While waiting for a lane at my range the other week, I saw that they had a couple of "nearly like new condition" used small revolvers that looked almost identical.
A S&W 31-1 and a Rossi 32 that were originally purchased by the same individual approx. 50 years ago. Both had boxes and original sales paperwork and looked as if they could be unfired. The Rossi price was much less, but the cylinder gap was fatter and the plastic grips pushed me into getting my first Smith.
Hey ncmn, is the MP mould you’ve been casting with the 98 gr DEWC with crimp grooves near both ends and a rather large grease groove in the middle? Did you have any difficulty getting the bullets to release from the mould? I’ll have to take another look at mine, I guess.
Froggie
"It aint easy being green!"
P Flados, welcome to the club! Looks like you are starting with a very nice one. Is it marked MOD 31-1? Normally a 31 has a square butt, but then again there have been some randomly marked as 30 or 31 without proper attention to round vs square butts, the only difference between the models. I’ve read the pertinent passages in 2 or 3 editions of the Standard Catalog of Smith & Wesson several times and even discussed it with one of the editors of the books, and I’m still not comfortable that I’ve got it right. I only know that the MOD 30 should have a round butt and the MOD 31 should have a square butt, but who knows what evil lurks on the S&W assembly lines!
Regardless, welcome to the 32 madness... and enjoy it!
Froggie
"It aint easy being green!"
There used to be a Mr. Garfolo, aka GAR reloading out of New Jersey. He sold molds, alloys and lube. He claimed the Saeco DEWC with the large center lube groove was his design. The intent was to lower the cause of overlubing a wc and widening groups. I spoke with him on the phone and I have a fair communication with basic Italian, but between his Jersey accent and my Rocky Mountain rambling we had a difficult time understanding each other.Originally Posted by Green Frog
[The Montana Gianni] Front sight and squeeze
Anyone using the New Nitro-100NF in yer 32?? Looks like dropping one whole grain from published (old) Nitro-100 load data might be a starting point!!
No Takers??? Maybe I try...just wondering if it can end up a suitable replacement for Bullseye? Which is hard to Find, and harder to Pay For...if found!!!
Green Frog, yes that is the mold that I got, and yes they are a little hard to get out of the mold. It was the first time I used it, so I hope that it gets better with use. I will probably cast some more tomorrow, as I will have all of them loaded today.
Insufficient draft angle in that big lube groove? Hard to fix, if that's the case.
Cognitive Dissident
You are correct (of course):
I am not new to 32 madness. I started with a SP-101 4.2" 327 purchased new in 2016 (photo at bottom).
Since then I have dabbled in a couple of TC contender based stub tube guns that shoot my "32" bullets through 0.308" barrels.
I have fired lots of my "32 ACP rimmed" rounds through a 7.4" stub tube Contender. I used the gun for offhand practice at 30 ft. I ran a "mouse fart" 55 gr NLG tumble lube (I made the mold) over 1.7 gr Titegroup for a calculated 888 fps.
I am working on a new Stub tube that will shoot the same boolits but will use easily converted 9mm brass so that I can load buckets of ammo during the winter for year round use. castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?464780-Extra-Low-Cost-options-for-volume-shooting
Last edited by P Flados; 03-02-2024 at 04:33 PM.
100NF is a very fast ball powder. It will use small charges and should meter ok if you so choose. Unless you need to push your 32, 100NF should be acceptable.
A Quickload run might help you, but you were pretty short on details such as: cartridge, barrel length, bullet weight, bullet length (or brand/style if common), desired pressure, desired velocity.
I found a picture of the MP 98 gr at https://www.mp-molds.com/product/32-...aluminum-mold/
If you powder coat, a defensive load could have the bullet seated with 95% of the lube groove exposed. I saw no dimensions, but estimate a seating depth of around 0.28". On the other hand if you seat "normally" seating depth is going to be something like 0.5" or more. I will run a 327 table with a 0.550" seating depth (0.600" bullet, 1.230" COAL, 1.180" case).
You also did not specify barrel length. Note that for the QL run below, barrel length is breech to muzzle and QL does not account for cylinder gap (I usually subtract 50 fps).
32 H&R with a similar 0.550" seating depth:Code:Cartridge : .327 Federal Magnum Bullet : .312, 98 gr x 0.6" Cartridge O.A.L. L6: 1.230 inch = 31.24 mm Barrel Length : 6.0 inch = 152.4 mm Powder : Alliant BULLSEYE CAUTION: Figures exceed maximum and minimum recommended loads ! Step Fill. Charge Vel. Energy Pmax Pmuz Prop.Burnt B_Time % % Grains fps ft.lbs psi psi % ms -25.0 59 3.00 1029 230 16854 2797 97.4 0.751 -22.5 61 3.10 1055 242 17966 2893 98.0 0.729 -20.0 62 3.20 1081 254 19122 2985 98.6 0.708 -17.5 64 3.30 1106 266 20321 3074 99.0 0.688 -15.0 66 3.40 1131 278 21566 3159 99.4 0.669 -12.5 68 3.50 1155 290 22857 3240 99.7 0.651 -10.0 70 3.60 1179 302 24194 3318 99.9 0.634 -07.5 72 3.70 1203 315 25579 3392 100.0 0.618 -05.0 74 3.80 1226 327 27013 3461 100.0 0.603 -02.5 76 3.90 1248 339 28497 3529 100.0 0.589 +00.0 78 4.00 1271 351 30032 3596 100.0 0.575 +02.5 80 4.10 1293 364 31619 3663 100.0 0.562 +05.0 82 4.20 1314 376 33260 3730 100.0 0.550 +07.5 84 4.30 1336 388 34955 3796 100.0 0.538 +10.0 86 4.40 1357 401 36707 3862 100.0 0.527 +12.5 88 4.50 1378 413 38517 3928 100.0 0.516 ! Near Maximum !
Code:Cartridge : .32 H&R Magnum Bullet : .312, 98, Cartridge O.A.L. L6: 1.117 inch = 28.37 mm Barrel Length : 6.0 inch = 152.4 mm Powder : Alliant BULLSEYE CAUTION: Figures exceed maximum and minimum recommended loads ! Step Fill. Charge Vel. Energy Pmax Pmuz Prop.Burnt B_Time % % Grains fps ft.lbs psi psi % ms -36.0 47 1.60 687 103 8241 1244 80.5 1.095 -32.0 50 1.70 722 114 9197 1353 82.9 1.040 -28.0 53 1.80 758 125 10222 1462 85.1 0.991 -24.0 56 1.90 792 137 11319 1571 87.2 0.946 -20.0 59 2.00 827 149 12488 1678 89.1 0.904 -16.0 62 2.10 860 161 13734 1783 90.8 0.863 -12.0 65 2.20 893 174 15057 1887 92.3 0.826 -08.0 67 2.30 926 186 16460 1987 93.7 0.792 -04.0 70 2.40 958 200 17947 2085 94.9 0.761 +00.0 73 2.50 989 213 19519 2180 96.0 0.732 +04.0 76 2.60 1020 226 21180 2272 97.0 0.705 ! Near Maximum !
Last edited by P Flados; 03-02-2024 at 05:09 PM.
Yes...details.. Been loading for a Ruger SSM (H&R Mag) since ??? maybe 1990..or so, Darn thing, should have had the cylinder throats opened long ago.. as it does quite well indeed when sized to .311 tho it is small but, .13 is too big IMO...and I never have come up with a .312..we only push the 98Gr swc to 1150, in S&WL brass, using Unique or AA#5.. But been over 1300 using H-110, in H&R brass... it is after all a 9-1/2 barrel...so no Strain really..
Because I also shoot a 4" H&R, Solid Frame, regularly, (I just kinda like the thing) so do Not over extend S&S Long loadings. which top at very close to 800 fps using that same 98Gr SWC, sized .313,and at (lazy) times .314.. #5 is King in the S&W Long Caliber here...but Unique is No Slouch.. Besides all that... I acquired a small stash of 90GR RN, that work great in S&W (not Long) over Red Dot, in the H&R for Right close to 800fps..and a smaller (much smaller) dose of Red Dot in the Break top H&R...which is Still Not Pleasant! IDK what the Ruger does with these...as I have Not cared to run them..
Finally 71gr FMJ's already small at .311 plus a tiny bit.. Not in the Break top...750fps in the 4" H&R using BE-86...just to experiment. And Loaded over a healthy dose of #5 in S&W Long cases, 1250 fps out of the 9-1/2 inch Ruger..
Admittedly backing off to 1050FPS in the Ruger produces markedly Better accuracy...
While I have loaded Many Wadcutters...They are just Not my preference..
I would Not mind, slowing down a bit on most of these loadings in my H&R, as it is almost comfortable at 600 to just under 750fps especially using the 90 gr LRN.. so ...tempted to drop 1.5 gr of Nitro100NF, in the S&W case, and See what happens...
Anyway...That is My Story. And I only look into the Nitro 100 loads because it is doing very well indeed using Published data in 38Spl and 45's of 2 descriptions... so...Feeling brave I tried reduced 44 Mag loadings and am Very encouraged!!!
That’s what I figured. That’s the only mould design I ever remember Dale (Dale53) saying he had so much trouble he gave up on it. He was pretty surprised because he was a big fan of MP moulds. Please keep me informed how yours works.
Froggy
"It aint easy being green!"
The above was one item that I extracted from a rather rambling reply. For your 90 gr, QL data would be better if I had bullet length and desired COAL, but I will just use a Lee 93 RN and default COL for now. I found info said to come from Accurate folks that 100NF in pistols will have a max allowed charge around 10% below the original Nitro 100. QL only has the original.
This powder has a very fast burn rate and is pretty "fluffy" taking up a good bit of case volume. Predicted velocities seemed low to me right up to the point of approaching max allowed pressure. With the small range of acceptable charges and the old vs new version stuff, I am not sure I would use it the 32 short without pressure tested load data.
I then ran looking for "best powders" and only gained 30 to 40 fps with Titegroup being one of the better choices that is also known to be not so to hard to find.
For 32 long and a Lee 93, Nitro 100 seems more useable (again, use say 90% of the below charges with 100NF as approximations). Also note that the QL barrel length and cylinder gap stuff affects velocities as previously described.Code:Cartridge : .32 S&W (Short) Bullet : .311, 93, LEE 311-093-1R Cartridge O.A.L. L6: 0.930 inch = 23.62 mm Barrel Length : 6.0 inch = 152.4 mm Powder : Accurate Nitro 100 Step Fill. Charge Vel. Energy Pmax Pmuz Prop.Burnt B_Time % % Grains fps ft.lbs psi psi % ms -15.0 89 0.60 468 45 8910 351 75.4 1.332 -12.0 92 0.62 482 48 9562 369 76.8 1.290 -09.0 96 0.64 496 51 10249 387 78.3 1.251 -06.0 99 0.66 511 54 10974 404 79.6 1.214 -03.0 102 0.68 525 57 11737 422 81.0 1.179 ! Near Maximum !
Code:Cartridge : .32 S&W Long Bullet : .311, 93, LEE 311-093-1R Cartridge O.A.L. L6: 1.120 inch = 28.45 mm Barrel Length : 6.0 inch = 152.4 mm Powder : Accurate Nitro 100 CAUTION: Figures exceed maximum and minimum recommended loads ! Step Fill. Charge Vel. Energy Pmax Pmuz Prop.Burnt B_Time % % Grains fps ft.lbs psi psi % ms -50.0 25 1.00 493 50 3366 787 80.6 1.667 -45.0 27 1.10 536 59 3938 895 84.1 1.528 -40.0 30 1.20 576 69 4555 1003 87.3 1.414 -35.0 32 1.30 616 78 5218 1111 90.0 1.319 -30.0 34 1.40 654 88 5926 1217 92.3 1.238 -25.0 37 1.50 690 98 6681 1320 94.3 1.168 -20.0 39 1.60 726 109 7482 1420 95.9 1.106 -15.0 42 1.70 760 119 8330 1517 97.3 1.052 -10.0 44 1.80 794 130 9225 1609 98.3 1.003 -05.0 47 1.90 826 141 10167 1696 99.1 0.959 +00.0 49 2.00 857 152 11157 1778 99.6 0.919 +05.0 52 2.10 888 163 12195 1855 99.9 0.883 +10.0 54 2.20 917 174 13281 1926 100.0 0.847 ! Near Maximum !
Last edited by P Flados; 03-02-2024 at 10:28 PM.
P Flados I wasn’t thinking… I knew better. You just threw me when you said it was your first S&W in 32. I’m glad you started with that 30-1 as your first Smith in 32. In many ways it was the ultimate iteration of the 32 Hand Ejector frame that started its development way back in 1899. I may be a little biased, but I still think it’s one of the very best.
Froggie
"It aint easy being green!"
Actually it is my first S&W period. I have been shooting Ruger, Dan Wesson, TC Contender, HiPoint and occasional Glockish stuff for handguns.
I almost bought a 3" S&W 357 J frame when I bought a 38 LCRx (very happy with the LCRx by the way), but I have something off an emotional aversion to supporting a company that markets a 357, then goes back and says do not shoot a regular diet of full power loads. For the gun I bought, 32 SW Long power level is fine and the gun is "high margin" for shooting a near infinite volume of these rounds.
P Flados, if you want a little more power out of the 30-1, a cottage industry has arisen to deepen the chambers of the -1 Models in 32 S&W. l to H&R. The folks over on the S&W forum discuss it frequently. I wouldn’t want to go up to Skeeter level loads, but factory level loads work well. OTOH, any 32 S&W L load a sane person can put together (and these can be pretty warm!) will be fine in that revolver. Have funL
Froggie
"It aint easy being green!"
P Flados
Thank you for running that Data... I do Not know how all that works nor perhaps how to properly interpret it, But, wonders why we decided to Stop at 13,200 psi on the Long, and 11,700 on the Regular S&W??
Even the conservative SAAMI runs the Neutered, S&W Long to 15,000, and the regular to 17,000, used to be 18,000!!!!
Note I am Not loading a Break Top! Nor am I trying to make a Magnum...Just keep the cases from being smoked black, from extremely low pressure.
Again...Thanks, and for my next act, I will probably start that 90 gr RN with 1.5 gr of Nitro100NF, in S&W Long. Shoot em and See!!
Hey Froggie, I went over to the S&W site but couldn't find any mention of converting Model 30's to 32 H&R. Sigh, why do so many sites have such stinky search functions? I have one that I'd like to have rechambered, but haven't been able to find anybody reasonably local to do the deed. A multi-year waiting list at this stage of my life seems futile. I am told "You can't take' em with you."
_________________________________________________It's not that I can't spell: it is that I can't type.
Thanks Tinman! That is a help. I may end up doing it myself
_________________________________________________It's not that I can't spell: it is that I can't type.
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