I need advice with Logic automation programing

[MaryB]

Wish I could come help "remove" one of them to my freezer LOL love elk!!!

[Three44s]

Wish I could come help "remove" one of them to my freezer LOL love elk!!!

Mary,

We give volume discounts!

Best regards

Three44s

[Three44s]

BamaNapper,

Thank you for so much effort in your drawing and explanation. I studied your diagram and will share it with the programmer who is offering to help.

In my mind, and perhaps I am too simplistic in my thinking, I thought it would be a single output pin going to a relay that triggers a set of delay timers adjusted to play a suite of obnoxious stimuli to send our vagrant hay munchers packing.

Another output pin to a different relay tied to another set of delay timers set up differently to cause a variation from the first sequence but triggering several of the same devices, albeit a different order of play and durations and overlaps.

And another, and so on.

Let’s say button one on the transmitter sending that coded message to the corresponding receiver keeps calling up the Microcontroller to switch from output pin x to pin y to pin z and so on each time that single button is selected.

I do not know what buttons 2 through 4 will be reserved for yet but I have a feeling as we work through this some rotation of apparatuses and elevation control?

Thanks so much and best regards

Three44s

[Three44s]

Update

I discovered amongst the many useful videos on the net a particularly helpful source:

toptechboy.com

I can see getting acquainted with coding myself. Paul McWhorter is an outstanding teacher in my opinion!

Best regards

Three44s

[gnappi]

Yes that’s true and I am gearing up with some 6 v lead acid batteries because my RF receivers run off 4 AA bats. They have four indicator LEDs that burn while they are live. I figure 24/7 operation will cause me to have to change those AA’s often.

The larger rechargeable lead acid hooked to a solar cell will save money and hassle very quickly!.

Thank you

Three44s

Depending on your remote load, if you decide on solar and rechargeable, overestimate the wattage on the solar cells and Ah of the batteries because cloudy/rainy days may not charge a battery sufficiently if at all. After one or more cloudy days, a higher wattage solar cell will be more likely to top off drained batteries on the next sunny day.

Also an inexpensive charge controller (CC) in lieu of a direct solar to battery connection will keep from frying the battery with a safe charge voltage / current with the charge profile for the battery chemistry you select. A CC with a 24/7 load control will cutoff the load when the battery charge gets at or just below the 50% (or better still programmable level) state of charge. This will help keep you from changing batteries too often. Using a smaller Ah deep cycle battery will help too.

[MaryB]

Keep in mind, unless you use lithium batteries the usable capacity of lead acid is half the stated amp hours to make the battery last more than a year.

[BamaNapper]

BamaNapper,

I thought it would be a single output pin going to a relay that triggers a set of delay timers adjusted to play a suite of obnoxious stimuli to send our vagrant hay munchers packing.

Another output pin to a different relay.... Three44s

You could build timers, but doing it in the computer is far simpler. All of your timers are just delays and counters in software. If you built hardware timers apart from the computer you'd have to redesign when you want to change them. It's much easier just to change a file with a text editor.

Concerning the relays: They come on a card that has 8 relays. That card uses one pin from the computer to turn the card on (the 'enable'), then 8 pins to fire the relays. So it takes 9 pins to fire 8 relays. You can then add a second card by using one more pin to enable that card, but use the same 8 pins for controlling which relay on the card. So 16 relays takes 10 pins. And 24 relays takes 11 pins.

There's no end to Arduino videos for different projects on YouTube. I haven't looked at toptechboy.com yet, but I will.

[Three44s]

gnappi,

Yes, I am cognizant about solar panel capacity. During the summer we are sunshine rich but in the winter when the elk are the most persistent, we have some very long stretches of fog and cold.

I am also aware of the need to regulate the charge from a solar panel and treat the micro controllers are very sensitive to voltages that are out of whack.

One grace saving thing about winter is that instead of trying to protect large swathes of real estate as in the summer, we are guarding a much smaller acreage and the batteries and solar panels will be doubled and tripled up, most likely.

Thank you and best regards

Three44s

[Three44s]

Keep in mind, unless you use lithium batteries the usable capacity of lead acid is half the stated amp hours to make the battery last more than a year.

Thank you Mary! That’s important.

Three44s

[Three44s]

BammaNapper,

To someone with your experience level, I suspect that Paul McWhorter (toptechboy.com) is too basic and that’s likely as it should be. But to me he covers things in depth enough that he does not lose me. He has just that spark if you will to keep from being boring.

I plan on getting a starter kit and following along from lesson one forward. I find that replaying his video a day or so later like the one he does to first introduce binary numbers was time well spent.

With regards to more microcontroller input vs. delay timers you are likely correct. I was just trying to limit the amount of skill set needs that I do not have (as in out sourcing) vs things I can and have done (build delay timers).

As far as redesigning the timers a lot of them use a potentiometer to adjust a time on or a length of delay. Others use a different level of capacitance and some utilize a combination of the two.

Three44s

[Three44s]

An update:

I have been watching the top tech boy.com vids and made it through about half of the 68 he has on the Arduino.

It has been fascinating and my next step will be to get the starter kit that Paul McWhorter uses for examples in his Arduino series and actually work along from the beginning.

While I do not have any fantasy about being able to code this particular project anytime soon, nor even call myself a “programmer” in the long run, being able rough sketch things out or even follow along with a real programmer suits me.

After the time spent thus far learning some uses of an Arduino and following the code examples, a lot of the “fog” I had has been lifted.

If my goal were only this project at hand (giving the elk the heave ho) I would not even consider investing the time and energy to learn some coding and circuit building however as I studied the situation and came to realize some of the potential afforded by micro controllers and microcomputers .....

...... I came to the conclusion that I wanted to become more useful to any programmer that might help me going forward.

(at least I hope I become more helpful rather than being a distraction! Lol!)

Three44s

[MaryB]

With arduino you will find pre-written code blocks online you can use to speed up building a complete program. Like random number generation, there are several examples available online. The program simulator lets you step line by line if you want so you can see what each line does for input, output, math etc...

[BamaNapper]

I came to the conclusion that I wanted to become more useful to any programmer that might help me going forward.
Three44s

PM sent

[popper]

I did an Atmel project for Boeing, very familiar with the ARM system so if you get stuck, glad to help. Develop on Win Xp or 7, USB download code to board and go. Most of the dev. tools are free from microchip. Only need to install for AVR series. Don't need the PIC stuff.

[Three44s]

With arduino you will find pre-written code blocks online you can use to speed up building a complete program. Like random number generation, there are several examples available online. The program simulator lets you step line by line if you want so you can see what each line does for input, output, math etc...

Mary,

That’s what I have been hoping for, that I would stumble into pre-written code that would fit my needs.

Thank you

Three44s

[Three44s]

PM sent

Thank you very much!

PM etc sent

Three44s

[Three44s]

I did an Atmel project for Boeing, very familiar with the ARM system so if you get stuck, glad to help. Develop on Win Xp or 7, USB download code to board and go. Most of the dev. tools are free from microchip. Only need to install for AVR series. Don't need the PIC stuff.

popper,

Thank you for the offer! I will keep that in mind.

Best regards

Three44s

[popper]

Note: ALL these processors start with the outputs in UNKNOWN condition (on or off). Therefore any pyro controls MUST have power applied AFTER the processor is up and running!! I.E. an ARM manual switch (that RED one). Don't forget to DISARM before processor is turned off.
Happy Thanksgiving.

[Three44s]

popper,

In my mind at least one pyro receiver will have to run 24/7 at each station while the elk are challenging us. If it will work, I would place other receivers on a timer relay to wake up.

Whatever the micro controllers need is another matter. If they have to run continuously, so be it. If they can sleep until called upon, that will conserve power.

Perhaps the relay bank is powered up separately, earlier, later, whatever is needed.

One pyro receiver unit has four coded channels, so I could power up in about Anyway imaginable depending on the systems requirements.

Thank and best regards

[.45Cole]

I assume that elk feeding in the hayfields isn't a big problem compared to them feeding on the stacked hay. How large is the area you stack the hay? The whizz-bang show is going to work until you or the neighbors or the elk decide they've had enough, plus it sounds like you are running the show based on visual detection (I assume they are active from sundown to sunup as I normally see raiding parties in my area holding those business hours)

There are electric mesh wire setups now that could be energized with a good fencer on the hay around the stack perimeter that may work well. The hay will insulate the charge and I can only imagine how a wet nose or an outstreched tongue would conduct a nice shock.

In all things there is a driving force and a resistance to change; nothing changes without a sufficient driving force. Hay is good, elk are very hungry (driving force large) the resistance to them feeding has to be larger than hunger*hay and remain large over time. If elk are very hungry but the hay is no good, there is no driving force to feed on the hay. If the hay is good and they have to brave a light and boom show they may, but if the hay is no good then they may lose interest for good.

The simplest solution is often the best.