The Buffalo Bore Hard Cast Boolit .25 ACP SWCFN loads.

[Captain O]

These 60-grain flat nosed, hard cast loads are clocking at about 870 fps from a Beretta Model 21A. This load makes the .25 ACP a force to be reckoned with at "bad breath" ranges. (I saw these results on YouTube).

Questions? Comments?

[rintinglen]

There is an aphorism about answers to unasked questions. IIRC, that calculates to about 98 foot pounds, better than a factory standard 50 grainer at ~750 fps, but still not all that and a bag of chips. I suspect that a cartridge generating 33% more energy would increase the wear and tear markedly.

[pettypace]

[Texas by God]

There are probably quite a few folks in the cemetery who might have thought that the .25 was “insufficient”.
Even more so the .22 LR.


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[rintinglen]

The only first hand information that I have results from a shooting that took place in 1983 outside a Hispanic bar in Wilmington, CA. An "Undocumented Alien" had got in a confrontation with another person of questionable immigration status. When they "stepped outside" the second fellow produced a .25 and proceeded to fire 7 shots at our victim. He had attempted to hide behind a telephone pole, but had been shot in the right hand, the right wrist, the right side, the right leg and the right ankle. When I arrived on scene, the victim was limping around in circles, cradling his wounded right arm with his left arm, and sobbing and sniffing. With each step, blood squelched up out of his sneaker and dribbled on the ground. His assailant reportedly had fled back to Mexico, or so I was later informed.

I would not want to be shot with anything, but I must be shot, I would rather be shot with a 25 than anything else, save maybe one of those dinky 22 Short pistols Beretta used to make. I consider them to be strictly an "onion field" gun, small enough to be easily deeply-concealed, and used as a last resort when ones primary weapon has been taken or run dry. But I would rather have a bigger gun.

[Jtarm]

They must be getting bored up there in Idaho.

[HWooldridge]

Jeff Cooper once wrote that he'd rather rely on his hands than a .25 ACP. Might be apocryphal but I can see him saying it.

[FergusonTO35]

There are probably quite a few folks in the cemetery who might have thought that the .25 was “insufficient”.
Even more so the .22 LR.

The mere sight of a gun has a better than 50% chance of making a bad guy reconsider his ways, and I imagine even a non-fatal wound would do the same. Plenty of determined assailants continue to fight even after being thoroughly ventilated with the latest and greatest 9mm, .40, and .357 JHP's. If all you have is a .25 and it is reliable and you shoot it well, then you are way ahead of someone who only has their fists.

[david s]

I believe Mr. Cooper said he would rather have a hatchet instead of the .25 ACP.

[Jtarm]

The mere sight of a gun has a better than 50% chance of making a bad guy reconsider his ways.

Yeah, but what about the sight of a .25 auto?

[steve urquell]

If you shoot someone with a .25ACP (and they find out about it) they will be very angry with you.

[billmc2]

I have a friend that was shot with a .25 ACP. He's been carrying the bullet around inside for over 30 years now. He was shot in the back and the bullet stopped just short of his heart. It was close enough to the heart that the doctors did not want to operate. They felt it was safer to leave the bullet in him than to open him up. He says people still ask him about it when he gets X-rays.

[steve urquell]

I have a friend that was shot with a .25 ACP. He's been carrying the bullet around inside for over 30 years now. He was shot in the back and the bullet stopped just short of his heart. It was close enough to the heart that the doctors did not want to operate. They felt it was safer to leave the bullet in him than to open him up. He says people still ask him about it when he gets X-rays.

I always laugh when I watch movie scenes where they have to get that bullet out and start digging at the patient causing 50X more damage than the bullet caused. I work in a hospital and routinely see GSWs and they typically leave the bullet in if it's not causing problems.

[Dutchman]

I know two people who were shot with a .25 acp. One was a co-worker and the other was my father. Both were 2 shots to the abdomen and both persons were down and out as a result. I never got the real story from my father as he wasn't much of a story teller but pretty sure it was in Juarez across from Fort Bliss where he was stationed at the time, circa 1929-30.

Dutch

[FergusonTO35]

Yeah, but what about the sight of a .25 auto?

I'm not pretending to be an expert here, but I imagine most people don't want to get shot with anything. Remember, handgun wounds always produce instant death on TV and movies. As Rintinglen points out, the .25 was enough to put the target out of action so the shooter could escape. I consider .32 Auto or Aguila Interceptor .22 LR to be my minimum carry cartridge, but I wouldn't hesitate to carry a .25 if it was all I had.

[HWooldridge]

I'm not pretending to be an expert here, but I imagine most people don't want to get shot with anything. Remember, handgun wounds always produce instant death on TV and movies. As Rintinglen points out, the .25 was enough to put the target out of action so the shooter could escape. I consider .32 Auto or Aguila Interceptor .22 LR to be my minimum carry cartridge, but I wouldn't hesitate to carry a .25 if it was all I had.

I'd rather have a .22 LR or .22 Magnum - I think either would be better than a .25 ACP, and cheaper practice to boot.

[FergusonTO35]

I'd rather have a .22 LR or .22 Magnum - I think either would be better than a .25 ACP, and cheaper practice to boot.

Agree with you there! Perhaps the biggest problem for the .25 is that most ammo is way watered down because of all the cheap and/or old guns made in this cartridge. I've read that some loads can be as much as 200 fps slower than the nominal 750 fps. Every chronograph test I've read shows a wide variety of velocities produced by factory loads.

[308w]

Years and years ago, An old seasoned country deputy sheriff was called to a disturbance at the local watering hole.
He went in and in the process of figuring out who he was going to haul to the jail house someone pulled a 25 and pointed it at him.
He looked them in the eye, walked up to them and put his finger over the end of the barrel and said, don't point that at me, if you was
to shoot me I would most likely get mad and you wouldn't want to see me mad.

Not the smartest option in my book but it worked that night.

[georgerkahn]

These 60-grain flat nosed, hard cast loads are clocking at about 870 fps from a Beretta Model 21A. This load makes the .25 ACP a force to be reckoned with at "bad breath" ranges. (I saw these results on YouTube).

Questions? Comments?

I'm a bit confused... I own a few Beretta Pocket pistols, and their .22 SHORT, called the Minx, is Model 950. The Model 21 is their .25ACP Bobcat (current model) as is the Jetfiire Model 950BS. The Model 21A is their .22 long rifle model.
Perhaps someone made a "typo" vis stating the Model 21A as a .25ACP?
Regardless, I have the .22 short, .22 long rifle, and .25acp versions which include the "old" .25ACP: their model 418. In all calibres I have found them ('specially the .22 short Minxes) to be rather particular vis the ammo one wishes to fire in it. While their action is kind of neat (and then some!), in ALL loadable calibres there appears to be a rather small window to insure reliable, consistant functioning.
As writ, I have two Beretta pocket pistols in .25acp and I doubt (may just "me"?) if I'd ever even think of loading that Buffalo Bore in either of mine.
geo

[Captain O]

Agree with you there! Perhaps the biggest problem for the .25 is that most ammo is way watered down because of all the cheap and/or old guns made in this cartridge. I've read that some loads can be as much as 200 fps slower than the nominal 750 fps. Every chronograph test I've read shows a wide variety of velocities produced by factory loads.

With the BB loads, the .25 is more reliable (because it is a Centerfire cartridge) and can still out-penetrate the .22 Long Rifle Cartridge. (The .22 WMR seems just as expensive as the .25).

Remember: The rimfire cartridges are far more prone to misfires or "duds" than the .25 ACP. This is just a fact of life.