06 ap

[bigdog454]

During WW-II, there were a lot of 06 armor piercing ammo used. Does anyone know just how much ( in inches) these bullets would pierce, and was that hardened armor or just steel?
BD

[Larry Gibson]

Actually made for use against "light armored" vehicles and aircraft. I have found it to penetrate 1/4 - 1/2" soft/mild steel with penetration through 5/8" thick being "iffy" at 100 yards.

[Outpost75]

Actually made for use against "light armored" vehicles and aircraft. I have found it to penetrate 1/4 - 1/2" soft/mild steel with penetration through 5/8" thick being "iffy" at 100 yards.

TM9-1305-200 states "At normal impact at 100 yards against 7/8-inch homogenous armor plate, minimum penetration is 0.35 inch."

[Bazoo]

What tactical value does it have over regular ball ammo? Would it do any different against a civilian car/truck? What about an uparmored Humvee?

Airplanes succumb pretty easy to regular ammo don't they?

I've seen it for sell for 2 dollars each and folks get all excited bout it, but I never understood what value it had other than the novelty.

[M-Tecs]

TM9-1305-200 states "At normal impact at 100 yards against 7/8-inch homogenous armor plate, minimum penetration is 0.35 inch."

Thanks. I have only shot one round of 06 AP against steel. That was against the thin center portion of a piece of railroad track. It did go through.

[Larry Gibson]

TM9-1305-200 states "At normal impact at 100 yards against 7/8-inch homogenous armor plate, minimum penetration is 0.35 inch."

Yeah, says that in my TM also....never could understand how penetrating .35" in a 7/8 armor plate was of much value. Thus I tested for complete penetration through the steel with enough "oomph" left to penetrated 6" of compressed newsprint.

As to;

"What tactical value does it have over regular ball ammo?"

It will penetrated "light armored" vehicles better (back in the day it was made/used). For the infantryman using the AP it turns what can be "cover" an enemy is behind into "concealment".....ergo bad juju for the enemy.....

"Would it do any different against a civilian car/truck?"

Yes, it does as it penetrates more than M2 ball. Will also do considerably more damage to an engine.

"What about an uparmored Humvee?"

At close range the engine could be seriously damaged and those sliding side windows are vulnerable. I doubt it would penetrate the side armor or gunners chicken plate. Remains to be tested though.

"Airplanes succumb pretty easy to regular ammo don't they"?

Some airplanes it was intended for (fighters and bombers) use against had some light armor around the fuel tanks and cockpits. The Browning 50 cal MGs soon replaced all the 30 cals in aircraft pretty early in WWII making that a moot point. The 50 cals used API and tracers along with ball.

[Adam Helmer]

In the 1970s and 1980s, our gun club got in many cases of DEN '43 and SL '43 AP ammo through the DCM. Our rifle team won many matches with that black tipped ammo-it shot great!

We detail cleaned our M1s after shooting that corrosive ammo.

Adam

[405grain]

I was in the Navy, but remember a couple of occasions where my group would shoot on Marine Corp ranges. The only time I remember shooting armor piercing ammo was on a training shoot with M1A's The Marine sergeant that was the range officer that day was giving us advise on how to use AP ammo. Probably irrelevant to a sailor, but the one thing that stuck in my head was: "If you get a broadside shot at a truck or jeep, aim for the top of the front tire. A hit there will simultaneously give the vehicle a flat tire and break the engine block."

[Bazoo]

Thanks for the detailed answer. I didn't know those things.

[10-x]

Late in WWII Patton’s 3rd Army seemed to “ acquire” more than their share of AP rounds as the infantry found it would go through just about any tree( large) , most timbers in bunkers and of course doors and houses. Story was Gen. Patton “ arranged” it .

[Ateam]

I seem to remember an interesting tidbit about it penetrating better out past 100y as it had stabilized by that point.

Would love to have some if someone is sitting on an absolute mountain of it and feeling generous, PM me. Heard it was the cheapest stuff around in the 90's.

[Outpost75]

I was told by LTC Ellis Lea, USA, Ret., who served in the ETO during WW2 that a long burst of AP, (until you saw 4 tracers) would chew through 8 inches of solid masonry, breaching a large enough hole to drop a grenade into the basement. Alternately the squad leader would mark the desired aiming point with a tracer and three Riflemen with Garands would each fire a clip load at the spot, or the BAR man would do a mag dump.

[Outpost75]

I seem to remember an interesting tidbit about it penetrating better out past 100y as it had stabilized by that point.

Would love to have some if someone is sitting on an absolute mountain of it and feeling generous, PM me. Heard it was the cheapest stuff around in the 90's.

Nearly all of it remaining in gov't stores went south during the contra war, as well as did all the M72 match and Ball M2 at the FBI Academy back then, all of it being linked for the Browning MGs, although I am told that some of the M72 Match was delinked and repurposed for sniping.

[straphanger]

Read somewhere that most of the rifle caliber ammo issued in WW2 in the Pacific was AP. It was preferred because it would penetrate through the big palm logs the Japs used in their bunkers.

[elk hunter]

A friend told me when he was in Korea all their Garand ammo was AP.

Years ago I had a bunch of late issue, non-corrosive, in Garand clips. A friend told me about some guy that used it for testing armor plate and I sold it to him for the unheard of price of $1.00 per round.

[Alferd Packer]

when I was young and dum I tested AP 06 ammo.Many times the penetrator tips richochette bad to the area of the shooter. We were missed, but now not doing that anymore. Where the hit the shooting emplacements they shot all the way thru .

just my 2 cents.

[TNsailorman]

An old Marine told about another Marine on the Canal who was in a dual with a jap who had a light nambu and hiding behind a tree. After a few exchanges, the Marine slipped a clip of AP into this 03 Springfield and proceed to kill the jap by shooting thru the tree he was hiding behind. A true story that made it into an autobiography. I have shot through several trees just playing around with old WW II AP and it will penetrate fairly large trees. I read in a magazine article back in the 60's about a guy who shot a railroad rail at 100 yards with an AP round and the AP round richtoched came back and hit him in the stomach, fortunately it did not do all that much damage and he had a short stay in the hospital. I would think my my limited experience that it would do a number on an auto engine or go thru both sides of an automobile although I have never tried either one. james

[Larry Gibson]

^^^^^^^

That's why sometimes "cover" is only "concealment"......

It's also the main difference between 7.62 NATO and 5.56NATO....what is "cover" to 5.56 is most often just "concealment" to 7.62.......

[FLINTNFIRE]

I got a lot of the pull down tips when no one wanted them , shot the gongs at the range with my loads , gongs were old bull gears and they looked like porcupines after a session , still have some in a bag and a bunch loaded for the M1 Garand , bought some from Talon ammo back when they were selling the pulled down and then reloaded ones , stashed in a ammo can for use as needed .

I have shot against old concrete walls when younger and on a angle was preferred over straight on , after 8 or so rounds it would chew a hole through with soft points , this was at around 50 yards .

[gwpercle]

I cut into an AP bullet and discovered a hardened steel "dart" incased inside the black tip painted bullet . It was covered with a layer of lead , enough so the rifling could grip the bullet but not be damaged by the hardened steel projectile inside .
My guess is the lead and jacket were shed when it ( the hardened steel "dart") penetrated steel plate.
The ammo will shoot through a 6 inch diameter steel pipe filled with concrete and when the ammo shot clean through a 20" oak tree we figured something was up with this ammo... that's when I cut into a bullet and found the hardened steel dart ... a file wont leave a mark on it !
Pulled a few hundred bullets for the brass , traded some ammo to a police officer buddy who wanted them for busting automobile blocks in road block situations and kept a few loaded stripper clips for my collection . When using these ... make sure you have a thick earthen berm for a backstop .
Gary