I shoot a 230 grain in a 7.62x39 bolt gun using AP70 (UNIVERSAL) 1000 fps using 6 grains of powder with perfect stability. It needs a good crimp . Very quiet with a sound moderator and quieter than a 22 without.
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I shoot a 230 grain in a 7.62x39 bolt gun using AP70 (UNIVERSAL) 1000 fps using 6 grains of powder with perfect stability. It needs a good crimp . Very quiet with a sound moderator and quieter than a 22 without.
The Bird of Time has but a little way
To fly-and Lo! the bird is on the wing
Honestly, questions like this are why Quickload is such a powerful tool. My own experience has been that incomplete burn leads to much of the muzzle blast and even increases perceived recoil. I was amazed at how much more pleasant shooting can be with a significantly reduced muzzle blast, even without a can. When I saw burn data - I realized that many of the "case full of slow burn powder" recipes may see 70-80% burn, and that's why you get the massive "Ka-Whomp" that sounds like a howitzer.
It also makes a huge difference hunting when you're shooting at dawn or dusk, as nearly complete burn reduces muzzle flash considerably.
If it was me, I would shoot for a load that produces nearly 100% burn prior to the suppressor. That means all you need to tame is the hot gas, not a cloud of burning powder grains. As a side benefit, you should get less fouling in the suppressor.
Best of luck on your quest.
My suppressed AR 300 Blk w/8.5in barrel w/cast P.C. 233gr. bullet and a standard bolt took 10.8gr. of A1680 to cycle and lock the bolt back. I purchased a more efficient bolt carrier and that took 8.5gr of A1680 to cycle and lock back with same cast bullet. Thats everything being clean. I settled on a load of 8.8gr of A1680 . Be safe! Always make sure the bullet makes it out of the barrel. Dont ask...
My suppressed AR 300 Blk w/8.5in barrel w/cast P.C. 233gr. bullet and a standard bolt took 10.8gr. of A1680 to cycle and lock the bolt back. I purchased a more efficient bolt carrier group and that took 8.5gr of A1680 to cycle and lock back with same cast bullet. Thats with everything being clean. I settled on a load of 8.8gr of A1680 . Be safe! Always make sure the bullet makes it out of the barrel.
What more efficient bolt carrier?Originally Posted by D.Bullets
Well….I have to ask now!!!��. Just kidding
Thanks
Subsonic ammo sound levels will generally be lower with lower muzzle pressure. Faster burning powders and less airspace help reduce muzzle pressure.
Here are some Quickload evaluations for different powders as needed to get 1020 fps from a 10" BO. I sorted by muzzle pressure and only included some of the better results.
We will start off with a 150. You did not specify bullet. I used a Lee and seated 0.25" deep (length of the neck).
And here is a Lee 180. Again 0.250" seating depth. Note the first trailboss load shown is compressed at 1020 fps. Probably not a good choice. I re-ran that one powder at 100% fill and added it in with the lower resultant velocity. The Clays load looks pretty good and should let you get a little more speed.Code:Cartridge : .300 AAC Blackout (SAAMI) Bullet : .309, 150, LEE C309-150-F Cartridge O.A.L. L6: 1.982 inch = 50.34 mm Barrel Length : 10.0 inch = 254.0 mm C A U T I O N : any load listed can result in a powder charge that falls below minimum suggested loads or exceeds maximum suggested loads as presented in current handloading manuals. Understand that all of the listed powders can be unsuitable for the given combination of cartridge, bullet and gun. Actual load order can vary, depending upon lot-to-lot powder and component variations. USE ONLY FOR COMPARISON ! Powder type Filling/Loading Ratio Charge Charge Vel. Prop.Burnt P max P muzz B_Time % Grains Gramm fps % psi psi ms --------------------------------- ----------------------------------------------------------------- Hodgdon Clays 49.1 4.4 0.29 1020 100.0 25069 1968 1.094 25069 1968 IMR TrailBoss 95.1 6.0 0.39 1020 100.0 21867 2012 1.155 21867 2012 Hodgdon TiteGroup 31.0 4.8 0.31 1020 100.0 20766 2064 1.161 20766 2064 Lovex S015 44.0 4.6 0.30 1020 100.0 20296 2084 1.172 20296 2084 Accurate Solo 1000 44.0 4.6 0.30 1020 100.0 20296 2084 1.172 20296 2084 Alliant RED DOT 46.2 4.3 0.28 1020 100.0 20974 2089 1.165 20974 2089 Lovex S011 36.7 4.7 0.30 1020 100.0 18702 2124 1.190 18702 2124 Alliant GREEN DOT 43.5 4.6 0.30 1020 100.0 19449 2133 1.198 19449 2133 Lovex D013 42.9 4.2 0.27 1020 100.0 19425 2140 1.190 19425 2140 Accurate Nitro 100 42.9 4.2 0.27 1020 100.0 19425 2140 1.190 19425 2140 Hodgdon HP38 31.0 4.9 0.32 1020 100.0 18356 2153 1.204 18356 2153 Winchester 231 34.6 4.9 0.32 1020 100.0 18002 2173 1.212 18002 2173 Accurate Solo 1250 43.1 4.8 0.31 1020 100.0 17552 2182 1.220 17552 2182 Lovex D032 28.9 4.6 0.30 1020 100.0 17729 2189 1.214 17729 2189 Hodgdon Universal 38.9 4.7 0.30 1020 100.0 17144 2253 1.253 17144 2253
Code:Cartridge : .300 AAC Blackout (SAAMI) Bullet : .309, 180, LEE C309-180-R Cartridge O.A.L. L6: 2.127 inch = 54.03 mm Barrel Length : 10.0 inch = 254.0 mm C A U T I O N : any load listed can result in a powder charge that falls below minimum suggested loads or exceeds maximum suggested loads as presented in current handloading manuals. Understand that all of the listed powders can be unsuitable for the given combination of cartridge, bullet and gun. Actual load order can vary, depending upon lot-to-lot powder and component variations. USE ONLY FOR COMPARISON ! Powder type Filling/Loading Ratio Charge Charge Vel. Prop.Burnt P max P muzz B_Time % Grains Gramm fps % psi psi ms --------------------------------- ----------------------------------------------------------------- IMR TrailBoss 110.5 7.0 0.45 1020 100.0 30089 2300 1.105 IMR TrailBoss 100.0 6.3 0.41 965 100.0 25583 2100 1.187 Hodgdon Clays 57.9 5.2 0.34 1020 100.0 32905 2300 1.065 Hodgdon TiteGroup 36.2 5.5 0.36 1020 100.0 28262 2373 1.114 Lovex S015 51.3 5.3 0.35 1020 100.0 27577 2393 1.123 Accurate Solo 1000 51.3 5.3 0.35 1020 100.0 27577 2393 1.123 Alliant RED DOT 54.0 5.1 0.33 1020 100.0 28297 2407 1.118 Lovex S011 42.5 5.4 0.35 1020 100.0 25755 2413 1.138 Alliant GREEN DOT 50.5 5.3 0.34 1020 100.0 26536 2436 1.142 Hodgdon HP38 35.9 5.7 0.37 1020 100.0 25293 2444 1.149 Lovex D013 49.9 4.9 0.32 1020 100.0 26423 2454 1.138 Accurate Nitro 100 49.9 4.9 0.32 1020 100.0 26423 2454 1.138 Accurate Solo 1250 49.6 5.6 0.36 1020 100.0 24344 2456 1.161 Lovex D032 33.2 5.2 0.34 1020 100.0 24544 2458 1.156 Winchester 231 39.9 5.7 0.37 1020 100.0 24833 2461 1.155 Hodgdon Universal 44.6 5.4 0.35 1020 100.0 23656 2531 1.185
Last edited by P Flados; 05-15-2023 at 12:38 AM.
P Flados!! That is so Cool!! Thank you! That is very informative.
If time ever permits, I would love to see the data on the Lee TL309-230-5R boolit!
Thanks again,
Don
I looked for the TL309-230-5R but it was not in the QL bullet list. Can you provide actual weight, bullet length & your COAL.
Yes, COAL..2.240. Actual bullet weight. 227 gr. Length….1.36
Yes, COAL..2.240. Actual bullet weight. 227 gr.
The 230 seating depth came to 0.487" based on your inputs. The reduced case capacity made trailboss not work due to excess compression. Also note that the Clays load looks hotter than recommended for many guns.
Code:Cartridge : .300 AAC Blackout (SAAMI) Bullet : .309, 200, LEE TL 309-230 Cartridge O.A.L. L6: 2.240 inch = 56.90 mm Barrel Length : 10.0 inch = 254.0 mm C A U T I O N : any load listed can result in a powder charge that falls below minimum suggested loads or exceeds maximum suggested loads as presented in current handloading manuals. Understand that all of the listed powders can be unsuitable for the given combination of cartridge, bullet and gun. Actual load order can vary, depending upon lot-to-lot powder and component variations. USE ONLY FOR COMPARISON ! Powder type Filling/Loading Ratio Charge Charge Vel. Prop.Burnt P max P muzz B_Time % Grains Gramm fps % psi psi ms --------------------------------- ----------------------------------------------------------------- Hodgdon Clays 83.9 5.9 0.38 1020 100.0 55454 2417 1.018 !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE! Hodgdon TiteGroup 51.8 6.2 0.40 1020 100.0 49289 2454 1.045 ! Near Maximum ! Hodgdon HP38 51.1 6.3 0.41 1020 100.0 44740 2500 1.066 Alliant RED DOT 77.7 5.7 0.37 1020 100.0 48546 2511 1.050 ! Near Maximum ! Winchester 231 56.7 6.3 0.41 1020 100.0 43991 2513 1.071 Alliant GREEN DOT 72.2 5.9 0.38 1020 100.0 46172 2516 1.061 Accurate Nitro 100 71.4 5.5 0.35 1020 100.0 45864 2549 1.062 Accurate No.2 60.2 5.9 0.38 1020 100.0 38476 2573 1.100 Hodgdon Universal 63.2 6.0 0.39 1020 100.0 41702 2576 1.088 Winchester WAP 50.6 6.5 0.42 1020 100.0 35390 2681 1.125 Alliant UNIQUE 61.7 5.8 0.38 1020 100.0 36096 2686 1.126 Alliant BULLSEYE 55.0 5.4 0.35 1020 100.0 36469 2704 1.116
Thanks again P Flados!!! This is extremely helpful!! I can’t thank you enough.
Don
I would be sorely tempted to roll some of those Bullseye and Unique loads. My only question is if it would cycle the action properly.
Which is why I use 1680.
I'd suggest Norma 200, or RL-7 (close 2nd)
See https://castboolits.gunloads.com/sho...=1#post4967562
(Similar challenge)
I do not have a suppressor and shoot a 150 grain bullet from a 16inch 300BLK AR-loaded as a single shot. So far, I have found Red Dot to be the absolute quietest; Clays is the most accurate. I only test them to 50 yards.
Here are the loads that have worked for me:
Looking at the quick load data is fascinating! I never considered “MUZZLE PSI”. What’s even more interesting is that muzzle psi and chamber psi don’t necessarily correlate.
You folks have been a ton of help.!!
Thanks again,
Don
In general for the quietest loads - Keep your velocity below .94 of the speed of sound, use the fastest burning powder you can. Also note the speed of sound can vary based on temperature, altitude and humidity. Shooting in Florida in the summer is different than Colorado in winter. Plan accordingly.
So… now I need another mold. Between 150-180, no gas check (preferably)that will load in an ar300 blk. I have the Lee 150 fp but it won’t cycle with the flat nose.
Don
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