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Thread: 8,15x46R

  1. #1
    Boolit Master



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    8,15x46R

    I just bought a 100+ year old gun. I still have to verify, but it should be 8.15x46R. I’m looking for best boolit, both weight and shape plus all other information I can find out about it. Links to whatever speaks about it and it’s history. If you have experience with it, the various loads you’ve used.
    Thanks

  2. #2
    Boolit Master RU shooter's Avatar
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    My edition of COW list it as a .316 dia bullet ? If so a fat 30 or skinny 8mm should work depending on what the bore dia actually is
    If you find yourself in a fair fight, your tactics suck!

  3. #3
    Boolit Master
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    First I'd slug the bore and measure the twist just so I knew. Approximately 170 gr. bullets have worked for a long time in that cartridge. I don't have my loads in my head but I've used IMR-4198, IMR-4227, Reloder 7, IMR-3031 and SR-4759. I believe SR-4759 is where I ended up. Next time I'm in the shop I'll try to remember to check. For grins and giggles I worked up a duplex black powder load that was surprisingly accurate. There's quite a bit of data out there for the cartridge. ASSRA and German Gun Collectors are both good sources.
    "In general, the art of government is to take as much money as possible from one class of citizens and give it to another class of citizens" Voltaire'

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  4. #4
    Boolit Master



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    Quote Originally Posted by sharps4590 View Post
    First I'd slug the bore and measure the twist just so I knew. Approximately 170 gr. bullets have worked for a long time in that cartridge. I don't have my loads in my head but I've used IMR-4198, IMR-4227, Reloder 7, IMR-3031 and SR-4759. I believe SR-4759 is where I ended up. Next time I'm in the shop I'll try to remember to check. For grins and giggles I worked up a duplex black powder load that was surprisingly accurate. There's quite a bit of data out there for the cartridge. ASSRA and German Gun Collectors are both good sources.
    I keep hearing there’s a lot of data on this cartridge, but I’m sure having a difficult time finding it. I have all the dimensions, but not much more. I registered for the ASSRA forum and am waiting to have access. There may be some stuff there or someone who can direct me.

    I’m still looking for history of the cartridge, bullet types and weights, as well as loads with BP and smokeless.

    All information appreciated.

  5. #5
    Boolit Master
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    I'm having good luck with Lyman 319247 over 12.7 grains of 4759.
    I have cast some of the original 'stop-ring' boolits but haven't been able to shoot them yet.
    Warning: I know Judo. If you force me to prove it I'll shoot you.

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by GregLaROCHE View Post
    I keep hearing there’s a lot of data on this cartridge, but I’m sure having a difficult time finding it. I have all the dimensions, but not much more. I registered for the ASSRA forum and am waiting to have access. There may be some stuff there or someone who can direct me.

    I’m still looking for history of the cartridge, bullet types and weights, as well as loads with BP and smokeless.

    All information appreciated.
    As far as I know it was a smokeless cartridge from the beginning.
    The original boolit had a 'ring' or band that provided a positive stop in the throat, up against the rifling and the intent was to load it a little long and 'breech-seat' the boolit as you close the action.
    Warning: I know Judo. If you force me to prove it I'll shoot you.

  7. #7
    Boolit Master
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    http://www.feuerbixler.de/


    http://www.patronensammler.de/buchtipps.html
    Scroll down a little and you will find the book: Die Schützenpatrone 8,15 x 46 R und ihre Varianten

  8. #8
    Boolit Master
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    Axel Eichendorff says the 8.15 began life as a BP cartridge. I've not researched it and I'm not going to question Axel's knowledge of all things related to German firearms.

    "Ring" bullets were used in several cartridges from that era. Never tried one myself but have never read or heard of less than satisfactory results from those who have.
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  9. #9
    Boolit Master



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    Quote Originally Posted by JSnover View Post
    I'm having good luck with Lyman 319247 over 12.7 grains of 4759.
    I have cast some of the original 'stop-ring' boolits but haven't been able to shoot them yet.
    What kind of mould are you using and where did you get it? Is it a nose or base pour? From the only diagram I have, it looks like it is slightly hollow based, therefore I think it would need to be nose poured. Do your boolits look like in this diagram?
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Click image for larger version. 

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  10. #10
    Boolit Master



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    Quote Originally Posted by 17nut View Post
    http://www.feuerbixler.de/


    http://www.patronensammler.de/buchtipps.html
    Scroll down a little and you will find the book: Die Schützenpatrone 8,15 x 46 R und ihre Varianten
    I found the book and am considering purchasing it. Do you have the book? I don’t read German and my gun is actually a Francotte (Belgian) patent, made by Laine in Paris. Is there a lot information on boolit dimensions? I’m not looking for information and pictures of all the guns it was used with.

    I tried to send a Private Message, but for some reason I couldn’t. Is that your preference or is something not set up properly?

  11. #11
    Boolit Master
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    Quote Originally Posted by GregLaROCHE View Post
    What kind of mould are you using and where did you get it? Is it a nose or base pour? From the only diagram I have, it looks like it is slightly hollow based, therefore I think it would need to be nose poured. Do your boolits look like in this diagram?
    Mine has a flat base (it's a base pour mold) and only one groove ahead of the band, two below it. Bought it from BACO and it casts pretty well for me. They offer different dimensions to match your bore and chamber, since these were known to vary somewhat.
    Warning: I know Judo. If you force me to prove it I'll shoot you.

  12. #12
    Boolit Master



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    I just checked BACO. They’re listed as out of stock.
    PS: I grew up in Holland Pa. things around there have certainly changed.

  13. #13
    Boolit Master
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    Quote Originally Posted by GregLaROCHE View Post
    I found the book and am considering purchasing it. Do you have the book? I don’t read German and my gun is actually a Francotte (Belgian) patent, made by Laine in Paris. Is there a lot information on boolit dimensions? I’m not looking for information and pictures of all the guns it was used with.

    I tried to send a Private Message, but for some reason I couldn’t. Is that your preference or is something not set up properly?
    Lets just say that there are dozens of cartridge designs in 8,15x46R and more than a hundred of different bullet designs in the book. Every gunmaker in Austria and Germany made up their own reamer and bullet according to their needs/wants. No SAAMI/CIP here!
    Click image for larger version. 

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    You really need to get a full chamber + throat cast and go from there.

    I got Tom at Accurate molds to do me one that fits my 1937 Mauser 98 perfectly using 30-30 brass and a stop-ring bullet weighing some 185grains.
    Click image for larger version. 

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  14. #14
    Boolit Grand Master
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    before you order any bullets or a mold - slug the bore of the rifle. These Schuetzen 8.15x46R bores can be either .316 or .320. Order the wrong size mold or bullets - sorry!
    Buffalo Arms has the 2 different diameter stop ring bullets and molds

    If the bore is a 320 - any of the 32-40 non tapered .321 bullets will produce good groups. If the bore is 316 - same goes for the .319 32-40 bullet Standard weight of the stop ring bullets is 180gr
    The Accurte molds make a nice stop ring to the diameter for your rifle ... http://www.accuratemolds.com/bullet_...=32-182N-D.png
    Regards
    John

  15. #15
    Boolit Master



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    Buffalo Arms has boolits for sale, but are out of stock for the molds. I’m starting to think getting in touch with Accurate is the way to go. After I slug the barrel and maybe do a chamber cast. I had a look at Accurate’s web site for the first time today. I was very impressed!

  16. #16
    Boolit Master
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    Buffalo Arms moulds are always “out of stock,” in the sense that they don’t normally carry an inventory. If you order one, though, they reportedly show up in a gratifyingly short time.

    By all means, wait until you get your rifle and have your groove diameter before ordering a mould. A lot of those guns were assembled from parts made in small cottage industries, and everyone had a different idea of what “8.15mm” was. A friend had a “stalking rifle” that was more like a .303 caliber and one of those Tyrolean bolt-action single-shot target rifles that was a good 8mm at least. Both were marked “8.15.”

  17. #17
    Boolit Master
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    It seems to me you're trying to go about this as if it was a late manufacture, American made rifle of standard dimensions. It isn't and if you don't cast you chamber, check the twist and slug your bore things will only become more challenging. It's probably at least close to the average 8.15, whatever that might be but, without casting, checking and slugging you nor anyone else knows that.
    "In general, the art of government is to take as much money as possible from one class of citizens and give it to another class of citizens" Voltaire'

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  18. #18
    Boolit Master



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    Quote Originally Posted by sharps4590 View Post
    It seems to me you're trying to go about this as if it was a late manufacture, American made rifle of standard dimensions. It isn't and if you don't cast you chamber, check the twist and slug your bore things will only become more challenging. It's probably at least close to the average 8.15, whatever that might be but, without casting, checking and slugging you nor anyone else knows that.
    I am planning to do all that and then get a custom mold made. I was hoping to find something temporary to shoot while waiting. I ordered a Lee 8mm mold, but then found out about the stop ring boolit. If I have one of those, I won’t need to invest in dies.

  19. #19
    Boolit Grand Master
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    Greg, unless you want to wait for out of stocks to clear, slug the rifle bore and order a mold from Accurate Molds. Tom is never out of stock
    Regards
    John

  20. #20
    Boolit Master
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    In addition to the Haenel/Aydt, Schuetzen rifle I have a Bartles rifle on an Ideal action in 8.15. I call it a stalking rifle but I don't know if it really is. It loves the Lee, 170 gr., 8mm bullet, gas checked and sized to .321. The Haenel likes it pretty well also. You could try that for not much money....if that mold is available. I have several different 8mm's and so far, components have been readily available. I assume because 8mm isn't as popular as other calibers. I ordered a couple hundred bullets and a collet for my puller yesterday and they were in stock everyplace I checked.
    "In general, the art of government is to take as much money as possible from one class of citizens and give it to another class of citizens" Voltaire'

    The common virtue of capitalism is the sharing of equal opportunity. The common vice of socialism is the equal sharing of misery

    NRA Benefactor 2008

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Abbreviations used in Reloading

BP Bronze Point IMR Improved Military Rifle PTD Pointed
BR Bench Rest M Magnum RN Round Nose
BT Boat Tail PL Power-Lokt SP Soft Point
C Compressed Charge PR Primer SPCL Soft Point "Core-Lokt"
HP Hollow Point PSPCL Pointed Soft Point "Core Lokt" C.O.L. Cartridge Overall Length
PSP Pointed Soft Point Spz Spitzer Point SBT Spitzer Boat Tail
LRN Lead Round Nose LWC Lead Wad Cutter LSWC Lead Semi Wad Cutter
GC Gas Check