low number 03 springfield

[firefly1957]

A coworker had a Remington Model 700 that had great sentimental value to him and it was in a fire the springs and stock where toast and every gunsmith told him it would be dangerous to restore . He came up with a solution that worked for him he rebuilt the gun in .45 acp and lets people learning to shoot Trian with it. He also uses it for pest control . Cast bullet loads could be a way for you to safely shoot the guns keeping pressures low trouble could be with the next owner not knowing .....

[45workhorse]

I will have to break out my copy and do some reading.
Thanks!!

[Char-Gar]

This subject has been discussed and debated for as long as I have memory, and yet here is is again. Mr. Gibson has done a fine job of giving the relevant literature and statistics. I would just like to throw in two more issues that I don't find in these kinds of threads.

1. The issue really is not, do these low numbered receivers blow up more than the high numbered ones, for they do not, as statistics will show. The issue is what happens to these rifles, when a serious over pressure event occurs. The low numbers trap the gas and turn the receivers into grenades due to the brittle metal. The high numbers has gas release holes and just swell up, but stay together.

2. The extent to which the 1921 National Match "Tin Can" ammo contributed to the folklore surrounding these rifles. The Tin Can Ammo was the brain child of Townsend Whelen who at the time commanded the Frankford Arsenal. He opined that tin plated bullets would foul the bore less and provide greater accuracy. He was right about that, but the was an electro-chemical bond form between the bullet and the case, which raised the pressures of the round to 70,000 PSI or greater. This was exacerbated by shooters who applied cup grease to the bullet and case neck to do the same thing. This raised the pressures even higher. The result was several blown rifles at the 1921 National Matches.

Bottom line is those who say these low numbered receivers are safe to shoot with rounds of milspec pressure, in rifles of good condition are correct. I have done so and would not hesitate to do it again.

Please note, we are talking about very old rifles, who have been goodness knows where and shot with goodness known what. If you plan on shooting one and don't know your way around rifles enough to verify it's mechanical health, better find someone that does before pulling the trigger. These things, like Red Headed women are not for everybody and "handle with caution" applies to both.

[groovy mike]

I have a 1903 Rock Island Arsenal 30-06 in the 199XXX serial number range. It was my great grandfather's deer rifle. As a young and dumb teen who knew no better I shot full power WW2 surplus ammunition through it. Now that I know better I shoot low pressure loads out of it like 6 grains of Bullseye behind a 150 grain cast bullet. That's a load that would kill deer if it had to, but it's a safe plinker load for punching paper and cans without overly annoying the neighbors with noise too.

[Andy45]

Sometime ago, I read the reminiscences of an old time soldier who said that when on the ranges, they would set upside down helmets along the firing lines containing sun-softened Cosmoline. They would dip the forward halves of the cartridges in their 5-shot clips in the stuff to reduce bore fouling from the bullet jackets. Tell me that did not raise chamber pressures and/or bolt thrust on the locking lugs and cause some of these notorious failures!

[ebb]

TEW45 You asked about making your rifle a shooter. I will not argue if the low number guns are shootable or not as you already seem to have made up your mind. If it were mine I would find a high number receiver and have all the rest of your rifle put together on the high number receiver. You already have all of the parts but one.

[Gtek]

Sorry off topic, but just seen and after a deep breath and some thoughts, and then the memories rolled. "These things, like Red Headed women are not for everybody and "handle with caution" applies to both". Still chuckling! As a young man they were my Kryptonite, veteran of two wars with those, untold number of battles. At almost 62 years old I know playing with firearms is much safer and cheaper.

[Char-Gar]

Sometime ago, I read the reminiscences of an old time soldier who said that when on the ranges, they would set upside down helmets along the firing lines containing sun-softened Cosmoline. They would dip the forward halves of the cartridges in their 5-shot clips in the stuff to reduce bore fouling from the bullet jackets. Tell me that did not raise chamber pressures and/or bolt thrust on the locking lugs and cause some of these notorious failures!

That practice began with the cupro-nickle bullets and it most certainly did raise pressure. The the Gliding metal bullets took over, this offered no advantage.

[Scrounge]

I was told by the experts in the field that if you have low number Springfield that is still around and shooting it's not one of the ones that is going to blow up. They weeded them out pretty good. Old Elmer Keith was a fan of the 35 Whelen and he one on a low number 03 and you know Elmer he pressed the pedal to the medal and shooting 300 grains bullets from it very fast! I was interested in this because I have a 1911 03 in 35 Whelen built back in the old gunsmith days and may even have been built by a famous one, haven't finished checking it out yet to find out. I'm not worried about it. My honest opinion is the "internet" started all the controversy.

No, General Hatcher started it, in his Hatcher's Notebook. I'd suggest you download and read the original source: https://archive.org/details/hatchers...ian-s.-hatcher And then you'll know enough to make your own decisions.

Bill