Titan ReloadingMidSouth Shooters SupplyStainLess Steel MediaRotoMetals2
Graf & SonsInline FabricationADvertise hereLee Precision

Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast
Results 1 to 20 of 51

Thread: Alliant Reloader 7 .44-40 load

  1. #1
    Boolit Master w30wcf's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Location
    Erie, PA
    Posts
    1,604

    Alliant Reloader 7 .44-40 load

    Back in March, 2005, there was some discussion regarding the Alliant Reloader 7 data for the .44-40.

    http://www.aimoo.com/forum/postview....yword1=44%2D40

    To continue........

    I did eventually try the 240 gr. cast bullet Alliant load of 23.5 grs. in my '73 (1882) .44-40. It went 1,170 f.p.s. in my rifle's 21" barrel. At 50 yards, the group was just under 1 3/4" with all bullets printing nice round holes in the target even in the slow 1/38" twist barrel.

    In a friend's 24" barrel it was almost 100 f.p.s. faster at 1,266 f.p.s. which is close to Alliant's published data of 1,290 f.p.s.
    http://www.aimoo.com/forum/postview....yword1=44%2D40

    A capacity load of RL7 does a nice job of duplicating black powder ballistics with good accuracy in the vintage .44-40.

    w30wcf
    aka w44wcf
    aka Jack Christian SASS 11993 "I can do all things through Christ who strengthens me." Philippians 4:13
    aka John Kort
    NRA Life Member
    .22 W.C.F., .30 W.C.F., .44 W.C.F. Cartridge Historian

  2. #2
    Boolit Master
    9.3X62AL's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    Redlands, NorKifornia
    Posts
    10,914
    Jack--

    I should have looked here before sending you the PM this morning.

    My 1897-vintage '73 WILL NOT shoot the 240-250 grainers--at all. It has done some decent work with the Lee 200 FN's with between 12.5 and 14.0 of 2400, but still throws a flier or two in every 10-round group. I'd sure like to shrink those groups down from the 2"-3" averages they've done in the past.

    The case-capacity/RL-7 load for the 200-215 grainers will be the next step in the 44-40 work for me. The 32-20 work with similar characteristics did fairly well, but the rifle's barrel is so new I think any results are kinda inconclusive until it gets a few miles on it--maybe with a couple hundred of those red-coated critters. These two hyphenated Winchester chamberings are going to be the focus of my range work this year.
    I don't paint bullets. I like Black Rifle Coffee. Sacred cows are always fair game. California is to the United States what Syria is to Russia and North Korea is to China/South Korea/Japan--a Hermit Kingdom detached from the real world and led by delusional maniacs, an economic and social basket case sustained by "foreign" aid so as to not lose military bases.

  3. #3
    Boolit Master w30wcf's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Location
    Erie, PA
    Posts
    1,604

    240 gr. Magma Cowboy bullet

    Deputy Al,

    The 240 gr. bullets I tried are a "Magma" cowboy design and are .675" long. It has more weight forward than the SWC designs.

    By comparison, the Lyman 429421 Keith bullet I have is almost .10" longer at .77". I can see why that one would not be stable at lower speeds in the slow twist.

    The tried and true 427098 is just a little shorter then the 240 gr. Magma at .64" long.

    w30wcf
    Last edited by w30wcf; 12-28-2005 at 11:47 AM.
    aka w44wcf
    aka Jack Christian SASS 11993 "I can do all things through Christ who strengthens me." Philippians 4:13
    aka John Kort
    NRA Life Member
    .22 W.C.F., .30 W.C.F., .44 W.C.F. Cartridge Historian

  4. #4
    Boolit Master w30wcf's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Location
    Erie, PA
    Posts
    1,604

    Reloader 7 / 215 gr. 427098 in a 24" barrel

    A capacity load of Reloader 7 under the historical 215 gr. 427098 bullet in the .44-40 24" barrel tripped the screens at an average velocity of 1,367 f.p.s. with very good accuracy.

    w30wcf
    aka w44wcf
    aka Jack Christian SASS 11993 "I can do all things through Christ who strengthens me." Philippians 4:13
    aka John Kort
    NRA Life Member
    .22 W.C.F., .30 W.C.F., .44 W.C.F. Cartridge Historian

  5. #5
    Boolit Master fourarmed's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Location
    Kansas
    Posts
    1,660
    I did a little experimenting with Rel 7 in the .44-40. I noticed that the type of primer used had a considerable effect on velocity and velocity consistency.

  6. #6
    Boolit Master Savvy Jack's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Posts
    204
    Quote Originally Posted by w30wcf View Post
    A capacity load of Reloader 7 under the historical 215 gr. 427098 bullet in the .44-40 24" barrel tripped the screens at an average velocity of 1,367 f.p.s. with very good accuracy.

    w30wcf
    John,
    What primers worked best for which bullets? Did you use the Remington 2 1/2 here?

  7. #7
    Boolit Master
    9.3X62AL's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    Redlands, NorKifornia
    Posts
    10,914
    Not certain what this could mean......just an FYI for now. I saw this older thread re-appear last night, then got woke up by a bad dream. The two occurrences aren't related, but I'm generally in bed this time of night. I went to the Alliant Powder site to see if they still recommended RL-7 for use in the 44-40 WCF, and found no such data. They DO list RL-7 for use in the 32-20 WCF with 100 grain Speer redcoats, and in "strong actions". Cowboy load data shows shotgun powders only with lead boolits. FWIW.
    I don't paint bullets. I like Black Rifle Coffee. Sacred cows are always fair game. California is to the United States what Syria is to Russia and North Korea is to China/South Korea/Japan--a Hermit Kingdom detached from the real world and led by delusional maniacs, an economic and social basket case sustained by "foreign" aid so as to not lose military bases.

  8. #8
    Boolit Master Savvy Jack's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Posts
    204
    Yeah, the information is not on their website but I was curious if it was in their latest published book. I think it is just the fact that manufactures seem to shy away from the 44-40 for some reason. I sent them an email but no response yet.

  9. #9
    Boolit Master w30wcf's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Location
    Erie, PA
    Posts
    1,604
    I went to my "library" and went through the Hercules & Alliant manuals I have.
    The first (though it may not have been the 1st) manual with the 44-40 RL-7 info I have is dated 1995 and the last (though it may not have been the last) is dated 2005.

    The 2011 Alliant manual only has 44-40 Cowboy loads with faster burning powders and no longer shows pressure data.



    w30wcf
    aka w44wcf
    aka Jack Christian SASS 11993 "I can do all things through Christ who strengthens me." Philippians 4:13
    aka John Kort
    NRA Life Member
    .22 W.C.F., .30 W.C.F., .44 W.C.F. Cartridge Historian

  10. #10
    Boolit Master
    9.3X62AL's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    Redlands, NorKifornia
    Posts
    10,914
    Jack--

    I've used 23.5 and 24.0 grains of RL-7 with SAECO #446 pretty extensively in my 1897-made '73 in 44-40, and the loads run accurately enough for deer (2"-2.25") at 100 yards from its casual-condition bore. This has been with R-P and W-W brass, and the brass shows no sign of fatigue after 4-5 loadings. I just get concerned when I see a powder maker deleting data from past listings--wondering whether ballistic anomalies are to blame, or just economics and customer preference--hence my post.

    The 16.0 grains/RL-7, Rem 6-1/2, Starline brass load using Lyman #311316 @ .313" in my Marlin 94CCL beats 1873 ballistics a bit (1550-1575 FPS), but is without doubt its most accurate load to date at any velocity. Something good is going on with that combination.
    I don't paint bullets. I like Black Rifle Coffee. Sacred cows are always fair game. California is to the United States what Syria is to Russia and North Korea is to China/South Korea/Japan--a Hermit Kingdom detached from the real world and led by delusional maniacs, an economic and social basket case sustained by "foreign" aid so as to not lose military bases.

  11. #11
    Boolit Master Savvy Jack's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Posts
    204
    Thanks guys. I picked up a 1lb of the yellow label yesterday but they also had new label bottles. I was wondering if the formula may have changed.

  12. #12
    Boolit Master Savvy Jack's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Posts
    204
    Quote Originally Posted by w30wcf View Post
    I went to my "library" and went through the Hercules & Alliant manuals I have.
    The first (though it may not have been the 1st) manual with the 44-40 RL-7 info I have is dated 1995 and the last (though it may not have been the last) is dated 2005.

    The 2011 Alliant manual only has 44-40 Cowboy loads with faster burning powders and no longer shows pressure data.



    w30wcf

    Wonder why no data for the 200gr for RL-7

  13. #13
    Boolit Master Savvy Jack's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Posts
    204
    I probably have 1,000 240gr bullets looking for something to be shot in. I just might have some fun.

    Never mind...they are LSWCs!

  14. #14
    Boolit Master
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Posts
    2,788
    Don't why Alliant dropped the Rel7 44-40 load data. Maybe since it is right on the edge of being too slow for most tastes.

    I tried Rel7 in a 44-40 Win 92 a few years ago under the 240 gr bullet and it seemed to do fine. But since then have settled on the 200 gr traditional style bullet and 5744 for the rifles and light loads of Trailboss for the handgun.

    However Rel7 is the best powder I've found for my Win 73, 32-20 under the Lyman 311316. Maybe, just enough difference in expansion ratio between the two cartridges to favor the Rel7 in the 32-20
    Trust but verify the honeyguide

  15. #15
    Boolit Master Savvy Jack's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Posts
    204
    Quote Originally Posted by fouronesix View Post
    Don't why Alliant dropped the Rel7 44-40 load data. Maybe since it is right on the edge of being too slow for most tastes.

    I tried Rel7 in a 44-40 Win 92 a few years ago under the 240 gr bullet and it seemed to do fine. But since then have settled on the 200 gr traditional style bullet and 5744 for the rifles and light loads of Trailboss for the handgun.

    However Rel7 is the best powder I've found for my Win 73, 32-20 under the Lyman 311316. Maybe, just enough difference in expansion ratio between the two cartridges to favor the Rel7 in the 32-20
    Not to get off topic but I do play around with TrailBoss for my revolvers.

    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	DSCF2320.jpg 
Views:	29 
Size:	36.0 KB 
ID:	55420
    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	DSCF2319.jpg 
Views:	24 
Size:	48.9 KB 
ID:	55421

  16. #16
    Boolit Master
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    N.E. Ohio
    Posts
    488
    SavvyJack
    Reloader 7, yellow label is made in Sweden
    the early Reloader 7 had brown indicators in it, and was supposedly made in the USA, I use it in my in my 30-40, I use WC680 in the 32-20 until I run out, both are close to the same burn rate
    the earlier powder seemed to burn a little cleaner, sight settings were the same to 200yds.

    HTH

  17. #17
    Boolit Master Savvy Jack's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Posts
    204
    This is actually the new bottle I was referring to
    Name:  reloder_7_lg.jpg
Views: 1084
Size:  12.1 KB

  18. #18
    Boolit Master
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Posts
    2,788
    Here's the two types I've loaded. Used the Hercules type (can on left) primarily for 222 Rem and for certain 22 Hornet loads- until I ran out. The Alliant type (bottle on right) have been using more recently (last few years?) for several cast bullet applications ranging from 45-70 to 32-20. There may be a difference between them but I never made a direct comparison. Rel7 seems to fill a load density niche for my loads falling somewhere between 2400 and 5744.
    Trust but verify the honeyguide

  19. #19
    Boolit Master Savvy Jack's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Posts
    204
    As soon as I run across some 5744 and some 4227 I'm gonna get some!

  20. #20
    Boolit Master Savvy Jack's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Posts
    204
    I loaded up some test rounds a few minutes ago. Gonna head out to the range in the morning to test them out.
    44240RN-4 240gr LRN 23.4gr RL7 (3-D manufactured out west somewhere)
    L44A-240SWC 240gr SWC 23.4gr RL7 (Georgia Arms)
    BigLube 200gr LRN 6.6gr TrailBoss

    Gonna get my scope zeroed in too (Marlin 1894CB). If this all works out I am going to try some jacketed HPs 180gr and 200gr as well as Winchester 200gr JSPs I ordered yesterday. If the pressures are indeed below 15,000 I'd like to try those SWC in my small frame SAA revolver. For some reason the barrel on my large frame 44 mag likes to lead up, hard or soft lead. I'll deal with that later.

Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
Abbreviations used in Reloading

BP Bronze Point IMR Improved Military Rifle PTD Pointed
BR Bench Rest M Magnum RN Round Nose
BT Boat Tail PL Power-Lokt SP Soft Point
C Compressed Charge PR Primer SPCL Soft Point "Core-Lokt"
HP Hollow Point PSPCL Pointed Soft Point "Core Lokt" C.O.L. Cartridge Overall Length
PSP Pointed Soft Point Spz Spitzer Point SBT Spitzer Boat Tail
LRN Lead Round Nose LWC Lead Wad Cutter LSWC Lead Semi Wad Cutter
GC Gas Check