Making powder coat stick to boolits

[bangerjim]

YES ESPC uses more powder that a coolwhip container, but gives you so much better coating performance and is not bothered by the weather, humidity, position of your mouth, or the phase of the moon as is tumble coating. Powder is so inexpensive, I do not worry about any waste.

The gun technique gives me the ability to coat any metal object that will fit in my LARGE Oster oven. You cannot do that with a plastic whip cream container!

A have always stood my boolits up to bake even after shaking, so ESPC is no big whoop. You develop the hand motor skills to sit them up rather fast and accurately after a little practice. I can spray, bake, and re-fill trays at the same time, so it is just a little assembly line.

[Doubles Shooter]

The next time I coat, I'm going to rub my container on the cat. Darn near electrocuted myself from static petting him today.

[AlHunt]

The next time I coat, I'm going to rub my container on the cat. Darn near electrocuted myself from static petting him today.

Get a large container and just use the cat instead of the BBs. Remember to rinse off him when you're done.

He won't mind ...

[Old School Big Bore]

@ AndyC - who carries that blue silicone grid in your bacon-grease .300 BO pic? I've been inverting boolits out of cartridge box inserts but it kinda limits how many I can stand on the oven tray, and I've been looking for a grid-mat exactly like that one.
Ed <><

[Agent1187]

The next time I coat, I'm going to rub my container on the cat. Darn near electrocuted myself from static petting him today.

Some people just can't get the hint that cats don't actually like getting pet.

[merlin101]

You guys using a gun, dont you find it a time suck to stand all the bullets up for spraying & then how much powder do you use for say 300 bullets?

It takes no longer to set them up to spray than it does to bake them, I did get tired of bumping the tray and knocking some boolits over so I fixed that by removing the bottom of my toaster oven and now place the over the top of the tray of boolits to be baked. As far as how much powder? Don't know nor do I care but a small amount in the gun's cup goes a looong ways!

[AndyC]

@ AndyC - who carries that blue silicone grid in your bacon-grease .300 BO pic? I've been inverting boolits out of cartridge box inserts but it kinda limits how many I can stand on the oven tray, and I've been looking for a grid-mat exactly like that one.
Ed <><

Ed, I bought it on Amazon:

Silicone Mini Ice Cube Trays 2 Pack, 160 Small Ice Cube Molds: https://smile.amazon.com/gp/product/B07QZ34SMV/

I've edited my original post with the link so it's easy to find in the future.

[Dragonheart]

YES ESPC uses more powder that a coolwhip container, but gives you so much better coating performance and is not bothered by the weather, humidity, position of your mouth, or the phase of the moon as is tumble coating. Powder is so inexpensive, I do not worry about any waste.

The gun technique gives me the ability to coat any metal object that will fit in my LARGE Oster oven. You cannot do that with a plastic whip cream container!

A have always stood my boolits up to bake even after shaking, so ESPC is no big whoop. You develop the hand motor skills to sit them up rather fast and accurately after a little practice. I can spray, bake, and re-fill trays at the same time, so it is just a little assembly line.

Banger is right about using a gun because that is what PC is all about. Back in 2012 I wasn't happy with my cool whip tub because it took a long time to turn out the quanity of bullets I wanted. I also wanted to learn about the process from the pro's so I visited shops and talked with a lot of the guys. I can truthfully say not a single PC operation was using a cool whip container. I bought a Harbor Freight gun and found it worked OK, but when I upgraded to a Dual Voltage Eastwood gun it truly gave me the results I wanted and I started doing lot of other PC projects. Now i am only limited by my 30" PID covered wall oven.


But this is not to say I am against shake & bake, I love the process and that is mainly what ai use. I just use a simple to make tumbler and do 6'#s of bullets at a time. Since the machine is doing all the work I can shake for 30 seconds or 30 minutes with no difference in effort for me. On those harder to coat days I just let it run longer. Case tumblers are too aggressive for the PC process. You will notice a darker color difference in the powder, because the aggressive action of the tumbler is rubbing off and mixing lead dust into the powder. If you push down on your case tumbler you will immediately notice a reduction in the vibration. This is what my tumbler does by adjusting the supports, allowing a more gentle swirling ation in the tub. The #5, 5 gallon bucket provides a large flat surface for a lot of bullets. A repurposed small tumbler is all that is needed to start.

[Dragonheart]

When you stand up the bullets and you want to keep them upright and maximize the number on a tray, simply use a stainless Baker's Cooling Rack available at kitchen stores like Bed, Bath & Beyond, Amazon, etc. You just need to get a grid to fit the bullets. One baker's rack will hold the bullets while transporting to the oven, then gently lift the rack off and do another tray.

[Conditor22]

Not everything is equal in powdercoating.

Powder Coating creates a Polymer coating/shell around the cast boolit
.....a) it helps protect the boolit from the barrel
.....b) it works as a lubricant between the boolit and the barrel
.....c) it protects the user (and user's kids) from the lead

Different atmospheric conditions can limit static or dampen the powder.

1) the powder must be kept dry ----I use double zipper bags in the NW where we get a lot of rain, store my powder in a garage with a gas furnace and WH
2) the boolits must be kept clean --- IF I'm not coating the boolits right away I put them in plastic zipper bags --- NEVER QUENCH before PCing!!!
.....a) baking the boolits will take most of the hardness you gain by quenching out of the boolit
.....b) quenching is a good way to contaminate the boolits so the PC won't stick well
.....c) quenching after PCing gives good results
.....d) touching the boolit with oily hands can/will affect the coating --- wear nitrile/plastic gloves or use a clean spoon or ? to move the boolits



PC can be dried out in an oven KEEP the temperature below 150° F (leaving the container open in an airconditioned room works) IF the PC is lumpy after drying it will quickly become powder again when you start swirl/shaking [I Rarely ever shake the container when PCing -- the containers don't last long when I do and just swirling gives me good results

3) the oven temperature must be checked with an oven thermometer (or 2) and the dial adjusted to where the thermometers read 400°
.....a) the oven temperatures will change with the surrounding air temperature due to location and type of sensor they use
.....b) toaster ovens work but only for smaller loads and have a tendency to have hot spots (some of the boolits can/will melt)
.....c) conventions ovens have been proven best because they have a circulating and the evenly heats all the boolits ---you can safely bake full trays of boolits

4) If the air/atmosphere is really damp you may need to pre-warm the boolits --- I use an oven set at 150° F or you can set a pan of boolits on to of your hot oven
.....a) the boolits must not be hotter than you can comfortably touch with bare hands or you can get PC clumping-- starting to cure

5) not all PC needs BB's/poly pellets to work --- this is a trial and error thing

6) polyester (usually TGIC) PC works best for me, I get better results with higher gloss powders

7) white/light colors generally don't cover well but adding a little of another color usually helps

8) COATING BOOLITS:
.....A) BOWLS
..........1) coating bowls/containers need to be plastic #5 or plastic #2
..........2) larger diameter bowls allow you to swirl/build up static faster thus cool whip bowls do such a good job
..........3) lids: if the bowl doesn't have a screw-on lid make sure you hang onto it or the lid will come open
.....B)STATIC BUILDING MEDIA: Normally cover the bottom of small bowls with 2 layers large bowls with 1 layer
..........1) ASBB (Air Soft BB's) black BB's are proven to work I've found camouflaged BB's that work also. It has to do with the hardness, what the BB's are made out of as to how well they help build static. even nonstatic building BB's will help even out the coating
..........2) Poly pellets normally black or white, haven't found any poly pellets that didn't help
.....C) Boolits:
..........1) use a minimum of 12-15 boolits -- enough to build up static
..........2) maximum no more than 2-3 layers deep in your bowl
.....D) Powder: This will vary on bowl size and number of boolits being coated
..........1)Ziploc Twist 'n Loc, after the BB's are coated, no more than 1 teaspoon per batch see how much PC is left in the bottom of the bowl after coating.
..........2) Cool Whip after the BB's are coated 1-2 teaspoons per batch see how much PC is left in the bottom of the bowl after coating.
..........3) Too much PC will prevent good static build-up
..........4) Too little PC will result in thin/spotty coating --- it's easy to add a little more and swirl a little longer
.....E) blending/mixing different PC is not like dealing with paint, white and black don't always make grey more often you get spotted/splotchy boolits
a) blending/mixing a little good PC with a bad PC often makes the bad PC work
b) blending/mixing multiple PCs can give you amazing results but the results will change with each batch you coat
c) some powders stick faster/better than others, the blend color will be heavier with that color to begin with then taper of when the color is used up in the bowl
.....F) SWIRLING: Screw or hold the lid tight and swirl the bowl holding it flat to verticle and back to flat, continue until all boolit are coated
.....G) preparing coated boolits:
..........1) REMOVE ALL EXCESS POWDER
.................a) Sift PC/boolits/BB's in a colander with something to catch the BB's and powder when they fall through the colander removing all excess PC
........................1) after all the PC/BB's are sifted off pick up the boolits with tweezers or fingers wearing surgical gloves (dipped in pc first to prevent sticking)
.................b) Pick up- dump PC'd boolits in a tray or? pick them up with tweezers, tap the tweezer on the side of a container to remove all excess PC
.....H) preparing to bake: Use a pan lined with non-stick paper/foil/bake mats or screen (1/4 hardware cloth)/wire basket (office supply)
..........a) stand short fat boolits up on their bases using finger or tweezer method
..........b) place taller boolits in silicone ice cube trays or use a metal grid to keep them from falling over
..........c) Dump method dump the sifted boolits in screen (1/4 hardware cloth)/wire basket (office supply) [this doesn't work well with all PC's you can get bad sticking
9) Baking PC the manufacturer states Bake for XX minutes at XXX° AFTER this condition exists
.....a) bake for XX minutes AFTER the boolits have reached XXX°
.....b) bake for XX minutes AFTER the PC starts to flow on the boolits
.....c) PC will look good after it flows and may pass the smash test BUT unless bakes to factory specifications IT IS NOT FULLY CURED
*****I have found that baking the coated boolits in an oven preheated to 400° for 25 minutes meets or exceeds all manufacturers requirements*****

10) Testing PC for adhesion/sticking using a smooth-faced hammer
.....a) flatten the PC'd cool boolit to 1/2 its original height seeing if any PC cracks or flakes off
.....b) hammer the PC'd cool boolit into a cube seeing if any PC cracks or flakes off
.....c) just because the PC passes the hammer test doesn't mean its fully cured, just that it is sticking well

11 SIZING
.....a) PC'd usually boolits size easily; if not, a little spray case lube can be used
.....b) IF PC is scraped off when sizing polish the entrance to your sizing die
..........1) with fine sandpaper made into a cone with the grit on the outside
..........2) with a Dremel tool, a felt boolit shaped polisher and some fine polishing compound --- I like Flitz
.....c)*** I like running a felt polisher in the sizing die for a few seconds to smooth the machine marks and make sizing easier
12 LOADING:
.....a) PC is normally loaded to regular cast boolit loads
.....b) GC usually aren't needed with PC's boolits until you reach 1600 - 2100 fps depending on the gun, powder, and boolit
.....c) PC'd boolits can work with a softer alloy and be pushed faster/harder than regular lubed boolits

***I like using different colored boolits to designate different diameters or powder charges***

[slide]

Conditor22 nailed it. The two main problems as I see it are not curing the powder coat fully and not shaking off the excess powder. Both problems can be solved. Don't be afraid to shake the powder off of your bullets,shake them and then shake them some more. You want a thin coat. A digital thermometer with a thermocouple can be bought on amazon for around twenty bucks. This is the only way you are going to know what temp your bullets are at. Drill a hole in a coated bullet insert t-couple,squeeze bullet down on t-couple (Hossflys idea) and you are set. One of the comments I get is kiss ( keep it simple stupid). Nothing could be more simple than laying the t-couple bullet in when you bake a batch. Monitor your temp and when it reaches the recommended temp start a timer. Use your watch and do other things. I am beginning to think that the t-couple method scares people and they are afraid to try it. When powder coating started everybody was using the harbor freight red. The instructions states that the part must reach 400f and remain there for 20 minutes. Somehow it got shortened to 20 minutes total. Those instructions are on there for a reason. You can get by when shooting pistol rounds but I tested coated rifle bullets. One batch was baked for a total of 20 minutes and the other using the t-couple. There was a difference in accuracy. Most of the polyester powder coats are 2h pencil hardness which is about 26-28 bhn. To get that bhn you have to cure the powder coat fully. The powder coat is just as important as any other part of reloading. Why shortcut it. You just don't throw powder in your cases without making sure it is the right weight or get sloppy when seating primers. Back to those rifle bullets for a second. Like Conditor22 said they both passed the hammer test but without digging out the targets the 20 minute bullets had about a two inch larger group than the t-couple bullet. On a funny note. when I was trying to come up with a way to figure this out I started out with a stem themometer stuck in bullet and I would lay that in when baking bullets. Quite a sight. I was drinking coffee one morning at my workbench and there set a multi meter in front of me with a thermocouple. I wondered if that might work and sure enough it did. Sometimes you get lucky. Look fellas,if what you are doing suits you then keep doing it. But, if you want to make sure that your powder coat is fully cured then the t-couple will help you with that.

[454PB]

I do what I call "bag and drag". put a few hundred boolits and a teaspoon of powder in a Ziplok freezer bag, then drag that bag across a piece of carpet I keep in front of my loading bench. I combine that with occasional tumbling of the bag in my hands. Continue for 4 or 5 minutes, then dump the coated boolits into a wire colander and shake off the excess powder. Dump them on a piece of parchment paper and bake for 20 minutes @ 400 degrees.




The boolits that are touching will stick together, I just break them apart with my hands.

[slide]

Lots of ways to skin a cat!

[FrontSite]

Well I warmed them up and tried it again.

Tried it again second coat.

Coated but still on the ugly side. I will have to try cleaning my mold to be sure there isn't any lube or anything getting on the boolits.

Just a thought... the container #5. was it totally clean to begin with? Any oil or wax residue will effect the static transfer to the objects being treated. Even using a towel washed in fabric softener in the final rinse cycle or tumble dried with a dryer sheet, used to dry the container will have an effect.

[cwlongshot]

Awesome sage information bestowed Jim! ♥️♥️♥️♥️

PAY ATTENTION NEWBIES! (Even experienced guys can polish there practices with this information!!)

Thank you!!

CW

[Old School Big Bore]

Thanks for the info AndyC and Dragonheart!
Ed <><

[Dragonheart]

"I do what I call "bag and drag". put a few hundred boolits and a teaspoon of powder in a Ziplok freezer bag, then drag that bag across a piece of carpet I keep in front of my loading bench. "[/QUOTE]

Yeah Right. Try that when when have two Cats, a big Kitten and a wife that is not going to think a big red area in her light grey carpet is very amusing when you say the cats did it!

[JWFilips]

Again....
Heat your boolits with a hair drier a few minutes until the are too hot to hold.... then spin and shake them for 45 seconds
THEY WILL BE WELL COATED!

[Petander]

Again....
Heat your boolits with a hair drier a few minutes until the are too hot to hold.... then spin and shake them for 45 seconds
THEY WILL BE WELL COATED!

If not well coated, repeat spin & shake. I count 50 each spins & shakes,twice.

I tried without my usual pre-heat the other day and found out the double spin&shake was good for some hard-to-adhere powder. Fired them today,all good,very good.

[Drifty4]

Yes the container was clean and dry. Actually using a #2 coffee container and wearing gloves has made a big difference.