Ye Ole 44-40 High Velocity Cartridges...some details

[Savvy Jack]

The little known and mostly misunderstood 44-40 "High Velocity" Load from Winchester.

I have really been digging into this HV stuff and this is what I have come up with. I will try to eventually get it in good order. The 44-40 High Velocity load was first seen in catalogs in 1903 and was last reported seen in 1941 although it was reported discontinued in 1938. It was introduced as the .44-40 Model M-92 "Special" ...High Velocity Low-Pressure Smokeless Powder Cartridges, however noted "Not For Pistols" and not to be used in the Winchester 73'. Keep in mind this was a Winchester product catered to Winchester firearms. These HV loads were good for the Marlin 1888 and 1894 as well as many other strong action rifles.

I am sure you have probably already seen this H.V. box label. This is what they probably looked like from 1903 to about 1928. The timeline is difficult to follow and much more difficult to explain. The most important features to note on this box is the "Oct 1909" label date and the "Low Pressure" call-out. I do not know of any earlier examples that would let us know if there are any different features on those earlier labels.This offering was reported to achieve 1,500fps at "low pressures". However, no pressures are listed.

Let's get to the components;

HEADSTAMPS

There are two variants of head stamps reported for the 1903 to 1928 cartridges and are as follows;

Headstamp: 1903-1928

• W.R.A. Co. .44W.H.V.M-92
• W.R.A. Co. 44W.H.V.M-92

A few things to note here since you can't see the headstamp itself.


Headstamp Variation A

• The dot in front of the "44"
• The "44" would be in Roman text
• There is a dash between the M and 92.

Headstamp Variation B

Same as variation one with the exception that the "44" would be normal text.

There is only one variation for 1929 to 1938

• W.R.C. Co. 44 W.H.V.M.92.

Note the dot in front of the 44 is omitted and the dash is changed to a dot between M.92. Also note the gap between the 44 and the W.


CASINGS

All cases were made of brass but had different features. The main feature would be the type of crimp used at the base of the bullet for bullet retention. Between 1903 to 1928 there were four different methods.

• No Crimp
• Cannelure
• Knurled
• Stab

The first three are common, the cannelure was usually a thin smooth line while the knurled was a thicker jagged type like the marks an electric kitchen can opener would leave on a can as it was opened. The last..the Stab crimp, was four evenly spaced out short horizontal crimp lines.

These new cases for 1929 to 1938 would use the larger Nickel primers, the No. 111 These primers had two variations, most were Oval but some were flat. Winchester tested flat primers every so often but always reverted back to Oval until 1976.

1929 to 1938 the casing variations were much the same but with only two variations, no crimp and a Knurled crimp.


PRIMERS

There were four different primer variations between 1903 to 1928 f which all were of the small type,

• Oval - copper
• Oval - copper with the "W"
• Oval - brass
• Oval - copper with a "W" w/horizontal lines under the "legs"

POWDERS

• 1903 to 1928 - I do not know what smokeless powders were used in these early cartridges, I will keep searching
• 1929 to 1938 - Dissected cartridges of this time frame yielded Sharpshooter powder

BULLETS

I hope most of you are already familiar with the bullet types, this will simplify things greatly! However, there are some features I would like to touch on a bit. By now the bullets used were 200gr. These particular 200gr bullets came in two or maybe three variations/options.

• Gilding Brass Jackets
• SP or Soft Points
• FP or Full Patch (full metal jackets for you youngsters)
• SP-Belted (not sure but may look like an exposed forward driving band)

These bullets were stamped with a "W" just above the mouth crimp on the Ogive. Those with this "Belt" will have the "W" stamped on the Belt. If you think the Tin has long been gone, check inside this "W" for traces of Tin. (Shuey)

Early on these Gilding brass jackets were plated with either Cupronickel or Tin. It is not clear if Cupronickel was actually used on the 44-40 bullets or just Tin. Tin is easily eroded by constantly polishing while Cupronickel will not come off. I have a few that have withstood the test of time but who knows... Shuey does not list any 44-40 HV loads as using Cupronickel, only Tin. The Cupronickel/Tin was used as a "lube" to prevent the soft Gilding copper from fouling the bore.

One last note. On these later offerings, the very last cartridges did not have Tin coatings on the Gilding jacket bullets.


From 1929 to 1938 the HV loads used 19gr of Sharpshooter. This gave nearly 1,600fps and 22,000cup (18,000ish psi), nearly double that of what is called normal pressures, 13,000cup. However, some late (1930's) offerings yielded only 14gr of Sharpshooter and some earlier offerings (post 1929) only 15.5gr leading one to believe that these HV loads, just like normal loads, were being neutered every year.

Two dissected Remington HV loads yielded (UMC) 18.8gr and (REM-UMV) 19.3gr of Sharpshooter.

Note the omittance of the "Low Pressure" call-out and the addition of the Special Sight Adjustment sticker.


This should be a late variation/offering .

• Large Primer, post 1928
• Flat primer
• Normal "44", post 1928
• No dot in front of the "44", post 1928
• Not Tin plated
• No W stamped on bullet
• Gilding Jacket
• Sharpshooter powder

Tin coated bullet could be post or pre 1929. This bullet was used to replicate HV loads tested in Clear Ballistics Gel. Performed excellent!

The Gilding SP was removed from the HV case photo'd. Similar in design but shows signs of a newer variation. Note the Tin plated bullet's crimp groove design is much like a lead bullet while the later design is more "U" shaped much like modern Winchester JSP bullets. The "U" shape design should not be trusted in handloads without a case cannelure or an assured resized neck for good neck retention.

The gel test results can be seen below. Impact velocity was 1,157fps and should be the velocity from a rifle at about 200 yards while normal loads would only be 1,035fps @ 100 yards. See Winchester's 1925 catalog.

Photos can be seen here;
https://sites.google.com/view/44winc...velocity-loads

[Der Gebirgsjager]

Thanks for the time put into this interesting and valuable research. It would certainly be unfortunate for someone to fire the HV ammo in one of the older, such as 1873, actions. Fortunately, there probably isn't much of it around any more; but somehow folks always seem to turn up the impossible.

[Savvy Jack]

Thanks for the time put into this interesting and valuable research. It would certainly be unfortunate for someone to fire the HV ammo in one of the older, such as 1873, actions. Fortunately, there probably isn't much of it around any more; but somehow folks always seem to turn up the impossible.

There were many other calibers too that were offered in High Velocity loads. These loads don't just apply to the Winchester 73' They were the 32, 38, 44 and even the 45-70. Although the 45-70 was obviously not offered in the 73, it was still high power and not for use in certain rifles. I don't know why folks go nuts when the 44-40 is mentioned but not the others.

There are plenty of high power loads for other calibers such as the 45 COlt, 45-70 etc.

Folks just not need be stupid.

[Der Gebirgsjager]

Folks just not need be stupid.

An admirable goal. Unfortunately, despite the best efforts of some to prevent it, there are those who manage to injure themselves or even drop out of the gene pool.

[Savvy Jack]

An admirable goal. Unfortunately, despite the best efforts of some to prevent it, there are those who manage to injure themselves or even drop out of the gene pool.

Exactly....and for much more than just one caliber!!!

[Savvy Jack]

Here is a list of some of the "High Velocity" options from just Winchester, omitting other ammo manufacturers. Some would fit in sub-ferrior firearms that could be disastrous....but we only seem to hear about the 44-40 and the Winchester 73'


25-20 Marlin HV
25-20 WHV
32-40 WHV
38-40 WHV
38-55 WHV
40-65 WHV
40-70 WHV
40-82 WHV
44-40 WHV
45-70 WHV
45-90 WHV
50-110 WHV

We all know the 45-70 is loaded HOT now days but for some reason these 45-70 folks don't seem to be as stupid as us 44-40 guys. Then there is the modern 45 Colt hot load shooters for Rugars that seem to be smarter than the other 45 Colt shooters. Seem folks are blowing up guns all day long!!!!

[Der Gebirgsjager]

Yeah....that hot .45 LC round worries me. Even in the modern repros. I'm guessing that we're using better steels, but the design hasn't changed. I've got two, but both are '92 repros, and I load below factory specs. Chamber one of the old toggle links for it, and I'm thinking accelerated wear if not eventual failure.

[Savvy Jack]

Here are photos of my Uberti 44 Magnum cylinder and 44-40 cylinder for the same revolver. Larger than the standard Cattleman revolvers.


Okay, wont let me upload photos, says quota is somethingoranother

[Savvy Jack]

Lets try that again.

First are the 44-40 cylinder comparisons from both the 44 Mag frame and Cattleman frame.

Attachment 270932Attachment 270934Attachment 270935

[Savvy Jack]

Can't find the info right off but the chamber wall thickness is very minimal between the 44 magnum and 44-40 cylinders

[Savvy Jack]