New rimfire round

[dverna]

Guess I'm not allowed to like the idea of a useless rimfire in an already obtainable platform.

You are allowed to like whatever you wish. I am allowed to express my perceptions.

If I understood the market niche a larger bore RF offering would fill, I might be more receptive to the concept. So, what advantage would it offer over a .32 or 38 CF?

BTW, I had the same questioning reaction to the LadyBug. Taking a CF and trying to match .22RF performance. I could not wrap my mind around....why? Imagine investing in that concept and now needing $100/1000 primers to feed the Bug? .22LR was $200/5000 just two years ago.

There was a guy here who had the tag line...”Sometimes you need to ignore the good idea fairy”.

The reality is a new round must have a market or it will never happen. If you could present your idea to the Marketing VP’s of Ruger, and Hornady, what would be your opening three sentences? If you cannot “hook” them in that limited time, you are done.

[Bazoo]

I never said it would be useful or catch on. Just be neat. Bigger bore centerfire for some reason intrigues me.

[Mk42gunner]

I think it is a neat idea, if not very likely to happen. I heard some good things about the .17 WSM before the covid/biden panic made most things related to ammo unavailable. But a plinking round it is not.

The thing that makes the .22 LR so great in my mind anyway, is that so much was made so inexpensively that just about anyone could afford to go out and shoot up a few hundred rounds at least monthly. Add in very low muzzle blast and almost no recoil, what's not to like?

If you read some of the people that grew up in the first quarter of the twentieth century, they say the .25 and .32 caliber rim fires were a better hunting round than the .22 S,L, or LR. The thing that I believe most people don't realize, is that this was before the high velocity .22 Long Rifle round came into being.

I think, as was alluded to earlier, the reason most of the larger rim fires weren't upgraded to HV status was that the guns couldn't handle it, much as several of the early .22's couldn't handle the HV loading. We're not just talking low quality boys rifles either, two that come to mind are the first generation Colt Woodsman and the 1891 Marlin. I don't think anyone would call those low quality guns.

Myself, I'd like to see regular production of affordable, quality, larger caliber RF ammo readily available again.

Robert

[303Guy]

I like the idea of a 25 rimfire. I'm sure one could find a use for it. I'm trying to think where the 22lr has failed me. ??? Nope. But I want a 25 rimfire anyway! I wouldn't go with a lengthened 25 ACP because the option for a 25 hornet already exists. That number could shoot cast at 22lr velocities and jacketeds at quite a respectable velocity, making it a versatile round. But I already have a 22 hornet and a 22lr so other than just wanting one, I don't need one. Other than for casting for that is. I know they say it's possible to cast 22 boolits but so far my results have been mediocre.

To be able to just buy and shoot 25 rimfire for the cost of reloading a 25, I'd opt for the rimfire. But it's not going to happen. Not for the cost of reloading (unless one factors in labor costs).

[uscra112]

The old .25 Stevens RF smokeless ammo I have (Western, Remington, Canuck), is subsonic out of a 24" barrel.

A 65 grain .25 caliber bullet at 1040 fps has 50% more muzzle energy than a 40 grain .22 standard velocity. Suppressed, this would be of some value, I suppose. A small argument for bringing back the original .25 Stevens loading. Bullet would not have as good a BC, so it might not have the effective range, but who uses SV ammo for 100 yard shots anyway?

[dverna]

Bazoo, and the others I may have offended, I apologize

When I was being groomed to become CEO of the company, I was sent to “Charm School” for four weeks. I have an Achilles heel....I call a spade a ****ing shovel. I had to learn to control that as it scared some people.

I have been retired for almost 9 years and getting older has made me far less PC than I should be. Cabin fever and maintaining isolation from others ( fiancé has cancer so Covid issues to guard against) has not helped my grumpiness.

I should not comment on some things and be more cognizant of people’s feelings.

Again sorry....

[Bazoo]

I appreciate that. No hard feelings.

[Traffer]

Been working on ideas for reinforcing rim fire cases. There is a guy that has patented a BUNCH of ideas for heavy brass rimfire. (none of which are feasible in my opinion) I have come up with a simple way that just might work though...would increase the pressure max to maybe 2200 to 2400psi with the same thickness and design of a 22lr case. With this in mind...rim fire could become a viable military round. Maybe a 25 caliber propelling a 60 grain bullet at 2000fps or more. It would take a lot of work to develop it...work with machinery that I do not have.
Let the criticism begin...

[Scrounge]

Been working on ideas for reinforcing rim fire cases. There is a guy that has patented a BUNCH of ideas for heavy brass rimfire. (none of which are feasible in my opinion) I have come up with a simple way that just might work though...would increase the pressure max to maybe 2200 to 2400psi with the same thickness and design of a 22lr case. With this in mind...rim fire could become a viable military round. Maybe a 25 caliber propelling a 60 grain bullet at 2000fps or more. It would take a lot of work to develop it...work with machinery that I do not have.
Let the criticism begin...

So you're planning on sniping opponents over 1,000 yards (or meters) with a .25 HVRF? I'm not seeing that happen. Though if you want it bad enough, I suppose you can make it happen. I'm gonna bet it would be a lot heavier than my Stevens Favorite.

I was not a grunt, and all of my time in the military carrying a firearm was in training. Some of it fairly realistic, but mostly not. Call in laser tag for grownups. I don't see too many buffalo around anymore, either. OTH, if you want it bad enough, go for it! It is not any stupider than many of the things I've done for fun over the past 65 years. In quite a few cases, much less stupid, I'd wager.

[dtknowles]

Been working on ideas for reinforcing rim fire cases. There is a guy that has patented a BUNCH of ideas for heavy brass rimfire. (none of which are feasible in my opinion) I have come up with a simple way that just might work though...would increase the pressure max to maybe 2200 to 2400psi with the same thickness and design of a 22lr case. With this in mind...rim fire could become a viable military round. Maybe a 25 caliber propelling a 60 grain bullet at 2000fps or more. It would take a lot of work to develop it...work with machinery that I do not have.
Let the criticism begin...

SAAMI MAP for .17 HMR is already 26000 psi. A pistol/submachine gun round in 9mm at 26000 psi would be effective. Not really a step down from 9 x 19 if designed right.

In a .22 rifle you are not going to match 5.56 performance, you will fall are short of what is to some a weak round.

Tim

[murf205]

Im thinking a 6mm rimfire, true seated bullet in the 70-75 grn range, with a decent bc and around 1800 fps.

And...maybe on a 5mm Remington case. I believe, (for what THAT is worth), if Remington had made the 5mm a full blown 22 it would still be with us. You could be re barrel a 591 and be in business. Maybe this quarantine-covid thing is getting to me, I dunno, but I might be "dumb" enough to buy one.

[SSGOldfart]

I'm hoping someone will bring back the .32 RF, and RF Long. Seems like great calibers to me, and I've got a Stevens boys rifle in each caliber.

Same here

[Texas by God]

I’ll throw my opinion in here. I like .22 Short, Colibris, .22 Long Rifle, .22 rat shot, and the .17 HMR. I see no need for any other rim fire cartridges.

[John Boy]

Here's the process I use to make 25 Stevens reloads:
* Trim 1.403 length on 22 Hornets down to 1.130
* Run 22 Hornet brass in a 25 Hornet FL sizing die - to reduce the web
* Run the cases into a 25 Hornet Expander die to expand the case just past the shoulder
* Re-run the cases back into a 25 Hornet FL sizing die
* Fireform the brass
* Trim brass to 1.125, the case length of a 25 Stevens
* Reloaded with either 7-8-9grs BP (original BP charge 10-11grs) and 3-4grs of 2400 smokeless using the Lyman 257420 - 72gr bullet
Results that the reloads drop into the chamber with ease

[Winger Ed.]

With the pressure limitations of rimfire, and the world wanting more and more performance from firearms:
I don't see them coming out with anything new that isn't something that's just a variation done with .22 cases.

Now, if someone made a run of .32 RF, I'd buy a box or two.
I'm a little surprised the .17 rim fires are as popular as they are,
but I don't think there is a large enough market for rim fires bigger than the .22 to make it profitable.

[Gewehr-Guy]

how about this idea for a new cartridge/gun combination. A Kel-Tech folding rifle, like their Sub 2000, but in a high velocity .25 RF.
High magazine capacity, higher velocity, and longer range than the 9mm and .40 versions. Probably not feasible, but I'll bet the younger shooters would buy it, especially if ammo costs were in the $20 range.

[john.k]

Didnt Winchester put out a new rimfire round based on the .27 dia power charge.?......and didnt it disappear without trace in a few months?

[John Boy]

For those wanting rim fire caliber brass, go to Roberson Cartridge Company.... they have multiple calibers. What they did, was modify center fire calibers to open the primer pocket for a primer to be seated and cut a channel on the case rim for the firing pin. I have 50 reloadable 32 Long cases and use 6mm Flobert primers for ignition of the smokeless and black powder charges
https://www.rccbrass.com/

[Drm50]

Personally I would rather see a CF rimmed cartridge of .25 cal.

[Scrounge]

For those wanting rim fire caliber brass, go to Roberson Cartridge Company.... they have multiple calibers. What they did, was modify center fire calibers to open the primer pocket for a primer to be seated and cut a channel on the case rim for the firing pin. I have 50 reloadable 32 Long cases and use 6mm Flobert primers for ignition of the smokeless and black powder charges
https://www.rccbrass.com/

If I ever get the workshop kicked into shape to use, I'll be making center-fire breech blocks for the Stevens rifles. I've got a couple of hundred rounds of .32 Long Colt brass, a suitable boolit mold, several powders that should work, and 100 SPP to play with. Stuff I ordered to play with reloading primers showed up day before yesterday. Wouldn't be hard to make some of the .32 brass that takes the nail gun RF cartridges, for that matter. Would be really, really nice if I could just buy some off the shelf, though. Either RF or CF. I'm easy.