Identifying ingots of Tin and High Tin Lead Alloy?

[mkj4him]

Was given a good supply of “lead” ingots from an old shooter friends estate. My understanding is They are a mix of pure lead ( pretty easy to identify,) pure tin and a hard alloy with high tin content. They are a mixture of ingot mold types but not segregated by ingot type. Some ingots with a P have “tin” stamped into the top. Others “look” very much like the “tin” ingots but without the “tin” stamped in. Is there a good way to identify between pure tin ingots and high tin alloy ingots?

Here is one of the small “tin” Ingots. There are many that look the same but without the word.

[Dusty Bannister]

That ingot is from a Potter ingot mold so the letter is meaning less. If you have access to a hardness tester, I would suggest testing those ingots that are marked, and compare them to ingots that are not marked. Usually tin will retain the shiny surface for a very long time. Once you segregate the ingots by hardness, you might send a drip sample to BNE, following his instructions for submitting samples, for testing. This may not be totally conclusive, but will help sort things a bit better than the mix you have now. Good luck. Dusty

[farmbif]

I don't know how much a "good supply" is but to be sure of what it is, find a way to get it tested with an xrf gun and then there won't be no question as to what the composition is.

[Winger Ed.]

If you're going to cast much beyond the softest alloy you can get away with, that still fills out the mold
by adding ingots that ring when you drop them on the floor into pure Lead:

They need to be tested.

[bangerjim]

Have them x-ray analyzed. Period. Eliminates all the "what-if" questions.

Then use the FREE alloy calculator found on this site to figure out your melt mix.

(a "good supply" to me is at least 1/4 ton or more!)

bangerjim

[mkj4him]

I have no ide where to have such tests done. I guess I’ll be testing hardness for the next month.

[bangerjim]

I have no ide where to have such tests done. I guess I’ll be testing hardness for the next month.

Re-read post #2!!!!! Dusty tells you to contact member BNE on this site. He does testing in his spare time, usually one test costs a pound of Pb, but talk to him on a PM for details.


banger

[Conditor22]

That ingot is from a Potter ingot mold so the letter is meaning less. If you have access to a hardness tester, I would suggest testing those ingots that are marked, and compare them to ingots that are not marked. Usually tin will retain the shiny surface for a very long time. Once you segregate the ingots by hardness, you might send a drip sample to BNE, following his instructions for submitting samples, for testing. This may not be totally conclusive, but will help sort things a bit better than the mix you have now. Good luck. Dusty

I always thought the "P" stood for pure so that's what I use those molds for LOL

[mkj4him]

Some ingots are shiny still. Some are shiny with a slight gold tinge to them. Or even a slight rainbow streak hear or there in 5he shiny silver. Pure lead is fairly easy to figure out.

What is the sound difference between them and what is the best test for that.

[Martin Luber]

I have some ingots from an estate, marked as "tin", are extremely hard, and don't melt, even with a torch on them. Theyvwere home cast in the same style mould as the OP.

Could it be tin ?

[vagrantviking]

Without the fancy testing equipment 2 ways to get some idea is to check the melting point temperature. The other which might be best for going through a stack of unknown ingots is to spend $10 on a set of sketching pencils that are all different hardness.

There are stickies in the forums here with charts for both methods listing alloys and pure metals.

[bangerjim]

BNE is still in the x-ray analysis business per a PM I just got from him. Send him a PM to get his DETAILED instructions of what he needs to do your test.

You will then know EXACTLY what you have.

[mkj4him]

Sounds like a plan. Thanks.

[CoolHandMoss]

If you have lead of a known content you could cast some boolits from that then cast some of the unknown alloys in the same mold and just compare the weights. You could also use the basic thumbnail test to compare hardness. This is obviously not a great method and will give you nothing near an exact content of the alloy, but it will give you an idea. You'd at least know if the "tin" ingots are pure tin or if they're lead alloy with tin already mixed in. All this assuming that the marking system on these ingots are consistent, which it likely is not.

[JonB_in_Glencoe]

First thing to do, is to sort out what you can by looks, feel, sound.
Once you have them sorted by that, then do some randomized hardness testing. also at this stage, you could do some melt temp, freeze temp comparisons of each of the batches and that will likely get you close to what each alloy could be.

I acquired some ingots that I was told was "good Tin", but wasn't given any more info or what was meant by good Tin. I melted/blended all the ingots, then watched for melt temp and freeze temp, and was able to deduce it was most likely 50SN-50PB Solder.

[bangerjim]

Unless your ingots are 100% factory made (either solder, Sn, or Pb) and well marked IN the mold or ink printed (not hand marked) on them, do not trust any lettering to mean anything you find in home-made ingots.

I have ingots of pure Sn that are factory cast with the foundry name and the metal clearly ID'd in the casting surface. Also factory-produced wave solder bars are stamped AND cast with the % contents. Babbitt alloys are the same way. Trust ONLY cast-in factory ID's and not some random letter in the ingot!

That is why when I buy scrap "stuff" at the yards, I always insist on an x-ray shoot as part of the deal or I walk out. It costs them nothing and only about a minute of time. All decent sized yards have a gun....hey, they make their living that way....buying what they know the scrap metals are. Don't let them tell you different or charge for a shoot.

[P Flados]

A bullet caster is likely to have one or more of the following:

Pure lead: This will be heaviest, softest (easy to scratch with a thumbnail) and most likely to look dull grey

Lead bullet casting alloys: Typically very close to the same weight as pure, color anywhere from a little lighter to a lot lighter, and harder. If you can barely scratch it with your thumbnail, it is "medium" hardness. If you can not scratch it with a thumbnail, it is in what I call the hard lead category.

Solder: This is typically half way between lead and tin for weight. Hardness is less than medium hard lead. Color is on the light side.

Tin / Pewter: A lot lighter than lead. Hardness is back into the hard lead range. Color is usually very light. The gold & rainbow coloring you describe is not uncommon for tin.

If a caster went to the effort to hand stamp an ingot as tin, there is a good chance it is tin / pewter. If other ingots look the same, have the same hardness and weigh the same, there is a good chance these are also tin / pewter.

Sorting by weight and hardness are really good tools. The weight part can be tricky with ingots because some were poured deeper than others. However you can measure average thickness and do some math to get a rough correction for this.