Load development for a Charter Arms Bulldog

[onelight]

@onelight, Check the headspace on your bulldog. I think you can do it with automotive type feeler gauges in a pinch or buy proper gauges.

@Good Cheer, I'm going to be rolling up a 200g WC load at about 750 ft/s from my bulldog. I'll test it against some water jugs within the next month.

Later,
Stephen

That should be a great bullet for the Bulldog.
I actually tried a cylinder shim kit on it and with the thinnest shim it was to tight
I would reeealy like it to work I may have to send it in and see if CA can get it working. I bought it used and probably have more in it than if I had ordered a new one. As it is I would not sell it or trade it . So it's mine working out or not.

[pettypace]

Anyone tested .44 wadcutters for penetration on winter outdoor wear?

I haven't done any testing, but unless you're throwing those wadcutters, there's no amount of winter wear I'd feel safe behind.

[smkummer]

I believe we all know infamously, son of sam was probably 80% or more effective with most likely store bought Remington or Winchester factory round nose ammo. Has anyone chronoed that load? I am guessing close to 700 FPS with the 246 round nose.

[Old School Big Bore]

I'm gonna follow LEDs lead and do a water jug test on some of the RimRock and my own Lee and MP 44 WCs out of my 3" doggie, if I can find something to approximate 'heavy winter clothing'. I have some drive belt that ATB fibreglas or nylon. So far whatever pistol load I've shot at the rolled up belt has stopped imbedded into the second layer (!). I may be able to drag up an old canvas tarp.
Ed <>><

[35remington]

I will say that wadcutters easily penetrate any amount of clothing.

[MOA]

I just load them up to where they're deadly at 30 feet. In SD mode you'll never feel the recoil.

[Led]

(Edited with some correction)

I have new chronograph data from the Bulldog.

First load is a RimRock 200g solid wadcutter, 4.3g Trail Boss, WSP, PMC Brass.

20 round string, Ave 684 Ft/s, ES 72 ft/s, SD 15 ft/s, 207 lbs/ft.

Why trail boss you ask, no real reason, I just wanted to try it and see if I could hit my velocity target of 700 ft/s. The load shot very well and is so close to my 700 ft/s target. The boolit was crimped in the crimp groove which put the slug very deep in the case. Next batch I won't seat as deep and up the charge just a little bit.

Next is a RimRock 185g SWCHP with 7.3 g Trail Boss

9 round string (The chronograph missed one), 778 ft/s Ave, ES 60 ft/s, SD 22 ft/s, 248 ft/lbs.

This load also shot very well and exceeded my velocity target. Recoil on this load was more than the 200g load but still within my tolerance. The RimRock SWCHP has a huge cavity. It would be interesting to see if it would expand at these speeds.

Notes:

Both loads were at 100% load density.
Burn for both loads was nice and clean.

Thanks,
Stephen

[nhithaca]

Great thread
I just bought a 45 ACP Pitbull, all steel nitride finish and recoil with 230 grain ball is brutal! Been a week and right thumb is still sore. Anyone have a suggestion for a medium weight low velocity load for this gun? 200 to 250 lead bullets @ 600+ FPS would I think be ideal. Have a Redding Profile Crimp die for 45AR so bullets can be well crimped regardless of type.

[Led]

Recoil gets out of control fast with the big bore Charters. I'd like to help but I haven't loaded for 45acp in 15 years.

Thanks for joining in.

Stephen

[35remington]

For the 45 ACP, 4 grains of Bullseye or Red Dot if you wish. Will work with the bullet weights mentioned.

At a given velocity, doubling bullet weight increases recoil four times, so it can be seen why increasing bullet weight 25 percent makes a load significantly less pleasant. Lighter bullets do what is needed if the bullet is nonexpanding and well shaped for impact.

[MT Gianni]

Living in SW MT my use of the Bulldog would be 4 legged creatures. I shot the Skeeter load when I owned one and it was accurate @ 25 yards. I didn't shoot it a lot but recoil, twist and second shot recovery were all OK. I prefer a 245 gr + bullet in my 44's.

[RU shooter]

Great thread
I just bought a 45 ACP Pitbull, all steel nitride finish and recoil with 230 grain ball is brutal! Been a week and right thumb is still sore. Anyone have a suggestion for a medium weight low velocity load for this gun? 200 to 250 lead bullets @ 600+ FPS would I think be ideal. Have a Redding Profile Crimp die for 45AR so bullets can be well crimped regardless of type.

Take a look at 45 auto rim data my speer manuals list dat for lower vel. Loads than the non rimmed 45 auto. BTW is the 45 pit bull the same size as the 44 bulldog ?

[Led]

Yes, Pitbull and Bulldog are the same size.

[onelight]

Here is a 45 pit Bull review that shows some of the dimension differences in the 38 , 44 and 45 CA.
https://rifleshooter.com/2015/07/the...45-acp-review/

[nhithaca]

Have tried loading 240 and 255 grain 45 Colt bullets in 45ACP brass for the Pitbull and had serious miss fires and light primer strikes. Did use the Redding crimp die to lock down the bullets thinking that the extractors would control head space correctly like a moon clip. Didn't work out.

Then tried loading 180 grain lead SWCs with a 6 grain load of Unique and standard large pistol Winchester primers correctly hand seated. Used fresh single use brass all within minimum length, sized, expanded and seated bullets with Hornady dies on a single stage press and crimped using Hornady taper crimp die to a mouth diameter of 0.472" (more or less standard). Still having light strikes and miss fires but not as bad and all loads fired on second or third try. Have been reloading over 25 years and have never had this many problems with any loads (except for 10mm after reusing brass 10 times with full house loads!). The factory loads I tried did work fine but the intent is to load with a light charge and light to medium weight bullet to lower the recoil in this relatively light weight gun. Any good guesses?

[Led]

I'd suspect the gun not the load. Wolff gun springs makes XP hammer springs for the Bulldog. I'm not sure if it would fit in the Pitbull. A quick email to Wolff could resolve that question. You're other option would be to contact Charter and send the weapon in for service. My Bulldog's barrel was slightly out of time when I got it. It caused point of impact to be left of center. I sent it in and they took care of the problem.

Thanks,
Stephen

[onelight]

Here is some 44 spec data from a 21/2" CA a 3" gp100 and a 45/8 Ruger Bisley. Starline cases , WW primers .
5.2 grains Red Dot . Hi-Tek .430 SNS 200 rnfp , roll crimped in crimp groove . 21/2" , 773 SD 13.1
3" 800 FPS SD 6.8 , 45/8 860 FPS SD 14.6
With a Hi-Tek Summers .430 , 240 SWC 4.6 grains Red Dot , 21/2" 688 FPS SD 14.8 , 3" 690 FPS SD 6.8 , 45/8 759 FPS SD 7.6

[nhithaca]

Thanks, mine too is slightly out of time so I agree, I will send it back to the Factory. The trigger is fairly good on this gun as is so I am hesitant at adding the XP springs.

[WDW44]

I got my first Bulldog, a 3", in '75 and added the 4" Target Bulldog soon afterward. I worked with everything available at the time, from the Lee 116 gr WC (!) to their 255 gr SWC, including the 208 WC, 210 SWCHP and 210 SWC, and including a 429421. I went fairly hot with some of the development, and found that the 3" Bulldog likes to keyhole when you get too heavy a boolit going too fast; I theorize that the muzzle flip exerts a vertical rotation to the departing slug. I worked mostly with Bullseye and Unique. Two of the 116s over 6.0/Unique was a fairly tractable load and the "two holes for the price of one" won me a lot of bets against my agency's range creeps who were in the habit of sharking beer money out of rookies... The only jacketed bullet I ever got to expand worth beans was the (sadly discontinued) Speer 225 gr 3/4 jacket SWCHP. The similar 240 would almost go fast enough but I ran into the recoil wall with any of the 240s before they would 'work'. When Speer developed the GDHPs, they dropped the JSWCs like crazy girlfriends, but while they were available, I worked that bullet up in the 4" M29 to 10.0/Unique and carried that load forever. I still have a partial box that I load in the 29 when I carry it, and a precious few of the bullets rat-holed. I found out that both Jim Cirillo and Jerry Miculek had worked up that identical load; JM said it was his favorite .44 Mag load, and one year I killed the South Texas Mini-Slam with it - a whitetail, a javelina and a coyote. The fully exposed, butter-soft core just makes this genius bullet outstanding. If anyone still has any of those I'd sure like to buy 'em.
I eventually obtained the said M29 I carried for decades, and recently found a 4" 624 and had to rediscover that despite the N frame, the skinny barrel means the Skeeter loads are on the ragged edge of high-speed controllability and shooter comfort. I had some with 8.0/Unique and a 429421 and after shooting a few in the 624, ended up shooting them out of a pair of 4-5/8" Super Blackhawks and my B92, then loaded some with 7.0/Unique for the 624 instead.
When I warm the Bulldogs up lately, I use the Lee 208 WC, the Lee 180 RN, the RimRock 200 DEWC or similar over about 4.0-4.5/231. This shoots pretty mildly. But if I were going to carry either of my Bulldogs 'seriously' again, I would work with 231, 700X or TiteGroup, in the neighborhood of five-ish grains, and the M-P HBWC out of a fairly soft alloy, inverted 'cup point' style. The fifteen I put in the 3" Bulldog and its speedloaders when I carry it are of that type. The inverted HWBC shatters the first water jug, splits the second and stops in the fourth, with textbook blossoming of the hollow, and shoots to the sights as well as any other load I've tried in it.
Good luck finding your perfect Bulldog load - Ed <><

Thanks Ed! Good info I can bet my life on. I wonder how the loads would do in Calibrated Ballistic Gel? I am not equipped to use that recipient for loads, but maybe someone else has, or will? Thanks again!

[racepres]

Thanks Ed! Good info I can bet my life on. I wonder how the loads would do in Calibrated Ballistic Gel? I am not equipped to us that recipient for loads, ut maybe someone else has, or will? Thamks again!

Been eons since I even gave it a Thought...But, I am confident in my very Old, very well used, Bulldog with 240 Speer Swaged SWC's over ~ 4.0 gr of Red Dot... Be a silly thing to Step in Front Of!!!