Swaging 50ae 300/gr bullets using 45/acp brass for jackets, 500/pc lot

[KAYDADOG]

This was another bullet I wanted to make since I had the cases ready to go from about five years ago.
From my initial testing I found that the cases needed to be trimmed to 0.800" to get a better overall finished length.
With a 3/4-E point profile the 300/gr bullets come out about 0.090" longer than a factory bullet.
When seated around 1.580" and a light taper crimp the finished round for my cost will be less than the cost of a primer today.
I usually load these with 30/gr of IMR 4227 and used this weight to load the dummy round.
This will also result in a slightly compressed load which usually is more desirable for a more consistent round.
Without a powder charge or filler, the bullet just can't be seated because it will drop into the case when seated.
No case belling is needed for seating the bullet due to the base of the 45/acp case not expanding to 0.500"

I based the core weight on using Blazer 45/acp cases. This would give me a finished weight on average of 300/gr +/- 1/gr.
Federal cases were very close, but Winchester cases could be almost -8/gr light.
Even weighing the Blazer cases they could be several grains heavier or lighter from the average weight.
There is just to many variables involved to get within +/- 0.5/gr even with swaging the cores.
With a 300/gr bullet I really don't think several grains heavier or lighter will affect their accuracy.
If I were making match bullets for distance then everything would be within 0.05/gr or better, but I'm not making match pistol bullets.



The pictures will just show the various stages required to make a finished bullet.
Lead billets to make the 0.365" diameter lead wire, twenty lengths
500 45/acp cases, trimmed to 0.800 and ID/OD deburred, induction annealed, and mouth flared
500 Lead cut cores to 210/gr
500 Lead swaged finished cores to 208.0/gr
500 45/acp cases, core seated
500 finished 300/gr bullets with cannelure for 50/AE
1 50/AE 6" Dessert Eagle Barrel, Clip and Dummy Sample Round

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[cwtebay]

Impressive work!
Are they shooting well?

Sent from my Pixel 5 using Tapatalk

[Sasquatch-1]

This is time consuming, but what isn't when swaging. I take each combination of jacket and core and weigh. If it is heavier than the desired weight, I trim a little lead of the bottom of the core. If it is light, I add some of the squirts I get when core forming. Finished product is usually within 1/20th of a grain. This is making 44 slugs.

[Lakehouse2012]

I am impressed Kaydadog! Those look fantastic, I can't wait to try these!! Thanks for sharing with us all!

[M.A.D]

Look awesome... considering 50 AE factory projectiles run at about $1.50 each here.... And you can buy once fired 45 acp for about 10 cents each . Worth looking into...

[Outer Rondacker]

Looks great. These would feed the wolf well also.

[KAYDADOG]

Thank you everyone for your comments. When I can get to this point it makes the hobby very enjoyable plus it just justifies the cost of the die set.
It also justifies all the time and effort put into the equipment that actually make them. These 300/gr bullets are just the smaller version of the 500 S&W 400-500/GR ones that I make. I only required a 50/Cal two die set because I just use the Core Swaging Die from my 44/Cal three die set.

Your exactly right on the cost of 50/AE bullets. Many years ago, when they were $0.50 per bullet, I couldn't justify buying them at that price. Now they are two to three times the price depending on what you buy or if you can even get them right now. That's why I purchased a 10" 440/Corbon barrel back then to shoot lower cost 44/Cal bullets. For all the calibers that I've posted my cost is probably $0.05 each or less due to the quantity of brass purchased years ago. Per 100 rounds it does take on the average of at least one hour plus. So, for me my time is free. The way the prices are going in the market and if your young enough the initial investment will not take that long to pay for itself. I would have liked to be where I'm at now twenty years ago, but everything in life never works out like we would like it to. Something else always gets in our way.

Regarding shooting, I've never had an issue with any bullet made if loaded to the correct parameters. If the dies are correct the finished bullets will always be made as good or better than a factory bullet. That's why I now make what I can. Pricing in the market is never going to return to where it was. Primer and Powder costs is a major issue right now. They are not readily available right now and if they are at what cost. Two to four times of what they were just three years ago. Everyone's supply only lasts so long and it is now limiting how much we're willing to shoot.

I always stated I don't like trimming cases, but the 50/AE will be the only exception due to the cost savings. Trimming just adds another three steps and hours of time. When I made this lot about five years ago, I figured out how to do them a little faster. I made a fixture up on an adjustable linear slide that mounts to the table on my 6" wide belt sander. It holds about twelve cases at a time. The linear slide can then be adjusted in to the same reading each time. If I didn't figure out this step, I would never do them one case at a time. The Trimmed or sanded cases then need to be deburred inside and out, more time. When you're doing 500 or 1000 cases at a time, the time involved keeps adding up. Annealing the cases would be the next step. If I'm doing an operation on the hydraulic press and do the annealing at the same time then this time does not get added to the final overall time to complete the lot, time saved. Flaring the case mouth is the last operation required to prepare the case for seating the cores.
On the press alone it took 1500 cycles to complete this 500-piece lot. Core Swaging, Core Seating and Point forming. Plus adding the cannelure, luckily, I use a Corbin PCM-2 powered one. I do have the UCT cannelure which is one of the best hand ones on the market.
You just can't beat hydraulics or powered tools to save time and all the effort to complete all the operations. All I can say is if you see a hydraulic press in operation and the consistency of each operation, you would never want to do swaging on a manual press again.

I give anyone credit that wants to spend the time to get all their bullet weights within a certain range. I still believe several grains plus or minus on most pistol bullets will never affect accuracy that we can see. You would need a professional shooting range setup like the manufacturers have to do the testing. If target shooting, we're usually the largest variable that affects accuracy. Rifle bullets would be the exception because we're dealing with long ranges. Every component here needs to be 100% correct. I always wanted to make my own .308 rifle bullets but could never justify the initial cost. I just don't shoot that many for a $1500 plus die set plus buying the jackets.

Just some more details getting to this point, and it has taken years to get here. There is a big learning curve and I'm still learning new things all the time.
Thanks again for all your comments and input.

[Lakehouse2012]

I need to send a big shoutout to KAYDADOG, I was able to get my mits on some of his 50AE projectiles through a "donation" of alternate materials. I'm jamming them into cases tonight and REALLY impressed! I visited his shop and got to watch the process of creation. What he is creating is a labor of love, his "hobby" is way beyond what most of us would consider commercially available components!

I've got another thread: https://castboolits.gunloads.com/sho...ion-from-44mag

In about 2 weeks, me and the boys are getting together to shot-some-stuff.... I've got 30+ of KAYDADOG's projectiles loaded up and I'm REALLY betting that the 50AE is going to compete with my 45-70 loads at specific distances.

If you are ever looking to get into swagging, keep KADADOG on your short-list of goto folks that know their stuff!

Thanks,

[pacomdiver]

did you make your dies or buy them? this might be a good bullet for the beowulf

[KAYDADOG]

Thank you Lakehouse2012 for the review.
It's been about five years since I first made and shot some of these and I plan on getting out this week myself to shoot 100+ myself.
It was always fun shooting a 50/cal semi-auto pistol.

The only drawback to making 300/gr bullets that look good, was that the cases needed to be shortened to 0.800" an operation which adds a lot of time. Luckily I made up about 700 cases when I first started making them. In my spare time I'll probably make up 1000 more just in case I need them.

Concerning dies everything I use is from Dave Corbin and they are all the H-Style type. When I seriously got back into swaging about seven years ago, I just decided to build my own four post fully automated hydraulic press. All I can say if you can justify buying or building a hydraulic press for swaging bullets, drawing cases or making lead wire, you'll never regret the investment. I think Lakehouse2012 can agree with me on this based on what he's seen.

I do machining for myself but can't justify the time, money and all the failures to make a perfect two or three die set. I'm pretty sure someone like Dave Corbin knows how to make dies and he backs his product up. So, I have a 50/cal two die set for about $500 and there the Big Boys. I make 50/cal bullets for the Desert Eagle and of course the 500/S&W. I've made well over a thousand bullets which puts me over the break-even point of the cost of the dies.
To purchase 400/gr to 500/gr jacketed bullets for the 500/S&W will cost $1 to $2 minimum each at today's prices. Using 45/ACP cases for jackets actually costs me less than a cast bullet with a copper gas check. With the hydraulic press I think I can make the jacketed bullets in about the same time as it takes to cast and lube plus add the gas check and you end up having a fully jacketed bullet. Already shot several hundred of the 400/gr version for the 500/S&W. Can't even imagine shooting 500/gr to 700/gr bullets.

Making the lighter 300/gr bullets was just a plus if you own a Desert Eagle. When they first came out bullets were $0.50 plus now probably more. I couldn't justify spending $50 plus to shoot 100 rounds. Purchased a 10" 440 Corbon barrel so I could shoot the cheaper 44/cal jacketed bullets. Now I can go back to shooting the 50/cal bullets for about $5 my cost per 100 bullets, which I can now justify. I now also make the 44/cal bullets using copper jackets or 40/S&W cases for jackets. For me bullets are very reasonable to make. To bad primers and powder have gone up 300% to 400%. Reloaders are going to be slowly forced out of their hobby if this continuous in the near future.

Thank You Everyone, some more information to dwell on.

[Moromane]

Mad props I would absolutely love to send some down my 50Beo looks like a great option!

[KAYDADOG]

I did get to the range last week and shot 129 rounds. 77 rounds of the ones just made and 52 rounds of factory JHP lead point bullets.
The 300/gr bullets made were very accurate. If you could hold steady enough, you were right on center of the target. Because these have a full jacket they fed very well. Had several failures to chamber but the Desert Eagle has some issues with consistent slide cycling. I've been using 30/gr of IMR4227 powder and will use 31.0/gr in the future to see if all chambering issues are eliminated.

The factory JHP bullets actually caused the most jams. The soft lead nose had a tendency to catch before chambering. Have about 192 rounds of these left and will eventually shoot them with the new ones made. Will only use the ones made in the future.

There was an issue while loading with slightly loose bullets. From multiple tests I found that all cases are not made the same. When I used the original IMI cases made for the DE I had no loose bullets. The cases are made heavier which results in the case ID to be sized to 0.495". This gives the right amount of tension to secure the bullet. Using Starline, Speer or USA cases which are all made lighter and when sized the case ID is around
0.498" to 0.499", this will result in a loose bullet. They shoot the same, but the bullet should be tight.

I did find a reliable fix if using other brand cases but won't go into detail for now.

[Sasquatch-1]

In my 44 DE I have found Titegroup tends to work the best for me with a lot less jams. It builds up a higher chamber pressure then the other powders I used. Higher pressures according to the loading data.

As I tell everyone, my DE is the least reliable gun I own. I think my flintlocks are more reliable.