I don’t get the infatuation with powder coat and hi tech

[derek45]

Pretty sure if you call Missouri bullet, SNS, Bayou bullet, etc., they will tell you the coated is what is most popular now.

[Lloyd Smale]

has anyone done a side by side comparison ,same boolit load etc but lubed/tumble lubed/powder coated ?

if your talking accuracy your old load development is about thrown out the door. I get about have the cases where accuracy increases and half that decrease. Most times with a little experimenting i can get it back though. differnt primer another grain more or less of powder. If your talking leading or cleanliness theres no comparison. Matter of fact it opens you up to being able to shoot near jacketed speeds and allows a guy that doesnt have access to lead hard enough to do over 1500 conventioanly lubed to shoot those same bullets at near 3000. Now keep in mind that when your pushing ANY cast bullet of ANY alloy up past 2000 fps your in an area that most casters struggle with. Even to me its more work then its worth. but it does add on 500 fps with normal alloys with fairly obtainable accuracy. One thing ive heard nobody show on here is a down side to it. There is none. Its cheaper, cleaner, and better in every way. Id no sooner give it up and go back to lube sizing then I would to shop for a truck that needed to be crank started or had kerosene headlights.

[dale2242]

PBaholic, 40k rounds is very impressive.
That speaks highly of Ruger quality.
No barrel wear.
You must maintain you Ruger regularly.
Any other parts showing wear?

[dtknowles]

if your talking accuracy your old load development is about thrown out the door. I get about have the cases where accuracy increases and half that decrease. Most times with a little experimenting i can get it back though. differnt primer another grain more or less of powder. If your talking leading or cleanliness theres no comparison. Matter of fact it opens you up to being able to shoot near jacketed speeds and allows a guy that doesnt have access to lead hard enough to do over 1500 conventioanly lubed to shoot those same bullets at near 3000. Now keep in mind that when your pushing ANY cast bullet of ANY alloy up past 2000 fps your in an area that most casters struggle with. Even to me its more work then its worth. but it does add on 500 fps with normal alloys with fairly obtainable accuracy. One thing ive heard nobody show on here is a down side to it. There is none. Its cheaper, cleaner, and better in every way. Id no sooner give it up and go back to lube sizing then I would to shop for a truck that needed to be crank started or had kerosene headlights.

Down sides, it adds two extra steps to making bullets, shaking and baking. Instead of cast, size shoot you have to cast, shake, bake, size shoot.

How can you claim it is cleaner when Larry showed that it leaves plastic residues in the barrel.

How is it better if you have to throw out years of load development and start over.

PC is better........sometimes for some situations and for people just getting started.

Tim

[rototerrier]

Never had any plastic residue in my barrels. Maybe undercured? I'd also assume a few copper jackets would blow out plastic? Seems like a non issue if one had that issue. All my barrels that shoot pc are spotless.

I love the smokeless clean nature of pc. And driving them full speed. I treat them like jacketed in pistol calibers.

[JM7.7x58]

What’s the big deal? I cast the bullets, handle them one time through a lubrisizer then load them . No separate sizing operation , no shake and bake, no concern about size variation, No concern about brand of paint, just a very time efficient loading operation. Sure they look pretty but so what. The traditional lubed/ sized bullets shoot great and do not lead. Why change? I have had leading problems with many of the commercial Handgun high tech bullets if velocity is high but that may be too hard bullets with a bevel base. What am I missing? Seems like a waste of time with the extra steps for pretty bullets. Do they group better? Or is it just something different for those with much free time.😀 I am not a snowflake so you can flame me. Its all in good fun but I would like to know.

Dogdoc

I just scrolled through your 210 posts. It looks like most of your focus is on straight wall revolver cartridges. In fact you had only two or three posts that were related to rifle loads.

So, yes it would seem that you are very well set up with your lubrasizers. I would suggest that you don't change a thing.

Now for me. Having spent less than fifty dollars to get set up to PC. It sure was nice to be able to get that horribly undersized Lyman 311290 up to size with PC. It was nice to find an accurate 2100fps load with soft alloy for the Lee 312-155-2R. And, it was great to shoot the high pressure 40s&w with soft alloy and zero leading with PC (this gun has a very short and sharp throat).

I could care less about color. I use PC because of the mechanical advantages that it offers in certain application. Plain and simple PC is a hard plastic jacket, lube is just a fundamentally different system. Both have their own unique advantages.

I still use 45/45/10 tumble lube in 38 special, 357 mag, 45acp, and low velocity plain base 30cal small game loads. I still use the 45/45/10 because it works well, and is easy to coat large bulk amounts.

JM

[rbuck351]

I use both methods but I find the Star lube sizer to be a lot faster than PC especially when trying to stand up a tray full of 55gr 22cal boolits. My pistol/revolver boolits don't lead and smoke on my at home outdoor range is not an issue. The only boolits I pc are for rifle at speeds over 2000. The Star does a very nice job of putting lube only where it belongs and long term storage hasn't been a problem and I use FWFL which is very cheap. PC does work for fixng undersize boolits but so does my Swag-O-Matic. I don't find either lube or PC to be the do all/end all for boolit prep.

[Mal Paso]

Never had any plastic residue in my barrels. Maybe undercured? I'd also assume a few copper jackets would blow out plastic? Seems like a non issue if one had that issue. All my barrels that shoot pc are spotless.

I love the smokeless clean nature of pc. And driving them full speed. I treat them like jacketed in pistol calibers.

See the denial!

Down sides, it adds two extra steps to making bullets, shaking and baking. Instead of cast, size shoot you have to cast, shake, bake, size shoot.

How can you claim it is cleaner when Larry showed that it leaves plastic residues in the barrel.

How is it better if you have to throw out years of load development and start over.

PC is better........sometimes for some situations and for people just getting started.

Tim

It's too late for those who have inhaled the fumes!

[Kraschenbirn]

I guess I'm something of a reloading junkie...constantly tinkering with my loads, experimenting with different boolit designs, adjusting powder charges, etc...and, after 4 years of powder-coating, I still have one of my Lyman 450s bolted to my workbench and still have two (or three?) pans of Emmert's Lube in the supply cabinet. In other words, I use whatever gives me the best results downrange. In my experience, for handgun, PC is just as accurate and shoots cleaner without significant increase in time required between ingots and finished boolits. For CF rifle, I've found it's about a 50/50 split; in some cases, I've not been able to improve (or even duplicate) the accuracy of my lubrisized loads from a specific gun while, in others, PC performs as well or better but such improvement rarely comes easy. I've got a sub-MOA load for my heavy-barrel Savage M10 that uses a bore-rider boolit requiring about 4X the time to finish because the nose has to be sized before and after coating...that's three passes with a push-thru. Last, there's my straight-wall BPCRs where, for both black and smokeless, I pan-lube with Emmert's because I've found that's what works best for me. (The one exception to this is my 'fun' load for the Trapdoor Carbine; a PC'd 405 gr RN over 13.5 gr Unique to duplicate ballistics of the 45-405-55 Gov't round.)

In other words, I'm not all that 'infatuated' but do use PC where I've found. by 'hands on' experience, it has a definite advantage.

Bill

[AlHunt]

Wow. I never thought powder coating would inflame such passionate opposition.

[dtknowles]

See the denial!



It's too late for those who have inhaled the fumes!

Yeah, I think that was the original point of this thread. Not that PC isn't great but that some people are just rabid about it.

Tim

[dtknowles]

Wow. I never thought powder coating would inflame such passionate opposition.

What post was passionately opposed to Powder Coating. I must have missed it.

Tim

[dtknowles]

I just scrolled through your 210 posts. It looks like most of your focus is on straight wall revolver cartridges. In fact you had only two or three posts that were related to rifle loads.

So, yes it would seem that you are very well set up with your lubrasizers. I would suggest that you don't change a thing.

Now for me. Having spent less than fifty dollars to get set up to PC. It sure was nice to be able to get that horribly undersized Lyman 311290 up to size with PC. It was nice to find an accurate 2100fps load with soft alloy for the Lee 312-155-2R. And, it was great to shoot the high pressure 40s&w with soft alloy and zero leading with PC (this gun has a very short and sharp throat).

I could care less about color. I use PC because of the mechanical advantages that it offers in certain application. Plain and simple PC is a hard plastic jacket, lube is just a fundamentally different system. Both have their own unique advantages.

I still use 45/45/10 tumble lube in 38 special, 357 mag, 45acp, and low velocity plain base 30cal small game loads. I still use the 45/45/10 because it works well, and is easy to coat large bulk amounts.

JM

What is 45/45/10?

[Bazoo]

45/45/10 is LLA and paste wax and mineral spirits tumble lube.

I have tried PC'ed bullets in my 30-30. I got plastic fouling and it was harder to remove than lead fouling but not as bad as copper. I only shot like 20 shots. The bullets were sent to me by a member here some years back.

With those bullets I noticed the noses are enlarged, and in my rifle they wouldn't chamber freely unless seated deeper. Seating past the crimp groove is an issue. I crimp my 30-30 loads.

The bullets in question, were done by a member that has good success with it.

[jessdigs]

I got into casting when powder coating was already a thing. I read you can push them faster, and use softer lead. I get lead pipe out of the ground, and solder scraps from work. In CA, wheel weights are hard to find, but I got about 1000 lbs free once.
I don't do alloy math when I cast and powder coat. I add a wheel weight ingot, some pure lead from lead pipe or cast iron bell ends, some 50/50 or 60/40 solder, and a sprinkle of lino or mono. It usually tests from 12-18. When Powder coated I have never had a problem with accuracy or leading.

I've never tried traditional lubed cast boolits. I've never tried commercial cast boolits.
If i see a lubrisizer for a decent price I will most likely try it. But i have so much invested in push through sizing equipment, app press, etc.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

[JM7.7x58]

What is 45/45/10?

I would refer you to the “Boolit Lube” section of this fine website. Specifically to the fourth sticky entitled “ Tumble Lubing--Made Easy & Mess-Free”. There you find a a long thread that goes into great detail about 45/45/10.

Before he passed on Recluse gave us a fine lube recipe.

Here is a link.

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/show...-amp-Mess-Free

JM

[Murphy]

After 30+ years of casting and lubing with a lube sizer (Lyman & Star), I can't deny I haven't been tempted to try powder coating. I can see the advantages of it, no doubt. On the other hand, my shop seems to have shrank in size over the years. Oh well, never hurts to learn and add another trick in the bag when it comes to cast boolits.

Murphy

[44MAG#1]

I stand in the middle on powder coating as I said. I do some bullets PC'ed and some sized and lubed. If it is very cold out and I go to a local indoor range you can bet your new vehicle I will be using PC'ed bullet loads.
Out doors it is maybe 50/50.
I do what pleases me as long as I am not infringing on someone else.
Now, if anyone would answer this is, why would anyone be so interested in what someone else does?
My belief is do what you want as long as it doesn't cost me anything or interfere with me.
Am I wrong to believe this way?

[Lloyd Smale]

Down sides, it adds two extra steps to making bullets, shaking and baking. Instead of cast, size shoot you have to cast, shake, bake, size shoot.

How can you claim it is cleaner when Larry showed that it leaves plastic residues in the barrel.

How is it better if you have to throw out years of load development and start over.

PC is better........sometimes for some situations and for people just getting started.

Tim

ive shot thousands and no plastic build up. I dont shake in a container. I cast my bullets and the next day when there cooled put about 10lbs in the tumbler and do some reloading for about a 1/2 hour. take them out dump them on a collator and then dump them on a try and stick them in the oven. While that batch cooks another batch goes in the tumbler and back to reloading. take the bullets out of the oven put the next batch in and repeat. no more time then doing it with a lubesizer when you factor in changing dies plugging lube holes to match the number of lube groves adjusting the punch to line those holes up with every different bullet. Farting around getting your heat set right for your lube and having to clean your gun about every time you go shooting. Cleaning out seating dies that get full of lube. Load development?? I quit sitting on a bench with cast bullets years ago. Dont see a real need for it. Most of us shoot beer cans at 25 yards or deer out to maybe 50 yards and a 2-3 inch load at 25 yards takes care of that and if your gun wont shoot that well without a lot of load developement your best off taking it to the dealer and trading it on a GOOD gun. Only bench work for me anymore is long range rifle stuff. I was just telling my buddy who has forgot more then i know that i dont do it anymore. he told me he learned that long ago. Most good handgun hunters spend there time standing on there feet and practicing trigger control. A 1/2 inch differnce in group size at 25 yards means nothing to me and that said it in my experience it is just as likely to be a 1/2 better then a 1/2 in worse. If it were twice as much work i do it to have the benefit of shooting ANY lead at high velocity without leading and most of all because my gun doesnt turn into a grease gun after 500 rounds at the range. Back when i shot ppc we had a few shoots indoors and my smoky loads angered some that shot next to me. Thats no longer an issue (but to be honest i dont shoot comp anymore either) Add to that no more lube dripped on the bench or floor. No more lube to attract dirt and dust to your bullets. Did is say a cleaner gun

[Lloyd Smale]

Yeah, I think that was the original point of this thread. Not that PC isn't great but that some people are just rabid about it.

Tim

not rabid about anything tim. but when somethings better i dont hold on to old traditions just because there old. I bought a star many years ago when they were relatively new because they were just better then a lyman and faster and that meant less time loading and more time at the range. When i got my first dillion I knew right there that i would NEVER load another round of handgun or 556 ammo on a single state again. now ive got 4 progressive presses. Why? Because the less time i spend loading the more time i can shoot. Many here hold on to ladle casting, single stage presses, lyman lubesizers and even tumble lube (if you want fast why dont you just do that) Ive been casting for 50 years. In that time ive seen very little other then the star sizer make any great improvement in casting. PC changed the game and this old fart isnt bullheaded enough to not see it has advantages and NO disadvantages. I still have my star. It works good for bullet sizes i dont have lee sizing dies for. But thats about it. Yup i could go back to lubesizing and get along. But WHY? when some smart guy figured out that coating bullets with pc worked better. I thank him. Me rabid Tim? Im rabid about shooting. The only reason i load and cast is so i can shoot. it quit being fun 30 years ago. Its something i have to do to be able to enjoy what i love and thats shooting.