Rolling Block, a few questions?

[Hootmix]

First off i'm a lever guy of the 76's. BUT!!, having acquired a #5 RB someone sort of started refurbishing (sort of).
Been working on the action (someone) buffed it till no numbers or ID marks were left, then chromed the "whole" action, screw's and all. Now the questions, #1- just how much hammer tension does one need to fire a 45-70 (forgot to mention the cal.) primer? #2- how much pressure (as in pounds of pull) would be about right to open the loading block? I might mention the hammer would fire sometimes when you closed the loading block, but i redressed the hammer sear and now it is working right.
Everything on the receiver is just too tight and i thought some of you RB fans would have a few ideal's on lighting the function's, all the springs are nice and stout. Help me if you can this is a new ballgame for me.

coffee's ready, Hootmix.

[John Taylor]

Do thing move freely if the springs are out? The spring that holds the block closed is the same size as the trigger spring and works against the locking lever which also blocks the trigger from being pulled when the breach is open. With the lower tang removed the breach block and the hammer should have no drag and move freely.

[Hootmix]

Hey JT, yes sir everything moves nice and free without slop or grinding. I just feel that the spring are "stout. The ejector throws the case out, you don't have to pull it out, but you have to pull the block lever w/ more force than i think it should take. Cocking the hammer (@#$%@#) will take more than 20# of pull, again it seems to be to stout. Before i start lighting the springs (they are all original and in fine condition) i was just wondering about how smooth & easy thing's should work. I can think in pounds of tension- pressure.

coffee's ready, Hootmix.

[Fishoot]

The trigger return spring can be swapped for one from Rollingblockparts.com. Or you can make your own using music wire. If you do a search here you will find threads on that. The mainspring is military tough. It can be lightened by carefully removing metal with a belt sander. Do not let the metal get too hot and cool it in water frequently. If it is too warm to hold, you didn't cool it soon enough. Always sand in line with the long dimension of the spring. I am not aware of any formulas for this effort. I suggest you measure the spring at several places (both ends and middle) and then remove a little and try it. Good luck to you. If you go too far, you can get a main spring from the same link. The owner is Kenn Womack. Hell of a nice guy as is John Taylor! If you are hesitant about any of this, send the gun to John Taylor.

[Hootmix]

Fishoot thank you and i totally agree w/ you Mr. Taylor and everyone i'v delt with here have been nice & easy to give good advice.

Know about smoothing springs & heat. I have only handled one other RRB, and it was easy to operate so that was (is) the reason for the questions.

coffee's ready, Hootmix.

[marlinman93]

Do not take much metal off the mainspring if this is the first one you've lightened! It can go from too heavy to too light before you know it! I always start by simply rounding the squared corners of the mainspring first, and using my bare hands to hold it as I work it on my belt sander so if it's too hot to hold, it's time to cool it off.
Once the corners are rounded off nicely, give it another try, and see if it suits your needs. Then at the same time prime a case and make sure it pops a primer. If it needs more than rounding the corners you can sand the thickness by only sanding lengthwise, never across the spring. Keep trying it, and keep popping primers to make sure it ignites them.
The piano wire for the trigger spring I make from .045" piano wire. It's fairly easy to bend, and thin enough to reuse the existing trigger spring screw. It will require an eye bent in it, then cut it to match the flat return spring length, and put a bend in it to maintain pressure on the trigger. Usually have about a 2-4 lb. trigger when it's installed.

[Hootmix]

marlinman93, thank you sound like a good place to start. What about the loading block spring, it really is hard to pull back?
Hootmix.

[uscra112]

Lightning that hammer spring - sand off the edges to make it narrower, not thinner.

Look carefully at the outline, and try to preserve it.

[Hootmix]

uscra112, thank you. I will measure thickness & width before i start and keep note's, it may someone else later.
coffee's ready, Hootmix.

[John Taylor]

new main spring, Dixie gun works

https://www.dixiegunworks.com/index/...el++Late+Model

One the block opening hard, check to make sure there is no gunk under the locking lever and that it moves freely. The spring can be made lighter but I have never seen one that is to strong. A few drops of oil on the block and locking lever may help.

[marlinman93]

marlinman93, thank you sound like a good place to start. What about the loading block spring, it really is hard to pull back?
Hootmix.

I've never had any issues with the block springs being too heavy, and would hesitate to lighten one. I would take a look at the contact area on the block, and end of the spring to make sure both are extremely smooth, and nothing rough that could cause the drag you're feeling. If it's all smooth, and the pin the block pivots on is also smooth, then I'd oil the pin and put some grease on the bottom of the block where it contacts the spring and give that a try to see how it feels. If there's any roughness, I'd polish that out also before grease.

[Hootmix]

JT, marlinman , i am working on the main spring (thank you JT, i do buy from Dixie). Going to pull all the springs and take everyone's advice and clean everything up. Will let ya'll know how it goes. There is one thing, the trigger spring screw touches (puts slight pressure) against the bottom of the hammer spring, is this normal??

coffee's ready, Hootmix.

[marlinman93]

JT, marlinman , i am working on the main spring (thank you JT, i do buy from Dixie). Going to pull all the springs and take everyone's advice and clean everything up. Will let ya'll know how it goes. There is one thing, the trigger spring screw touches (puts slight pressure) against the bottom of the hammer spring, is this normal??

coffee's ready, Hootmix.

No the trigger spring screw should not be touching the hammer spring. Sounds like either the screw got replaced and someone used a screw with a thicker head, or the mainspring got replaced and isn't correct. The mainspring might barely touch at full cock against the screw head, but that wont hurt unless it touches well before full cock.

[Hootmix]

marlinman93, just came from shop. I think the screw has been replaced (a feller does with what he has), i'll replace it or dress it down.

Took everyone's advice and pulled the breech apart and had trouble getting the pin out that holds the pivot cam for the loading block, it was bent and would not let the cam pivit smoothly against the loading block cam fixed it, now the loading block opens easy & smoother. Worked the hammer spring to make it narrower, i now have a hammer pull i feel better with. Fired 2 primers, the firing pin went about 3/4 of the way thru the primers knocking out the anvils and out of the cases??? May have to shorten the FP some. Stocks are next!!

coffee's ready, Hootmix.

[Hootmix]

OK!!, couldn't stand it, loaded up 3 rounds 45-70 w/.312gr. cast, 26gr. of sr4759 (old stock) fixed the stock screw put stock on (it's cracked) taped the forearm on (blue painter's tape) and went to the range. The barrel is 1 1/4" dia. x 26", painted black, named "her" the ugly gun. But i believe she (it) will be a keeper at 50 yds. she did GOOD. Lots of work to do yet.

coffee's ready, Hootmix.

[marlinman93]

On almost any rifle I build, I shoot for a minimum of .040" firing pin protrusion, and no more than .050" maximum. On a Rolling Block it's simple to pull the block, and push the pin in with your thumb, then measure with a dial caliper how much pin protrudes. And it's extremely important to not ever have so much as to chance piercing a primer, or you'll get a face full of gases when it happens! Please make sure it's not too long before firing the Rolling Block again!

[Hootmix]

Thank you marlinman93, i did measure my FP it measured out at .446. But i think the hammer spring was just to stout. The three "loaded" rounds looked good and i have, since firing those three rounds lightened the hammer spring some more. I use a lot of WWLRP, but have been testing w/ CCI300 (LRP). I still have some more questions about how smooth the action should work, so hang with me (I'm not OCD, just want it right).

coffee's ready, Hootmix.

[missionary5155]

.446 explains alot. Either the so called .43 Spanish or that Egyptian type.
We have several and they make a good all purpose "slay anything" most of us will ever see. The carbines are alot of fun to haul around and pop whatever needs a good dose of range scrap lead.
Carry a couple round ball loads in the pocket for the under 75 pound critters. Never met a large fat ol ground hog who could take a RB through the shoulders to make it home to complain about it all.
A large raccoon may be another issue. They get mean fast and do right well still motivating with just those hind legs. That is why I like to carry a couple RB loads.
Oh the fun of a Roller down in the river bottoms... but not when it is 90 plus 90% humidity....