Accuracy testing standards?

[FergusonTO35]

As always, Larry brings the knowledge!

[44MAG#1]

As always, Larry brings the knowledge!

That is true.
Every forum is like a ship in the ocean of shooters, plinkers, handloaders, and experimenters, amateur Gunsmiths and gun buyers and amatuer ballistic knowledge slingers.
That ship always need a selfless captain that steers the ship in that ocean.
I listen to him and look at his tests too.
Thanks

[dogdoc]

2 inches or less off a rest at 25 yards for 5 or 6 shots is my standard . Some thing that groups well at 10 yards can spread way out at 25 or more. Even Handloader magazine has been doing accuracy test at 15 yards off a ransom rest no less. A bad joke in my mind.

[Frank V]

I like to shoot a handgun off of sandbags at 25yds I am looking for 2-1/2” @ 25yds with a full size handgun, not a target pistol.

[44MAG#1]

I like to shoot a handgun off of sandbags at 25yds I am looking for 2-1/2” @ 25yds with a full size handgun, not a target pistol.

So in other words you are looking for 9.55 MOA accuracy?

[Outpost75]

So in other words you are looking for 9.55 MOA accuracy?

The black powder era Ordnance Corps acceptance dating from 1887 for the S&W Schofield .45 Single Action being a Mean Diagonal for six shots rested off sandbags not to exceed one inch per ten yards of range. British Army adopted the same standard for the .455 revolver in 1902.

When I was at Ruger in the 1980s Six Series fixed sight .38 and .357 revolvers for the US Army CID, Office of Naval Intelligence, Customs and Border Patrol, State Dept. Security, as well as the India National Police, French Gendamarie Nationale, RCMP, Royal Ulster Constabulary and London Metropolitan Police were all tested to the same standard.

[44MAG#1]

The black powder era Ordnance Corps acceptance for the .45 Single Action Army of Mean Diagonal for six shots rested ofc sandbags not to exceed one inch per ten yards of range. British Army adopted the same standard for the .455 revolver in 1902.

My calculator tells me that is 2.5 inches at 25 yards or 9.55 MOA.

[Outpost75]

My calculator tells me that is 2.5 inches at 25 yards or 9.55 MOA.

So? And your point is????

[44MAG#1]

So? And your point is????

Try to get a clear understanding.
BTW, I am probably mistaken but isn't that 2.7777 Mils?

[Outpost75]

Try to get a clear understanding.
BTW, I am probably mistaken but isn't that 2.7777 Mils?

Have not calculated, but sounds about right. Revolvers generally not a long range weapon so if a trooper could hit an 18 inch barrel head at 100 yards with his Colt single action rested over the the saddle, that was considered OK.

[44MAG#1]

Have not calculated, but sounds about right. Revolvers generally not a long range weapon so if a trooper could hit an 18 inch barrel head at 100 yards with his Colt single action rested over the the saddle, that was considered OK.

17.2 MOA is not so good nowadays.
Especially in IHMSA.
Or by Elmer Keith standards.

[dtknowles]

This, 2 to 3 inches at 25 yards is sort of a proof test to me. If a full-size repeating handgun can't do that with factory ammo it is either flawed or of poor quality or design. You should be easily able to find a handgun that will meet that performance requirement. Yeah, we are talking like 10 moa but we are not talking about accuracy competitions. If we are talking about NRA Bullseye or IHMSA that is a different story and if we are talking single shot handguns again, a different story. Put a scope into the mix and more different. A Contender with a scope should put them all in one hole at 25 yards.
Tim

[44MAG#1]

I don't expect Glocks to shoot accuracy wise as well as a 1911.
Few shooters will notice the difference due to most shooters ability and the type of shooting they do.
BTW I think the shooters that want "real" (see the parentheses", are getting fewer and fewer as time goes on. Just give most a handgun and some ammo and let them blast.
Then pack up and go home and then tell the friends and family how well they shot.

[Thumbcocker]

Yup. And its sad.

[Frank V]

So in other words you are looking for 9.55 MOA accuracy?

A 2-1/2” group if it’s symmetrical, means no shot is farther than 1-1/4” from point of aim. This accuracy has allowed me to take several deer that were 75 to 115 yards from me with an iron sight handgun from a rest.

If 9.55 MOA=100yds would this put each shot about 4-3/8” from point of aim?
I am not arguing, just trying to understand.

[44MAG#1]

A 2-1/2” group if it’s symmetrical, means no shot is farther than 1-1/4” from point of aim. This accuracy has allowed me to take several deer that were 75 to 115 yards from me with an iron sight handgun from a rest.

If 9.55 MOA=100yds would this put each shot about 4-3/8” from point of aim?
I am not arguing, just trying to understand.

9.55MOA equals 9.99 inches so that would make each shot 4.999 inches from point of aim. Or 1. 389 Mil. from point of aim.
BTW, 4.999 inches is 126.985MM or 12.697CM.

[Outpost75]

17.2 MOA is not so good nowadays.
Especially in IHMSA.
Or by Elmer Keith standards.

That represents less than 1% of handgun users. Police, Military and self defense users do not require that level of precision, especially when close tolerances impede reliability under harsh environmental conditions. Gamesmanship and handgun huntimg is mostly ego stimulation, entertainment and mental masturbation.

[44MAG#1]

That represents less than 1% of handgun users. Police, Military and self defense users do not require that level of precision, especially when close tolerances impede reliability under harsh environmental conditions. Gamesmanship and handgun huntimg is mostly ego stimulation, entertainment and mental masturbation.

Tolerances impeding reliability under harsh environmental conditions is never good.
Close tolerances aid accuracy while impeding reliability for sure. I wouldn't want to carry a Bullseye set up 1911 as a carry gun while expecting reliability over a wide spectrum of carry conditions especially the way I eat. It is down the front of my shirt and even in my pockets sometimes. I am sure it gets in my holster sometimes.
While gamesmanship is mostly entertainment and mental masturbation it keeps the mind working and alert on how to come up with newer ways and more training on how to hose down the environment with hot lead.

[Frank V]

Thank you 44MAG#1.

[Outpost75]

@44Mag#1 I am glad that we mostly agree. Please carry on!