I think highly of the 44 Special

[W.R.Buchanan]

That was an excellent Article by Glen Fryxell. I had no luck with the Lightest Boolit I can make for .44's which is a Magma 190 gr SWC it shot so high it was useless. I settled on 429421 which I can make as a solid or 3 different HPs from a MP mould. I use 6.0 gr of W231 which I got from Brian Pearce in an Article about loading .44 Specials. It shot to the sights so I was happy using that load for IDPA where everything is close up.

I also have a 429215 GC mould that I will try with this gun and in my SBH Bisley as well. In the Bisley my Mid Range Magnum Loads are 8.0 gr of W231 with the same boolit. it had it's barrel Lopped off to 5" some time back and it carries a lot better than the 7.5" bbl did.

The other pic is My IDPA Rig for the 696. The BH Bisley was never fired and is gone now.

Randy

[Chill Wills]

I have been shooting the Ruger GP100 44 Special the last few weeks I made up and tested any number of loads for it.
So far, it likes and doesn't like certain bullets. Of the four bullets I have loaded for, the trend is for the heavier bullets and accuracy, but the lighter bullets not so much.

I have both the RCBS 250 SWC K and 250 SWC KT molds. It shoots them both better than the Lee 214 SWC and The Lyman 210grn bullet made for the 44-40WCF

Either of the heavy RCBS SWC bullets shoot well with 5grns of Bullseye or HP-38 or RED Dot and I am not totally settled on 700-X. But 5 grns of 700-X with the RCBS "K" SWC shoots best.
I think it was Joe James that said the Ruger is a little clunkier and I would agree. It may grow on me and I am going to change grips back to the Ruger Factory grips I have coming. My used GP100 revolver came (only) with after market grips that don't fit me well.

All testing done at 25 yards, for what every reason, the lighter LEE 214SWC lined its hits all up and down, 10 inches time and again. Powder changes did not help.

[Frank V]

The name says it all! .44 SPECIAL no 5 shot would be my choice, the good old 1950 Target, mod. 24, would get the nod. As for hotrodding it, why? We can safely get 900fps with a 245, to 250gr cast bullet. Unique works well. You almost have to see the penetration at that velocity to believe it. I have!
I feel if you need more power, a rifle or shotgun are indicated.
Some may disagree & I accept that.

[alamogunr]

In addition to the S&W 696, I had a S&W Highway Patrolman converted to .44 Spec. and later bought a Freedom Arms 97 in .44 Spec. Love them all. Just getting too old to shoot them as much as I would like.

[Bill.68]

I never understood this line of thought about guns being strong enough or which gun is stronger. Ive been shooting guns a good long time as many of you here have and Ive never met anyone who has shot a gun enough to wear it out.
And, if youre talking about ammo, if you need to load the Special to levels high enough to damage the gun then get a magnum.
Either gun, the GO or the 696, like my No- is going to do just fine within the confines of ammo choice. Mine is loaded with either a 250gr Keith over 7.7gr of PowerPistol or a 190gr SWCHP with 9gr of TrueBlue. It also shines with a 250gr RFHP.
The point here is if youre a Smith guy you wont go wrong with the 696 and if Rugers tickle your fancy get the GO. Either way you wont wear either out or break anything.
I will mention this though, the 696 does not have conventional rifling, its more of a polygonal rifling like a glock so bearing surface and velocities are more important.

[JoeJames]

The name says it all! .44 SPECIAL no 5 shot would be my choice, the good old 1950 Target, mod. 24, would get the nod. As for hotrodding it, why? We can safely get 900fps with a 245, to 250gr cast bullet. Unique works well. You almost have to see the penetration at that velocity to believe it. I have!
I feel if you need more power, a rifle or shotgun are indicated.
Some may disagree & I accept that.

I accept that for sure. Something about a 240 grain swc plundering down range at @890 fps just seems to me to be a perfect balance of accuracy, penetration, and very tolerable and pleasant recoil. For my Lipsey Ruger BH 4 1/2" my favorite bullet is the Lee 430 240 TL.

[Chill Wills]

I accept that for sure. Something about a 240 grain swc plundering down range at @890 fps just seems to me to be a perfect balance of accuracy, penetration, and very tolerable and pleasant recoil. For my Lipsey Ruger BH 4 1/2" my favorite bullet is the Lee 430 240 TL.

I think I want to find a SWC mold that casts at about 240grns. Until then....

I just got a used RCBS Mold marked 250 SWC. I have been looking for something lighter than the two RCBS molds I have had forever. The first bought in the 1970's is marked "KT" and I cast loads and loads of bullets for my Super Backhawk with it. Then sometime later in the 1980's the supposed copy of the Keith bullet RCBS marked simply "K".

Both these molds cast heavy in my alloy of 96-2-2. The KT at 267grns and the K at 272grns. I don't want to push the load data for 240 grain bullets to the max using bullets 25 - 30 grains heaver. There isn't much for data on bullets this heavy in 44 Special.

The new to me RCBS 250 SWC weighs 262grains cast in the above alloy and I was hoping for something closer to 250. Yes, the design was likely produced with something Sb and SN rich producing a lighter bullet. In my alloy, not so much.

This RCBS SWC marked mold has three equal length driving bands and is much meatier in front of the crimp groove than the "KT" mold. I look forward to testing it in the S&W696. Hoping for an accurate load in the 850fps range.

[white eagle]

not sure what you think of single actions but as has been mentioned a Ruger Bisley blackhawk in 4-5/8" makes a handy carry gun and is a hoot to shoot

[Chill Wills]

not sure what you think of single actions but as has been mentioned a Ruger Bisley blackhawk in 4-5/8" makes a handy carry gun and is a hoot to shoot

Great minds think alike.
My woods gun here in western Colorado from about 1976 to 1999, before I found the S&W 696, was a Ruger Blackhawk 45 4-5/8" convertible. I found the S&W 696 in a local drug store in Glenwood Springs.

Accuracy in the Ruger 45 was abysmal!!! It took me awhile and a membership to the Cast Bullet Assoc. in the late 70's to discover how to look into these kinds of things. I discovered both cylinders on the Ruger 45 had throats running 0.456 and 0.457" .

0.452" bullets were bouncing around in the large throats. V.Smith, later to be LBT, was writing pieces for the bi-monthly Fouling Shot in those days and started advertising his molds. I called him. He was in Cornville, AZ back then and he made me a 4-cavity mold that cast 0.457" 255 grain bullets that greatly improved that handgun's performance. However, 45ACP ammo still sucked!

Truthfully, carrying the Blackhawk was fine and met my needs well. In the early 80's I had a short infatuation with a small, light Charter Arms SS 44 bulldog but it wasn't all I wanted in a woods gun. One day on the way to the NW corner of Colorado to hunt pronghorn in 1999, I stopped in a drugstore in Glenwood Springs that had a well stocked gun corner and saw the S&W 696 44 Special (wow!) and just had to have it! It was about $400 then.

This current string of posts is because my collage age son wants a sidearm to carry while fishing the bushy creeks and camping the remote areas he is now frequenting. ...And, ....he wants my Smith 44 special! I have loaned him my S&W m-10, but something bigger is better. I found a Ruger GP-100 44-Special but have not given it to him yet. I'm not done playing with it! He might get it next spring.

[delftshooter]

I won't speak for the other mfgr's offerings but the Ruger single action revolvers in 44 special can safely be loaded right up to the 44 magnum's doorstep in power and velocity.

Ruger will not comment on the 44 special max pressure but the 45 Colt/45ACP flattop blackhawk is rated for 45ACP+P pressure which is 23kpsi. I figure that the flattop in 44 special may be perfectly safe up to 25kpsi because the chambers are smaller diameter, cylinder walls are thicker, webs are thicker, and the bolt cuppets are thicker at the bottom. This level of power with a 240gr boolit in 44 special will fit right up under the lower end of the 44 magnum performance with the same boolit.

Just a question,, so you are advocating the use of HEAVY special loads in the GP-100. Even though ruger has refused to convert into a .41 magnum based on frame strength.

[Kosh75287]

I understand the allure of the Single-action .44 Spl. revolvers, but the thought of engaging multiple "2-legged varmints" (which is never NOT a possibility) with it and its slow reload time kinda dulls my enthusiasm for them (unless a lever-gun in .44 something is close at hand).
There's not really a lot wrong with the CA Target Bulldog, except that it is darned obstreperous and short-lived with "Elmer Keith" loads in it. It is light, handy, unobtrusive, and an absolute joy to carry. As a "carry-often/shoot seldom" weapon it may be the best buy for the money.
The S&W M69(6) is about the same size as the CA Target Bulldog, though a little heavier. It will be more controllable with and tolerant of "Elmer Keith" loads, though a bit less of a joy to carry. Same goes for the S&W M329 in all respects. They'll both be less economical than the Target Bulldog, though longer-term players in the sidearm game.
The 7.0/W231/200 gr. load mentioned by someone is probably as good a load as the Keith-Skelton 7.5/Unique/240 gr. LSWC load, and perhaps a bit easier on the revolvers. Another load with which I have personal experience is 7.0/Herco/215 gr. "Button-nosed" SWC. It clocked at about 900 f/s from a 6.5" S&W M624, but performed well in the CA Target Bulldog without shaking it apart. I would guess that the velocity deficit in the CA Target Bulldog was about 75-100 f/s, which is still puh-LENTY of horsepower on the receiving end.
SHORT ANSWER about your choice of .44 Special revolvers is that ANY of the ones mentioned will work just fine. It will finally become a matter of familiarity as to which of the revolvers you might shoot best, especially under time pressure.

[bcraig]

I think I want to find a SWC mold that casts at about 240grns. Until then....

I just got a used RCBS Mold marked 250 SWC. I have been looking for something lighter than the two RCBS molds I have had forever. The first bought in the 1970's is marked "KT" and I cast loads and loads of bullets for my Super Backhawk with it. Then sometime later in the 1980's the supposed copy of the Keith bullet RCBS marked simply "K".

Both these molds cast heavy in my alloy of 96-2-2. The KT at 267grns and the K at 272grns. I don't want to push the load data for 240 grain bullets to the max using bullets 25 - 30 grains heaver. There isn't much for data on bullets this heavy in 44 Special.

The new to me RCBS 250 SWC weighs 262grains cast in the above alloy and I was hoping for something closer to 250. Yes, the design was likely produced with something Sb and SN rich producing a lighter bullet. In my alloy, not so much.

This RCBS SWC marked mold has three equal length driving bands and is much meatier in front of the crimp groove than the "KT" mold. I look forward to testing it in the S&W696. Hoping for an accurate load in the 850fps range.

I have a Stainless Rossi 92 44 special/mag that functions well with 44 special and holds 10 round's of HSM 240 semi-wadcutter Ammo.
Going to be Loading it with the Starline brass from the HSM factory loads along with 5.5 Grains of HP-38 and some old Winchester Large pistol primers and some 250 Grain Hollopoints I bought from Matts bullet's
Should be somwhere about 950-1,000 fps.
Should be a decent lean in the corner of the house gun ,a little over 5 pounds unloaded,easy to shoot ,low recoil,decent Magazine capacity,subsonic so easier on the ears if needed.

I haven't deer hunted in years but if I decided to should work fine for 50 Yard deer Hunting in the wood's.


I had one of the Charter Arms Bulldog Pistols back around 1980 for pocket carry but it did not work for me.

Was not a good pocket for me as the tight jeans I wore (to try and impress the Ladies at my age of 20)was not very good for pocket carry of anything!

But I liked the pistol and the concept.

Now I am older(will be 64 soon)I wear The Propper brand of Khaki BDU pant's that I carry a Glock 26 in the pocket using a MIC brand trigger guard Holster for safe carry of loaded chamber and 11 round's of Federal 147 Gr Hollowpoint.
Also keep a Glock 33 round magazine in the truck's console.
I imagine I could Keep a Charter 44 special in both of my pants Pocket and still have bout the same firepower.

[Kosh75287]

I imagine I could Keep a Charter 44 special in both of my pants Pocket and still have about the same firepower.

Somewhat better stopping power, though...

[Chill Wills]

Lately I have been loading test ammo for the 44 Special and various 250 - 265gr SWC bullets for use in my Smith 696 and Ruger GP-100 3" barrels. 25 yards, chrono and checking location of the groups V the POA. That in its self has been interesting! Loads print in different places left and right. I am testing powders in the faster pistol class for the short barrels. Woods use. More on this later.

- On a fluke I loaded Herco using the **Lyman 44th guild and got velocity much faster than predicted. The run of the mill Bulls Eye, WW-231, Red Dot loads were producing velocity in the high 600's into the middle 700's FPS as I worked up to max. The Herco blasted them into the high 800's and middle 900's (FPS). Listed pressures were supposed to be in the safe range for standard 44 Special.

What do you make of this Herco load?

**SEE CORRECTION IN POST 76

[rintinglen]

@ Chills

I just looked in my copy of the 44th Lyman. There are no loads listed for the 44 special using Herco. Herco was widely used as a magnum powder in the 50's and 60's, until pressure testing revealed that recommended loads were substantially hotter than had been supposed. I don't know where you got your load data, but in the 2004 Alliant manual, 7.7 grains was listed as giving 805 fps @12,600 cup out of a 5.6 inch test barrel. If you are getting nearly 100 fps more from a 3 inch revolver, something is amiss.

[Chill Wills]

It is the 7.7gr. load and sorry, I cited the wrong source. It was the 1992 Hercules Reloaders Guide.

The data is correct. 944 average for 5 shots, RCBS "K" SWC shot in the Smith 696. Accuracy was one of the better loads on the target. I will load some more and replete the test.
Being surprised at the recoil and chrono numbers, I put the other 5 rounds through my 7.5" Ruger SBH. The load was also very accurate and the average velocity was 997 FPS.

[delftshooter]

The lack of a GOOD ever day duty grade 44 special has really hurt the handgunner. Look at what elmer and skelton and so many other of our fore fathers did with the 44 special. Look at what happens in a magnum gun, magnum case, and a mere 1 grain increase in powder (7.5 unique to 8.5 gr). pure perfection.

We have such a beautiful low pressure round, that can do so much, but so little guns for it.

[Bazoo]

I think I want to find a SWC mold that casts at about 240grns. Until then....

I just got a used RCBS Mold marked 250 SWC. I have been looking for something lighter than the two RCBS molds I have had forever. The first bought in the 1970's is marked "KT" and I cast loads and loads of bullets for my Super Backhawk with it. Then sometime later in the 1980's the supposed copy of the Keith bullet RCBS marked simply "K".

Both these molds cast heavy in my alloy of 96-2-2. The KT at 267grns and the K at 272grns. I don't want to push the load data for 240 grain bullets to the max using bullets 25 - 30 grains heaver. There isn't much for data on bullets this heavy in 44 Special.

The new to me RCBS 250 SWC weighs 262grains cast in the above alloy and I was hoping for something closer to 250. Yes, the design was likely produced with something Sb and SN rich producing a lighter bullet. In my alloy, not so much.

This RCBS SWC marked mold has three equal length driving bands and is much meatier in front of the crimp groove than the "KT" mold. I look forward to testing it in the S&W696. Hoping for an accurate load in the 850fps range.

If you need it, I can supply a picture of the RCBS data for the 44-250-K. Mine weighs 262 grains when cast from WW alloy. The book does list it as 250 grains, notwithstanding, I at least like having bullet specific data.

[Bazoo]

I really like my Ruger Blackhawk 44 Special, after changing the XR3 grip frame to a stainless XR3-RED grip frame.




18 consecutive shots at 20 yards, rested off the top of my Tracker.

[Chill Wills]

That is a very handsome Blackhawk! The accuracy is great too!!! Nice!