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Thread: Clay Dot - Claysócan I mix them?

  1. #1
    Boolit Master Baltimoreed's Avatar
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    Clay Dot - Claysócan I mix them?

    Guys, I had a keg of Clay Dot from the last drought, not the current one, but Iím finally down to the last inch or so in my Dillon measure mounted on a Lyman T2 press where Iím reloading .45 Schofield ammo. I have 4 cans of Clays and am wondering what would the harm be in just refilling my measure with some Clays. My current Schofield [for rifle] cowboy load is 5.1 gr of CD with a 200 gr cast rnfp. Thinking that the powders are close enough for cas reloads. Btw, Clays is 9 and CD is 11 on my burn chart. CD was designed as a cheaper version of Clays and can even be used without changing your powder bushing in your shotgun reloader [that is set up for Clays] according to alliant. Any thoughts?

  2. #2
    Boolit Buddy Cast_outlaw's Avatar
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    I’d going to have to say no don’t mix powder unless you want to put it in your flower garden

    Even though they are close on the chart it could cause weird pressure spikes making and may cause you gun to go boom instead of bang
    Last edited by Cast_outlaw; 11-23-2020 at 09:50 PM.

  3. #3
    Boolit Master
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    You don't mix 2 different powders made by 2 different manufacturers together. Good grief!

    Don
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    Boolit Bub 500Smith's Avatar
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    You are kidding ..............right? April fools in November.

  5. #5
    Boolit Master gpidaho's Avatar
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    I'm going to go out on a limb and say that mixing powders of two different manufactures is a way below average idea. It could work but not worth the chance in my opinion but stranger loads have been tried. Gp

  6. #6
    Boolit Master


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    I am anal and would not do it. But I have a lot of powder.

    IMHO, if they are close in burn rate, flake size, and well mixed, there will not be a problem. Just stay under maximum.
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  7. #7
    Boolit Grand Master 303Guy's Avatar
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    While Clays, Clay Dot and Red Dot are in the same burn-rate category, Clays has a very fast initial burn rate, faster than Red Dot. Yet the mean burn rate is about the same. So from that one can see that mixing those two powders could cause unexpected pressure spikes. Kind of like using a fast powder as a kicker charge for a slow powder to get a medium overall burn rate. Now mix a very fast powder with a fast powder you might expect to get a very fast overall burn rate that could potentially break something.

    So no, don't be tempted to mix them. The similar names for those two powders is to do with their intended purpose, that being clay pigeon shooting, not their similarity in composition and burn characteristics.
    Last edited by 303Guy; 11-23-2020 at 10:33 PM.
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  8. #8
    Boolit Master Baltimoreed's Avatar
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    Thanks guys. No desire to mess up any of my cas toys. I’ll use up what CD I’ve got and then refill my hopper with Clays. I’ll just have to watch the hopper real close so I don’t load any duds.

  9. #9
    Boolit Master

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    I'd just watch close as it runs dry, then do a quickie clean out and refill with the new powder.
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  10. #10
    Boolit Bub
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    and recheck the powder charge weight

  11. #11
    Boolit Master bedbugbilly's Avatar
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    Let's see . . . look at it like an equation . . .

    The time to run the one powder out, clean, recheck powder drop and continue versus mixing two powders which could equal unstable pressure . . . . oh heck . . . let's make it a simple equation . . .

    Ignoring time and convenience . . . . the cost of an inch of powder in your hopper . . . as opposed to possible damage to a firearm costing much more . . . times the cost of possible losses of body parts and medical costs . . . . pretty much equals the old story problem of if a locomotavie is traveling east on the tracks at 40 miles an hour and another locomotive is traveling west on the same tracks at 30 miles an hour . . . how hard will they hit when they meet? Answer . . . doesn't really matter as it's a "train wreck" in the making.

  12. #12
    Boolit Buddy
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    No. Never mix powders.
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  13. #13
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    If you didn't have a progressive you wouldn't consider it, just load until empty and develop a load with the new. So what you're asking is can I take shortcuts because of my press. Answer is still no.
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  14. #14
    Boolit Master
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    Quote Originally Posted by MT Gianni View Post
    If you didn't have a progressive you wouldn't consider it, just load until empty and develop a load with the new. So what you're asking is can I take shortcuts because of my press. Answer is still no.
    Good point, MT_Gianni.

    Don
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  15. #15
    Boolit Master

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    I wouldn't do it, but I'm a scarriedy cat.................
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  16. #16
    Boolit Buddy
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    Burn rate is the same, energy is the same per grain (or close enough), but the actual density of the powder is not quite the same. Which means that if you're measuring by volume, you will get different charges with these two powders. How different depends on the batches. So, not a good idea, unless you're weighing each charge, in which case it's a somewhat less bad idea.

  17. #17
    Boolit Master
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    Quote Originally Posted by FullTang View Post
    Burn rate is the same...
    Burn rate is NOT the same. These are 2 completely different powders by 2 different manufacturers.

    Don
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  18. #18
    Boolit Buddy
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    Well, let's say the burn rate is supposed to be the same, but they are indeed 2 different powders by 2 different manufacturers, so they can't be exactly the same. But they are extremely close, and I'd even say close enough. My point is that the densities aren't even supposed to be the same---the whole idea was that you could substitute an equal weight of Clay Dot for the same weight of Clays, but Alliant has always cautioned that this might not be the same volume. That's what can get you into real trouble when you mix the two together and charge shells by volume with your Frankenpowder (though it's probably going to be a relatively modest effect.) However, the good news is that the well-lawyered folks at Alliant made Clay Dot less dense than Clays, so an equal volume will be less actual powder and therefore less bang. So, you're more likely to underperform than blow anything up. However, if you start with Clay Dot loads at a known, calibrated volume, then mix in Clays---potential Kaboom!
    It's all well and good to have rules, like don't mix different powders, but it helps to know why.

  19. #19
    Boolit Master
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    I know a guy that dumped a similar shotgun powder in the hopper. His shotgun was blown in to two pieces and he had a hearing problem for a month. Barrel landed 20 feet behind him.
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BP Bronze Point IMR Improved Military Rifle PTD Pointed
BR Bench Rest M Magnum RN Round Nose
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