StainLess Steel MediaTitan ReloadingLee PrecisionRotoMetals2
Graf & SonsADvertise hereInline FabricationMidSouth Shooters Supply

Page 2 of 2 FirstFirst 12
Results 21 to 31 of 31

Thread: Lyman M Die Measurements Needed

  1. #21
    Boolit Master Char-Gar's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    Deep South Texas
    Posts
    11,491
    Some notes on case neck expanders;

    There were a number of difference M-type die expanders used for the Lyman 310 system. Many of them are much better for cast bullets than the current Lyman production. Ex: 38/357 available in .357 and .358. 45 hangun in .452 and .454. Various 30 caliber sizes from .308 to .313.

    I have a new set of RCBS expanders from .308 to .311. Two measure dead nuts on, and two are .0002 undersize (not enough to matter)
    Disclaimer: The above is not holy writ. It is just my opinion based on my experience and knowledge. Your mileage may vary.

  2. #22
    Boolit Man
    Join Date
    Nov 2012
    Posts
    128
    Note also the RCBS Cowboy expander for cast usage, marked as .358, although the first step measured .356 on my mic and as noted by another guy before...

  3. #23
    Boolit Mold
    Join Date
    Apr 2014
    Location
    Williamsburg, VA
    Posts
    4
    Hello. New to the site and so far reloaded about 800 Colt 45's. Recently bought some cast bullets 0.453" and 0.454". Heard about the Lyman M die, so it's now part of my tool kit.

    Only problem is, the OD of the expander plug is 0.452, but when I run it into a case, it produces a 0.457" ID case mouth opening and the bullets just drop right in. This is BEFORE I get to what I call the secondary shoulder at the top of the die where the case is further expanded for the bullet to fit without lead shavings.

    Any ideas on what I might be doing wrong? I called Lyman and they insist it's the right expander plug.

    Or am I just stuck with trying to find a machinist to turn the plug down.

    Thanks in advance for any suggestions.

    Thanks,

    Bob

  4. #24
    Boolit Master
    Ben's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Location
    Cleveland, AL
    Posts
    8,720
    Bob

    Something is BAD wrong here.

    Let's go over this slow....

    (1) you're sizing your brass in a full length sizing die, correct ?

    (2) I'm sorry , but a .452 outside dia. can't produce a .457 " opening in the end of a case. Theoretically impossible.

    Brass has " spring back ", if you put a .452 " expander in a sized .45 Long Colt case, it should leave you with a .451 or .4505 " opening in the end of the case.

    Sounds like you may be running the M die , expander plug too deep into your sized cases.

    These measurements that you're offering, are you getting these with a dial caliper or a good micrometer ?

    Ben

  5. #25
    Moderator



    JonB_in_Glencoe's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    Land of 10,000 Lakes
    Posts
    9,584
    Quote Originally Posted by rhwinger View Post
    Hello. New to the site and so far reloaded about 800 Colt 45's. Recently bought some cast bullets 0.453" and 0.454". Heard about the Lyman M die, so it's now part of my tool kit.

    Only problem is, the OD of the expander plug is 0.452, but when I run it into a case, it produces a 0.457" ID case mouth opening and the bullets just drop right in. This is BEFORE I get to what I call the secondary shoulder at the top of the die where the case is further expanded for the bullet to fit without lead shavings.

    Any ideas on what I might be doing wrong? I called Lyman and they insist it's the right expander plug.

    Or am I just stuck with trying to find a machinist to turn the plug down.

    Thanks in advance for any suggestions.

    Thanks,

    Bob
    Did you measure this ?

  6. #26
    Boolit Mold
    Join Date
    Apr 2014
    Location
    Williamsburg, VA
    Posts
    4
    Ben/JonB:

    I am neck sizing with Lee sizing die in an attempt to minimize case hardening. May have to rethink this as I experienced some jamming when trying to load cartridges into the chamber of my Ranch Hand last weekend.

    Measured with digital caliper. When I measure 0.453 and 0.454 Dardas cast bullets, I get 0.453 and 0.454. The only "known reference" I have.

    I am inserting expander plug just past the end of the rounded taper, to where the plug just starts to straighten out. The bullet seating shoulder is WAY past the end of the rounded taper, up near the end of the plug where it attaches to the die body. At least that is what I *think* is the seating shoulder.

    In any event, no matter what the caliper says, the bullets just drop into the case mouth?

    Thanks guys.

    Bob
    Last edited by rhwinger; 04-30-2014 at 01:05 PM.

  7. #27
    Boolit Master MGySgt's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    VA
    Posts
    1,531
    Does your expander plug have 45 R on the end of it? (the actual plug where it goes into the case first).

    I believe you have the Rifle expander vice the Pistol Expander. The pistol one has 45 P on it.
    Big Bore = 45+

  8. #28
    Moderator



    JonB_in_Glencoe's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    Land of 10,000 Lakes
    Posts
    9,584
    well, if you measure the expander plug and it's 0.452, and then measure the ID of the neck (not just the case mouth) and it measures 0.457

    Then something else is wrong...maybe your technique...maybe a worn wobbly press ?

    It's tough to diagnose over the interwebs...Honestly it sounds impossible.

    edited:
    PS, what does the ID of the neck measure before expanding with the M die ? as you said, you are using a Neck only sizer die...Maybe you don't have that adjusted correctly...did you read the instructions ?
    Last edited by JonB_in_Glencoe; 04-30-2014 at 09:40 AM. Reason: added PS

  9. #29
    Boolit Master
    CastingFool's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Location
    Michigan
    Posts
    1,479
    Quote Originally Posted by MGySgt View Post
    Does your expander plug have 45 R on the end of it? (the actual plug where it goes into the case first).

    I believe you have the Rifle expander vice the Pistol Expander. The pistol one has 45 P on it.

    That's what I was thinking, too!

  10. #30
    Boolit Mold
    Join Date
    Apr 2014
    Location
    Williamsburg, VA
    Posts
    4
    45 P on the plug.

    It's a fairly new (2 years old) Lee Classic 4 hole press. It does have a little slop in the action, but always has?

    I am neck sizing by inserting the case into the standard resizing die about 3/8 - 1/2 inch. I'll try a full length casing resize to see if anything changes. Who knows?

    This is so strange. I must be doing something wrong. Thanks for all your suggestions.

    New to the site and enjoying the helpful folks here.

    Thanks,

    Bob

  11. #31
    Boolit Master
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Posts
    3,182
    Here are the measurements for a new Lyman 50-70 M die plug.

    This plug is marked on the end 50 R

    This plug is a little different than most rifle plugs. It has 3 diameters close to the bullet diameter.

    .510 diameter - this is the first diameter into the case but its effective length is only .250 long. It looks like a large auto pistol expander it is so short.

    .5145 - this is the step that we are used to and it is .080 long. This step could be polished out to make the first step longer then you can polish down the top step to just over your bullet diameter.

    .5175 - This is not a functional diameter on most M dies but it might help some rifles with oversize bores or you can do some polishing to make the effective lengths and diameters longer or larger. This diameter is .215 long and is the top end of the plug.

    For my use I should have made my own M die expander.
    Last edited by EDG; 04-02-2015 at 01:03 AM.
    EDG

Page 2 of 2 FirstFirst 12

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
Abbreviations used in Reloading

BP Bronze Point IMR Improved Military Rifle PTD Pointed
BR Bench Rest M Magnum RN Round Nose
BT Boat Tail PL Power-Lokt SP Soft Point
C Compressed Charge PR Primer SPCL Soft Point "Core-Lokt"
HP Hollow Point PSPCL Pointed Soft Point "Core Lokt" C.O.L. Cartridge Overall Length
PSP Pointed Soft Point Spz Spitzer Point SBT Spitzer Boat Tail
LRN Lead Round Nose LWC Lead Wad Cutter LSWC Lead Semi Wad Cutter
GC Gas Check