Black Powder substitute

[beemer]

I have always used Goex, never liked fake powder. I talked to my local guy, he said that BP is sometimes hard to find. That being the case what is the best substitute powder for a ML rifle ? I already know I ain't going to like it, probably don't smell right. Just don't want dive into making my own.

Dave

[rodwha]

I only have experience with Pyrodex and Triple 7. I much prefer Triple 7 because it barely fouls, however I’ve generally just used it in revolvers. I’ve often read of the dreaded “crud ring” which I’ve seen explained as due to heavy charges through inlines mostly or from too hot of an ignition that the 209’s provide. Percussion caps ignites both for me just fine.

Pyrodex fouls much more but isn’t quite as strong as Triple 7, which is on par with (in handguns) sporting grade powders such as Swiss and Olde Eynsford (and a few others). From what little I’ve seen Pyrodex tends to either produce similar results to Goex or comes closer to Swiss (in handguns). It could well be differences in powders tested and reported on 20 years ago compared to last year. Who knows? However you could easily use less powder to achieve similar results. Another consideration is that these powders weigh a fair amount less than BP so you’re getting more powder per pound bottle, a little something for the elevated cost.

[AntiqueSledMan]

Hello beemer,

I've been shooting Triple Seven 3F in my long guns for years.
Unable to pick up real Black in our area.

AntiqueSledMan.

[Shawlerbrook]

Another satisfied 777 user.

[Tar Heel]

Been using Pyrodex for decades in percussion guns, mostly revolvers. Great stuff. I only use holy black in the flintlocks. I also hunt with a patched RB, not a sabot slug. If you have one of those modern thangs, an inline I think it's called, the 777 may be what the doctor ordered.

[freakonaleash]

You can mail order real black powder and they will deliver it right to your door. There must be a 1/2 dozen outfits that will do mail order.

[mooman76]

I've had good luck with Pyrodex. I've shot it for over 30 years because getting real Black was hard to come by.

[frogleg]

I started with Pyrodex when I bought my 1st. Caplock Thompson center in the 80s and it worked fine and it was easy to find. I joined a local club and we bough’t real black in bulk, and I began shooting flintlocks so I quit using pyrodex. I have used 777 in my cap locks and it does clean up easy but kind of expensive. —-If I could not find real black ——and I was shooting cap locks I would shoot 777. Or I would use Pyrodex and make sure I cleaned soon after shooting, and follow up soon after. It seems to be more corrosive than real black.

[Buzzard II]

Try Powder, Inc. for the real black. Jerry is good to deal with. Good shooting.
Bob

[Sasquatch-1]

If you ever get to the Washington D. C. area there is a guy just outside Winchester Va. that sells real black powder. The name of his business is Back Creek Gun Shop. Only thing is you have to call and make an appointment.

BACK CREEK GUN SHOP, INC
863 Chestnut Grove Road * Winchester, VA 22603
PHONE: (540) 888 3349 -
E-MAIL: bcgsi@hughes.net
barrel
Web page: blackpowderva.com


Back Creek Gun Shop, Inc. has been selling black powder since 1972.
We are located 7 miles north of Winchester, VA
Adjacent to the North - South Skirmish Association Range
as you exit Ft. Shenandoah Range

[Buzzard II]

If you ever get to the Washington D. C. area there is a guy just outside Winchester Va. that sells real black powder. The name of his business is Back Creek Gun Shop. Only thing is you have to call and make an appointment.

BACK CREEK GUN SHOP, INC
863 Chestnut Grove Road * Winchester, VA 22603
PHONE: (540) 888 3349 -
E-MAIL: bcgsi@hughes.net
barrel
Web page: blackpowderva.com


Back Creek Gun Shop, Inc. has been selling black powder since 1972.
We are located 7 miles north of Winchester, VA
Adjacent to the North - South Skirmish Association Range
as you exit Ft. Shenandoah Range

Jackie is good to deal with too! He always has a good stock on hand!

[FLINTNFIRE]

I used to be able to buy black powder at several places in the local area , but years ago as shops closed it became harder to find , then in the late 90's I saw it for sale in the shotgun news , since the internet has come along there are places like powder inc. , back creek , jacks powder keg ,powder valley , and grafs where it can be ordered .

I tried pyrodex when it came out , never had the rust issue as I clean when done shooting , but there was a hot day and it seemed to change as the day got warmer and it was exposed to sunlight , have bought no more and never needed to use any other subs .

[wgr]

Real black is not hard to find. the thing is dealers have to have aproved storage for it.

[mooman76]

Just because it's not hard to find in your area doesn't make it not hard to find. Some places just flat quit selling it and there is No place close that sells it.

[Tar Heel]

Everybody knows that Black Powder (and BP substitutes) can be purchased ONLINE and delivered to your door right? If you "can't get it in your area" then you are simply not trying to get it and are just whining about it. If you are reading this then you are online. So go to Grafs.com or several other places online and order your powder. Then the UPS or FEDEX truck will show up with Black Powder for you and bingo - there will be black powder in your area.

[beemer]

My favorite gun shop sells black, he was the one that said it was getting hard to get. He does have some but not the amount he usually does, might just pick up another pound or two. All the other dealers in this area have quit selling it. I have several traditional rifles I have built and am gathering parts for a couple more, also have been dabbling with flintlocks.

I might try a can to see how it works. Want to thank everyone for your comments.

Dave

[megasupermagnum]

777 is the best substitute that I'm aware of for muzzleloaders. There's others that work, Pyrodex works, but I can't think of anything they do that 777 can't. Blackhorn 209 is good in an inline rifle with 209 primers, but nothing else. I'm not aware of anyone that is happy with any substitute as a prime for a flintlock.

That said, blackpowder is still easy to get with some thought, especially when you live in the eastern USA. Not every store sells it anymore, but I've never seen anywhere you were more than a hundred miles from the nearest source. A quick search shows Lead Chunkers Sporting Goods in Rockwell, NC sells Goex powder. There's probably more without you knowing it. If all else fails, buying powder online is as easy now as it ever will be. Brick and mortar stores simply have not been good at being competitive with online prices. Yes, shipping adds cost, but you can buy Goex right now for $22.19 a pound from Grafs, $19 a pound from Jacks, or even $16 a pound for Jacks name brand, which is Goex in FFFg only. Buying in person from Track of the Wolf, that price of Goex was around $28 two years ago, maybe more now with the shortages. I could buy powder from Track of the Wolfs website, and have it shipped to the store for cheaper than they were asking for the powder in their safe. My last purchase was from Grafs. Very good price, 10 pound minimum, but I could mix and match all I wanted. If you buy 25 pounds without mixing, Jacks Powder Keg has outstanding prices, especially if you can pick up that order from a shooting event.

[Gtrubicon]

A week ago I was looking for fff powder, 2 days ago it was delivered. And I live in California.

[idahoron]

I have used nothing but Pyrodex P in all my rifles for well over a dozen years. No place local to me carries black and to be honest I wouldn't buy it if it were here. I have way too much good luck with the P. That said you have already said you don't like fake powder so buy a bunch of real black pay the hazmat fees and get what you want. That way guys like me that want the "fake" powder don't have competition from guys buying it that don't like it.

[centershot]

I've been fortunate to be able to buy BP locally, although it's expensive. When I get low, I'll go mail order, saves me about 40%. As far as a substitute, the only one I would ever use again is Triple 7. None of the other subs are as clean burning or have the shelf life of T7.