8mm mauser oal 185 grain rn fp

[george t]

hi! i am new to the forum as of today. i am looking for the over all length for a gas checked 185 gr round nose flat point cast bullet. looked every where but could not find the info.
could some point me in the right direction or just give me the info?

thanks- george t

[Der Gebirgsjager]

Hey George---welcome to the forum! Your question is fairly simple to answer. There is an OAL for any given cartridge in the loading manuals, but that should apply to any bullet used. The only thing that might change that is if you have an unusual chamber of some sort, or if you're running your rounds through a lever action. Unlikely for 8mm Mauser! Levers can be pretty picky and individualistic about what they feed. But, for example, in a bolt action with a standard factory chamber the OAL is as specified in the loading manual. There's usually a schematic drawing of the cartridge at the beginning of the section for that particular cartridge, and the OAL is shown a part of the drawing. That figure, or less, and you should be good to go.

[lar45]

Hi George,
For best accuracy with cast bullets you need to seat the bullet into the rifling just a little.
That is generally what set's the overall length, ad long as it will still fit in the magazine if you want to feed from the magazine.
The nose profile will be different for different bullets. Some will engage the rifling sooner than others.
Be sure to size your bullets to fit the throat, or at least .001-.002" over groove diameter.
Let us know how it goes.
And we need pics of your rifle

[george t]

hmm! gonna check that out. the reloading manuals i have show different OALs for different bullet weights and bullet shapes, bit none for a 185 rn fp cast bullet.

i think remember reading somewhere a while back about using dummy rounds and inserting then into the chamber until the bullet just touches the rifling. gonna have to research that. all the old reloading info bookmarks i had accumulated over the years got wiped out by a computer fart.

thanks - george

[Oldfeller]

Mauser "built in" box magazines feed from right and left positions as normal functions and this is something you need to TEST FOR at least several magazine fulls in your own gun before seating a bunch of bullets.

Nose form and OAL do count in a Mauser box magazine's right/left feeding scheme --- so don't get tripped up with them !!!! What works in the left hand position will not work from the right ......

Rounds loaded long to be "engraving the rifling" in a Milsurp Mauser are very likely too long for feeding from the magazine, so they will have to be shot as "drop in" rounds on an empty magazine.

George, you won't get your OAL from a book when shooting your own personal Mauser. Figure it out in your own gun likes and write it down in your load book.

[oconeedan]

You can skip the dummy round step. Load your first round, with bullet very long, NO crimp. Put in chamber and try to close bolt, but don't force it. If bolt won't close, seat the bullet a little deeper, and try again. Repeat until you can close the bolt.
Inspect bullet for signs of engraving by lands/grooves so you know if it is touching rifling.
Then load in magazine and see if it will feed. If not, you have no choice but to seat deeper.
Once you have bullets will feed in your chamber, and your magazine, you are there and you can crimp if desired.
Once you have this figured out, I take one brass and make a dummy cartridge with it, no powder or primer. Keep this in your die box for future set up of dies.
Dan

[HangFireW8]

I would not skip the dummy. Nothing like hard extracting a loaded round, leaving a bullet the the bore, and powder everywhere including binding up the bolt and magazine follower.

[Slugster]

You can't just "drop in" a round in Mauser rifles. Mausers have controlled round feeding from the staggered magazine, and you have to feed from the magazine or the extractor's hook will be behind the case head when you try to close the bolt. If you neck size your cases as I do, you can jam a cartridge into the chamber that will require a cleaning rod to remove. Ask me how I know this.

[Larry Gibson]

Would help to know the nomenclature of the specific 185 gr GC FN bullet you're using? Either the mould designation (not the catalog number) and a picture?

[waksupi]

I would not skip the dummy. Nothing like hard extracting a loaded round, leaving a bullet the the bore, and powder everywhere including binding up the bolt and magazine follower.

I'm with you. I always seat them a few thousandths deeper.

[oconeedan]

I stand corrected, and agree with the others. I still use my method on determining oal length, leaving it as long as possible without sticking in the bore and still feed well from the magazine. Sorry about that poor recommendation.

[george t]

hi y'all from the northern sierra mountains. with moving, computer crashing and losing all bookmarks, and old age nonexistent memory, i lost track of this post and never got back to answering.
first, thanks for all the helpful advice. sorry i never got back to you folks. i must have followed your advice because i found a dummy round in die box that i had forgotten about.

i sporterized (read "macgyvered") a 1938 Turk mauser that ended up shooting rather well. i am giving it to one of my sons.

i have been given a 1916 Spandau Mauser that was minimalistically sporterized before i got it. i have reblued it and made a custom stock and added a scope. but i have yet to shoot it, hence in researching my old load for the Turk i stumbled across this post.

i am only going to be plinking/target shooting out to 100 yards. do i need to find the correct OAL for each rifle or is the OAL i used for the Turk close enough for the Spandau for just hitting the gong?

BTW would you like to see photos of the two project guns?

thanks- george t

[725]

Always like to see pictures.

[TurnipEaterDown]

On the seating length, it all really depends on just what you want to do, along with the bullet design of course as mentioned in prior comments.

Mauser designs feed best w/ original cartridges w/ OAL near design.
There is a fair amount that goes on with the feed rails that many people I have been around fail to understand, and if you change the cartridge, or OAL significantly, you can run into feed issues from the box magazine.

Many rifles shoot fine w/ bullets seated significantly off the lands, and this does apply to cast bullets as well.
This very fortunate for military Mauser rifles being used for informal target shooting, converting to hunting use, etc.
Many Military rifles have long throating.

I seat cast bullets in my Yugo 24/47 8x57 practice gun (and other rifles to be frank) so that the mouth of the cartridge just covers the uppermost grease groove. Keeps the lube uncontaminated that way, should something gritty be in the box due to whatever cause (wind blew something in while sitting on bench, the loose tumbling media kernel found a new home, etc.).
Seating this way, as long as nothing jams at chambering, I just work with it and tweak things to get accuracy.
Acceptable accuracy for me w/ a cast bullet & good gun is OK w/ 5 shots at 1.5" @ 100 yd. A beater gun like my Yugo 24/47s: 10 shots into 2.5" @ 100 rested, 4.5" standing (I add 2" on a normal - good day). I get this sort of accuracy seating this way: I focus on function, not worrying about jump.


On Mauser feeding loose rounds:

Mauser 98 design rifles, while initially (purposefully) designed to not allow the extractor to 'snap over' the rim on chambering a round fed from a loose position over the magazine, Actually Will, and do so safely. There are a number of basic 98 design variations out there, made for differing rounds, built in differing countries.
Yes, Mauser designed the original 98 not to do that, and feed properly only when picking up from the magazine well, but every Mauser 98 base design I have owned (all original Military actions, either left alone or re-chambered, Brazilians, GEW 98, VZ24, Yugo 24-47s) all feed loose rounds easily but 1 gun I have owned.
The exception that I own that will not feed a loose round is a Brazilian that I rebuilt to a belted magnum w/ an aftermarket extractor claw that I had to fit. Being on a DG rifle, I fit it tight to get best grip on the rim and did not bevel the face of the extractor. This one will not jump a rim, and I am OK w/ that, but as mentioned earlier, IF you do have a Mauser that won't snap the extractor over a rim pushed ahead of it, it can be a pain to punch the round out if you are not at home. It also isn't necessary that the cartridge be neck sized to create that problem. I don't neck size my 416, and it will set a cast bullet round tight into the chamber if I try to loose feed it. I had one miss-feed in that gun during early function testing, and I went home early that day as I did not bring a dowel with me.

Many people will next tell you that the Mauser 98 will break the extractor if you do push feed it like I described.
My Yugo 24/47s haven't and I shoot them constantly w/ 5 in the box and another fed loose over the top. I also don't think my 6mm-250 Improved VZ24 has chambered many rounds Not fed loose from the top, as I never altered the feed rails to work with the drastic cartridge shape change, and it feeds that round very poorly from the magazine.