Will the USA be judged for its rebellion?

[dverna]

I don't see any reason to believe that the New Testament God would punish individuals on the basis of the behavior of their countrymen, especially those that were long dead before the individual was born. You could, if you wanted, argue that we are complicit in the present moral degeneracy of our neighbors because we haven't done everything in our power to stop it, but I think the Lord understands that everyone has limitations on what they are able to affect. There is an opportunity cost to all-consuming activism which often takes away from other things which we are commanded to look after, like hard work in an honest profession, generosity to the poor, or being good husbands and fathers to our wives and children.

If we're talking Old Testament God, He had very different expectations and standards. If we were still dealing with a world where Christ hadn't changed the game for us, we'd be screwed.

A cursory look at history might make your rethink what the NT God will or will not do for His children. Many Christians have suffered in many countries.

We want to believe God will protect us but that is not always the case. I smile when my preacher goes down that path. This preacher has a "body guard" during every service and our church has a security team. Evil abounds in this world and only a fool believes God will protect them.

[JonB_in_Glencoe]

Yes, I believe the USA will be Judged.

I also believe that OT God is NT God, in context with this topic.
Luke 10:12 seals that deal, IMHO.

https://www.biblegateway.com/passage...12&version=KJV

[popper]

Old Testament God, He had very different expectations and standards

Uh, NOPE.

[Alabama358]

Uh, NOPE.

What he said

Hebrews 13:8 Jesus Christ the same yesterday, and to day, and for ever.

[ioon44]

Rev 1:8
New King James Version
“I am the Alpha and the Omega, the Beginning and the End,” says the Lord, “who is and who was and who is to come, the Almighty.”

[Daekar]

A cursory look at history might make your rethink what the NT God will or will not do for His children. Many Christians have suffered in many countries.

We want to believe God will protect us but that is not always the case. I smile when my preacher goes down that path. This preacher has a "body guard" during every service and our church has a security team. Evil abounds in this world and only a fool believes God will protect them.

So... I think there is a difference between what I said and what your preacher says. I asserted that NT God will not mete out punishment to individuals within a nation based on the actions of their compatriots. That's not the same thing as claiming that God will specially protect those same people from suffering, unless one interprets everything that happens at every scale as a deliberate action of God, meaning that an absence of punishment must necessarily correspond to an absence of suffering. That's a Calvinist style Interpretation which essentially does away with free will, and the baggage which comes with that is unsupportable to me.

[BrianL]

An elected government should be the subject of the electorate. When elected 'Officials' decide what their constituents want, rather than asking them, they no longer are representatives and have no value whatsoever to the folks that voted them into office. Impeach the lot of them, start standing up!! If you want to believe that your vote counted and you lost, so be it, but prove that it counted

[BrianL]

The USA will be judged for its LACK of rebellion, when loud screamers that represent 7% of the masses hold sway, we all have no one to blame. Good and fine people who just want to get along...............yeah, that will work.

[Good Cheer]

No good people or innocent babes in old Nineveh or latter day Babylon?

[ioon44]

Mark 10:18
New American Standard Bible
But Jesus said to him, “Why do you call Me good? No one is good except God alone.

If we think we are good, then we deceive ourselves.

[Good Cheer]

Will there be none in latter day Babylon, their treatment a reflection of Genesis 18?
That's a matter deserving of thought considering the admonition to come out of her.

[dverna]

So... I think there is a difference between what I said and what your preacher says. I asserted that NT God will not mete out punishment to individuals within a nation based on the actions of their compatriots. That's not the same thing as claiming that God will specially protect those same people from suffering, unless one interprets everything that happens at every scale as a deliberate action of God, meaning that an absence of punishment must necessarily correspond to an absence of suffering. That's a Calvinist style Interpretation which essentially does away with free will, and the baggage which comes with that is unsupportable to me.

He has done so in the past.

Simple examples:

All woman to suffer during childbirth for the sin of Eve.

The Flood that killed all things. Are we to believe every child deserved to die? Were the animals full of sin as well?

Same for the destruction of Sodom and Gomorrah. Every child deserved to die because every single person was evil.

There are more that our "just" God has done.

[Good Cheer]

He's fair and just. Always has been, always will be.

[ioon44]

He has done so in the past.

Simple examples:

All woman to suffer during childbirth for the sin of Eve.

The Flood that killed all things. Are we to believe every child deserved to die? Were the animals full of sin as well?

Same for the destruction of Sodom and Gomorrah. Every child deserved to die because every single person was evil.

There are more that our "just" God has done.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ImG07uBGhzI

This video truly brings a lot into perspective and should answer your questions as to why.

[Good Cheer]

Discovering the chapter by chapter and verse by verse teaching then standardized by Shepherd's Chapel in the early 90's was when the roles played by the nephilim, the vehicles (aka "horses"), the difference between prophecies called out in days versus months (moons), the seed war... oh so much that makes the bible so simple. Then bumping into the works of IDE Thomas, Jacques Vallee and yes, LA Marzulli (who studied under Thomas), and so many other authors such as JR Church, Chuck Missler and Michael Heiser. Many people of various views, preferring to embrace differing ideas in a few particulars but all brothers in Christ.

Simply put, we're not going to understand our role in this world without along the way also running into the role of the nephilim, the seed war and the workings from Mount Hermon.

[dverna]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ImG07uBGhzI

This video truly brings a lot into perspective and should answer your questions as to why.

A very interesting video. Do I conclude that when God commanded the Flood, Noah and his immediate family were the only people on earth of "pure seed"?

[ioon44]

Genesis 6:9 KJV Context

6And it repented the LORD that he had made man on the earth, and it grieved him at his heart.
7And the LORD said, I will destroy man whom I have created from the face of the earth; both man, and beast, and the creeping thing, and the fowls of the air; for it repented me that I have made them.
8But Noah found grace in the eyes of the LORD.

9These are the generations of Noah: Noah was a just man and perfect in his generations, and Noah walked with God.

10And Noah begat three sons, Shem, Ham, and Japheth.
11The earth also was corrupt before God, and the earth was filled with violence.
12And God looked upon the earth, and, behold, it was corrupt; for all flesh had corrupted his way upon the earth.

[Good Cheer]

It's always been a seed war ever since God made us flesh.

[ioon44]

It's always been a seed war ever since God made us flesh.

Genesis 3:15 English Standard Version
15 I will put enmity between you and the woman, and between your offspring and her offspring; he shall bruise your head, and you shall bruise his heel.”

[Good Cheer]

Speaking of the crooked serpent, Christ's heel and such things, many years ago I came to understand that the story of Messiah is shown in the constellations as viewed from Earth and is sculpted into the face of the planet for this time.
About thirty years ago I sat down with my better 2/3's with the world atlas opened to the two page spread of the Mideast and showed it to her. We stared at each other wide eyed across the dinner table with goose bumps as we felt the spirit moving through the room. Like "WOW did you feel that?"!
By the way, this really is leading me to wonder what other signs God will give us including that in the heavens of the return of Christ. We'll see!