 miles! The price -- including all those "added/hidden" charges came to $38,640.50 US dollars. (Yeah -- that alllmost $3,000.00 sales tax , too).
We also had sticker shock!!!

[trebor44]

ROI - return on investment. Hard to justify in some cases and in others it is the way to go. Any car or truck should go 200k plus. Used cars with less than 100k should be researched for mx. flood damage etc. and price. Sometimes it is better to cut your losses, other times consider the ROI! Head gasket issues are not unknown in many models of imports (including the luxuries)!

[Rapier]

Got a "nice" little old couple, up the highway from us, that buy and sell used cars, SUVs and PU trucks, have one "only driven to the grocery store on Saturday" at a time, in their front yard, really obvious to me that they are running a light drag and baiting up the unwary off the highway. Been doing this now for over 10 years, that I know of. State has not caught them yet.

One thing about any kind of sharpie, they only get older, but do not change their spots.

[Soundguy]

wow? are these prone to head gasket failures? why?

I routinely work on tractors from the 50's and only do the head gasket if they need valve work... meaning I have a bunch of 70 year old tractors with the original head gasket...

[DougGuy]

id look at it logicaly. look around your area and see what it would sell for. i wouldnt put any more than that into it. I'd rather cut my losses and try to get my money back parting it out

You could very likely get more for the front clip than you paid for the whole car. Doors bring a premium. Got any idea what the windshield would cost to replace? North of $400!

Call a salvage yard and ASK for a windshield to fit the car and see what the junkyard wants for one. see how much they want for a door or front clip.

[Lloyd Smale]

yup

[kerplode]

wow? are these prone to head gasket failures? why?

I routinely work on tractors from the 50's and only do the head gasket if they need valve work... meaning I have a bunch of 70 year old tractors with the original head gasket...

Yes. Seems to be a combination of ****ty design and ****ty materials. There are much worse things that can, and routinely do, go wrong with Subaru engines, though.

My rule is to repair a vehicle until the cost of a single repair exceeds the current value of said vehicle, at which point it is sold/scrapped. I think you basically already paid what it's worth, so if it were me, I'd cut my losses and dump it.

[centershot]

wow? are these prone to head gasket failures? why?

I routinely work on tractors from the 50's and only do the head gasket if they need valve work... meaning I have a bunch of 70 year old tractors with the original head gasket...

Yes, they are, but having owned 9 of them now I expect at least 100K miles before they fail.

kerplode said:

"Yes. Seems to be a combination of ****ty design and ****ty materials. There are much worse things that can, and routinely do, go wrong with Subaru engines, though."

It's not a matter of *****ty materials. The design of the horizontally opposed engine is the culprit. The engine "rocks" left to right as it is running, that rocking motion causes the gasket to compress and expand over and over and over. Think about how many revolutions your engine makes while you're cruising down the road........hundreds of millions of times. All my Subaru's have gone 250 K miles before I sold them, timing belts and gaskets replaced at 100 K and move on down the road!

[redriverhunter]

I drive a 1998 dodge ram and 1998 toyota tacoma. I gripe when I have to put money into them. Then I remind myself they are paid for. I had to put new tire on the tacoma that cost me 600, on a truck that should be worth about 3500 or maybe more. If I can go 2 months and not have to put any money in it, its a win for me. I do not take the trucks on long trips, they do what I need them too. The way I look at is this once the car is paid off, as long as I can drive it, to get what I put into it I win. I think when I purchased the toyota I had a payment of a round 300 a month. I will need to drive it for 2 more months to brake even again and any time after 2 months is a win. On a side note my wife drives newer cars (life is easier that way) about 3 months ago someone backed into the right headlight area over 3k in damages between the headlight bubber and body work.

[JonB_in_Glencoe]

For the last 20+ years, when I go looking to buy a car, I'm looking at cars with over 200Kmi, that's what I can afford. Since this is how I do things, I always keep my ears open about what makes/models last 300K and what doesn't.

I hear more stories from random owners about Subaru's and costly repairs when they are at or over 200K, than other imports. Add to that, my Brother's wife has driven Subaru's for 30+ years and usually gets about 150k to 200K on them, then sells them when a major repair is needed, and sells it cheap. My Brother's last one(just a couple months ago), I think it was 2011, and had 150K on it when engine went bad, sold at auction for $465. I have no idea if my Brother has regular maintenance done or not? Now, I realize this anecdotal evidence is no proof of anything, but it's been enough for me to have always avoided Subaru's.

Thanks centershot, I didn't know this...Makes sense.

SNIP>>>

It's not a matter of ******* materials. The design of the horizontally opposed engine is the culprit. The engine "rocks" left to right as it is running, that rocking motion causes the gasket to compress and expand over and over and over. Think about how many revolutions your engine makes while you're cruising down the road........hundreds of millions of times. All my Subaru's have gone 250 K miles before I sold them, timing belts and gaskets replaced at 100 K and move on down the road!

[JonB_in_Glencoe]

SNIP>>>

I stopped by yesterday and talked to the mechanic. He said it needed new head gaskets, timing belt, fuel pump, CV Joints, axle stub shaft, all new brakes and rotors, couple of dashboard lightbulbs replaced, and a couple of other little things.

Myself, I'd fix whatever it needs to make it run good enough to sell, and cut your loses.
OR,
if you have the space and like dealing with people, consider parting it out, you'll probably triple your money.

[Winger Ed.]

My Dad called it a car's 'mid life crisis' when those sort of things all came due.

I'd get or borrow a GOOD code reader if ya don't have one.
More often than not, the car will tell you what's wrong with it.
Another thing is look around on it, you may have had squirrels or rats chew through a wire somewhere.

I'd get it running and go from there.
I've changed a couple timing belts on other 4 & 6 cyl. cars. It's no big deal if you read a decent shop manual
2-3 times first, then go at it step by step working on the concept that the folks that wrote the book
really do know more about it than you do.