Help Locating .410 Shotgun Reload Data for the Svarog Sabot Slug

[Get-The-Lead-Out]

Ok so I messed up BIG at the start by assuming the two of Lee's .410 molds were for a shotgun when in fact another commenter here fortunately brought to my attention that those molds were actually for a 41 Magnum

So after the commenter's other suggestion for looking into the Svarog and Lyman .410 shotgun sabot slug mold, I found the Svarog on Ebay but ablsolutely no results on Ebay or net for a Lyman .410 sabot slug mold. So I've been relentlessly trying to find the specific load data for this Svarog .410 sabot slug but still absolutely no results, which blows my mind after seeing how many thousands of these molds have been sold over the years.

Here's just a couple listings I found on the Svarog sabot slug mold on Ebay:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Sabot-Slug-...w/273419906620

https://www.ebay.com/itm/410-Gauge-S...e/133457410488

So my wife's shotgun is a Mossberg 500 .410ga Made In USA that just bought her brand new last Fall, and its barrel has stamped into it "Chambered For 2 1/2 And 3 Inch Shells. 410 Bore - 24 Inch Full Choke"

I know to use W209 primers like I do with my 12ga Lee 7/8oz KeyDrive slug loads as well as for my 20ga Lyman's 350gr Sabot slug loads, and so I mainly need to know what powder and wads to use and what shot cards if any are needed. I will also be using either the Remington and/or Winchester 3" hulls whereby using the fold crimp like works perfectly for my 12ga and 20ga slug loads.

I've also contacted the sellers of the Svarog mold on Ebay but seeing they are in Russia, I can only hope they understand and speak good English so there's no communication farts that screw up the understanding between us like it notoriously often does when we've tried to ask questions with sellers from Asian countries

[Springfield]

Can you shoot slugs in a full choked gun?

[Get-The-Lead-Out]

Hi with all due respect to you, please ask that question through means of your own thread or can easily search and find that particular subject matter as its quite commonly discussed, unlike me trying to find load data for these particular sabot slugs

The reason I'm politely asking is because of how many times my threads quickly get hi-jacked by unrelated questions 'n' such whereby then everyone starts coming into my threads talking about everything but the actual topic of the thread

but just in case someone thinks I'm doing something dangerous thus why you might trying-to-be-concerned-for-our-safety-and-thats-all type of thing, I've shot slugs through my 12ga and 20ga shotguns that have the same barrel as my wife's 410, for the past several years without any problems. I just wont shoot slugs through those modified or adjustable chokes that screw on your gun like my 20ga has a turkey choke that screw on the barrel

[littlejack]

Been searching the net, and as you stated, looks to be limited loading information on the 410 ga. with slugs. I found a couple sites that may be of some help to you. I did not dig deep
into these sites, just quickly scanning for information. One site, fourten.org.uk, and another, Dedicated to the Small Bore Shotgun.
If "I" were starting this endeavor, I would look up reloading data for a shot charge weight that matched the slug weight I was going to use. From information available, and available moulds, I would probably opt for the svarog slug. Next, I would measure the choke restriction and decide how that particular slug would fit that choke. If the slug needed to be sized down, I would buy one of the LEE push through sizer dies of the proper diameter. I would start with a lower starting load recommended in the manual. I may have to add extra spacer card wads to bring the slug up to height for the proper crimp. Fire for effect, and proceed with working up to the recommended powder charge in the manual, keeping and eye out for pressure signs. "I am not telling you the procedure to take in reloading 410 slug loads". I'm just stating how
"I" would approach it. If you're wife is not going to shoot to much, you could always buy the slugs on line, if available. Maybe BPI or another supplier.
Regards

[Get-The-Lead-Out]

Hi well thank you

that was actually helpful and I genuinely appreciate you taking your time to look into things.

After I posted my previous response here last night, I did some more searching, and on like the 12th page of my search results I came across one of the sites you mentioned, Small Bore Shotgun, but only had saved to it to my favorites folder until had more time to read through it.

The fourten.ork.uk site is one I dont think I've come across yet and so going to check it out this evening.

Will opt out of buying shells and slugs.... I wouldn't bother with reloading the .410 but around here in eastern Ohio the 410 ammo is only being stocked on a couple different store's shelves but in VERY small quantities which get bought up before I can even grab one 25-round box ....grrrrr but hey I dont blame the buyers since they know if they dont buy it up, someone else will and so its a dog-eat-dog world when it comes to ammo

So since I'm sitting on plenty of Remington and Winchester 410 hulls, and have approx 200lbs of recycled wheel weight lead I melted down into 1lb ingots, and I love to reload during the winters months due to spinal cord injury keeping me in a wheel chair which makes it difficult to get outside and do much of anything in the snow and cold, I'll do anywhere from 1000-1500 rounds at a time and then come good weather we love putting holes in an old junk down in the back yard including a honda civic that we owe some vengeance to lol.

[littlejack]

Go to the Castboolits home page. Up on the right edge just below the top, is the Advanced Search. Type in 410 slug loads. There are some archived posts there, you may be able
to get some load data from.

[W.R.Buchanan]

Goto Ballistic Products Inc. and they will have data for loading their "Thug Slugs" You will be fine with that as the payload is nearly identical.

How many of these slugs does your wife plan on shooting? I have some (4 boxes) Factory Loaded Federal Slugs that run at 1725 fps. I've shot 5 rounds in many years. This is a little better than a .357 Mag but not as accurate at longer range as a .357 Rifle or Pistol..

So if you are planning on hunting with that round be aware that it is a 25-30 yard combo at best, and that is if you are able to achieve any usable accuracy from your loadings in the first place. Not like a 12 ga slug, where if you hit the animal just about anywhere it will go down eventually. A 125 gr boolit is going to need to be placed precisely to be effective.

As far as Full Choke? Virtually every .410 Shotgun ever made with a fixed choke will be Full Choke. A slug will go thru just fine.

You might look at BPI's Thug Slugs, they are made in Italy and are about as accurate as you will find and they have ribs to go thru full chokes. They also have a fixed tail wad which eliminates the need for a separate wad and improves accuracy.

Just charge, insert slug, and crimp closed.

https://www.ballisticproducts.com/Th...tinfo/1264100/

Hope this helps.

Randy

[littlejack]

Good information Randy.

[Get-The-Lead-Out]

Here's the link to the Svarog web site where we can find the specifications and other information pertaining to the Svarog .410 Match (sabot) slug, and round ball if preferring to go that route
https://en.svaroghunt.ru/410-kalibr-puleleyki


DESCRIPTIONS FOR THE SVAROG MATCH (sabot) SLUG:

HUNTING, CALIBER, EXPANSIVE
Slug 410 gauge, the original shape, resembling a “cap” for a pneumatic weapon, has a flat head and a tapered “Skirt” with an internal cavity. The shape of the slug has gained popularity all over the world - the bullet has received many names Sabot Slug, Match, Match cap, Diabolo.
Ideal for both hunting and for practical shooting.
It has a high stopping effect.

SPECIFICATIONS:

Bullet for 410 gauge

Head diameter 10.4 mm ............. 0.4094 inch

Bullet height 11.8 mm ............. 0.4645 inch

Bullet weight 7.6 grams (117gr) ............. 0.2670 ounce

SLUG IN ACTION

A slug fired from a smooth-bore gun almost does not rotate (as in rifled), so the Sabot Slug bullet, Match, Match cap, Diabolo, thanks to its flat head, stabilizes in flight by the oncoming air flow, does not ricoche and gives off its kinetic energy to the target as easily as possible due to faster deceleration.
"Skirt" formed by the tail part of the bullet, improves the obturation. Due to the internal cavity, inside the target, the slug expands, with an increase in diameter, which provides a strong stopping effect.

[Get-The-Lead-Out]

Thanks for the additional information everyone! Will definitely read your comments more thoroughly this evening

FOR ANYONE WANTING TO BUY THE SVAROG MATCH (SABOT) SLUG MOLD:

It is sold by Svarog on Ebay and coming from Russia for 114.00 free shipping (which we all know there is no such thing as free shipping... the sellers just include the shipping cost within the purchase price)

Can get the same mold from them for a MUCH LESSER COST by going to their website and buying it!

I did a moch check out and was given the following costs: RUB is Russia's currency in Rubles

Subtotal ... RUB 2300.00 (concerted to US dollars = $30.10)

Shipping ... they offered Express DHL for RUB 3155.00, and Air Mail for RUB 1750.00

( I chose the Air Mail since it stated that will still be delivered within 14-30 days and so RUB 1750 converted to US dollars = $22.90)

Vat ... RUB 243.00 (VAT is Russian for Tax and converted to US dollars = $3.18)

Total RUB 4293.00 (converted to US dollars = $56.18)

HUGE SAVINGS WHEN BUYING DIRECTLY FROM THEM INSTEAD OF FROM THEIR EBAY LISTING... YES, YOU WILL GET A BETTER RETURN POLICY DUE TO EBAY'S UPDATED MEANS FOR WHICH TO RETURN ITEMS THAT ARE DEFECTIVE WHEREBY YOU DONT PAY THE RETURN SHIPPING, HOWEVER THERE SHOULDN'T BE A PROBLEM HAVING TO RETURN THIS MOLD but I will read into their return policy just to see if there's any of those fine-print scary terms n conditions ;o)

[Get-The-Lead-Out]

Goto Ballistic Products Inc. and they will have data for loading their "Thug Slugs" You will be fine with that as the payload is nearly identical.

How many of these slugs does your wife plan on shooting? I have some (4 boxes) Factory Loaded Federal Slugs that run at 1725 fps. I've shot 5 rounds in many years. This is a little better than a .357 Mag but not as accurate at longer range as a .357 Rifle or Pistol..

So if you are planning on hunting with that round be aware that it is a 25-30 yard combo at best, and that is if you are able to achieve any usable accuracy from your loadings in the first place. Not like a 12 ga slug, where if you hit the animal just about anywhere it will go down eventually. A 125 gr boolit is going to need to be placed precisely to be effective.

As far as Full Choke? Virtually every .410 Shotgun ever made with a fixed choke will be Full Choke. A slug will go thru just fine.

You might look at BPI's Thug Slugs, they are made in Italy and are about as accurate as you will find and they have ribs to go thru full chokes. They also have a fixed tail wad which eliminates the need for a separate wad and improves accuracy.

Just charge, insert slug, and crimp closed.

https://www.ballisticproducts.com/Th...tinfo/1264100/

Hope this helps.

Randy

Thanks for the info

and I will opt out of buying shells and slugs.... I wouldn't bother with reloading the .410 but around here in eastern Ohio the 410 ammo is only being stocked on a couple different store's shelves but in VERY small quantities which get bought up before I can even grab one 25-round box ....grrrrr but hey I dont blame the buyers since they know if they dont buy it up, someone else will and so its a dog-eat-dog world when it comes to ammo

So since I'm sitting on plenty of Remington and Winchester 410 hulls, and have approx 200lbs of recycled wheel weight and pure lead I melted down separately into 1lb ingots, and I love to reload during the winters months due to spinal cord injury keeping me in a wheel chair which makes it difficult to get outside and do much of anything in the snow and cold, I'll then do anywhere from 1000-1500 rounds at a time and then come good weather we love putting holes in an old junk down in the back yard including a honda civic that we owe some vengeance to lol.

[gpidaho]

I have the Svarog slug mould for the .410 and it is a full bore slug. This means it doesn't fit in the plastic wads like the Lyman 525s. I powder coat mine so the run about .408 on the front band and .410 on the skirt. The band is small and it's my opinion that you should be fine with your full choked Mossberg if the slug is seated over a gas seal with fiber wad-wads and a nitro card.The BPI BXI410 would be another option in the stack or cutting the petals off of other plastic wads like the WAA410s As Randy said go with BPI slug data. Gp

[Get-The-Lead-Out]

I have the Svarog slug mould for the .410 and it is a full bore slug. This means it doesn't fit in the plastic wads like the Lyman 525s.

Thanks! That's interesting since I didn't consider shooting the Svarog sabot slug without using a wad since all loads for my 12ga 7/8oz keydrive slugs and 20ga 350gr sabot slugs use a wad.

I did find the Svarog website's details for their .410 Match (sabot) slug which gives the casted slug's measurements

I posted here in this thread and the measurements are:

SPECIFICATIONS:

Bullet for 410 gauge

Head diameter 10.4 mm

Bullet height 11.8 mm

Bullet weight 7.6 grams (117gr)

My dad is a machinist and has drills that are incremented by .001 to .002 and so just to get a better idea of what my wife's .410 barrel choke measures versus what the diameter of the Svarog sabot slug measures.
I'm certain my dad has the inside 'calipers' for measuring the bore of such a small diameter but since he usually doesn't like helping me with projects relating to my guns, I'll sneak over to his shop where I know his drills are and borrow them, while he's currently working doubles, to check the .410's inside barrel diameter at the fixed-choke end of it....

and hey, if anyone has a dad like mine and especially a machinist who keeps things METICULOUSLY organized, you BETTER put EVERYTHING back JUST the way you found it cause they KNOW EXACTLY how they placed EVERYTHING in their shop!!! lol I mean that dad of mine even knew when I borrowed his oil can because he actually places it in a VERY specific direction next to his milling machine. So when I put it back and was facing just a few degrees off he walked over to my house a couple days later carrying the oil can and so I turned down the volume of the youtube video I was watching and NEVER answered the door lol... I KNEEEWWWWW what he was coming over for lol and then a few weeks later he invited me out to breakfast, his treat (that should of been the dead give away to me that something was up lol ) , and GUESS WHAT... yep he said I wasn't gettin home fries with my breakfast because I borrowed his oil can without asking... I slapped my face and just laughed even though I knew he was jokin about me now not getting home fries but yet he was actually serious about me not asking to use his closely-guarded-sacred oil can lol

[littlejack]

You can clean the bore good. Find an oversized lead ball just a few thousandths bigger than the muzzel end. Drop it into the chamber, and drive it out the muzzle with a good wooden dowel. I use a 1/2" oak dowel. Then, measure the diameter of the equator ring. Thats how a lot of folks (including me) check their bore size.

[W.R.Buchanan]

GP: were you able to get any accuracy out of those slugs? Also how much do they weigh?

Normally this type of slug stabilizes by weight forward and flies like a Badminton Birdie,(Drag Stabilized) same as a Foster Style Slug. These are less aerodynamic than a Foster Slug and tend to be much more finicky about loading techniques and fine points as it is all about "Exactly" how the slug is launched.

Since the Skirt is "Blanketed" from the Air Flow, due to the shape of the nose of the slug, it can't work like Feathers to stabilize the slug. If the slug is cocked any amount off dead true to the bore axis it will fly someplace other than where you expected. This might yield a 2" at 25 yard group, or a 10" group. No way to predict, strictly luck of the draw.

That's why I say 25-30 yards max and I would expect "Keyholing" even at that distance..

Full Choke on the .410 is .395 or .015 less than cylinder bore. That is .0075 per side which isn't much restriction and any of the .410 Shotgun Slugs will go thru no problem.

.41 Caliber Pistol Boolits are a different story. Don't Do That!

IF I was you, I'd go to BPI and buy some of those .410 Thug Slugs and see how they work. They will be much easier to put together to try out, and I doubt the Russian Slugs will produce better accuracy than the BPI ones.

Any way Good Luck and keep us posted as to your results.

Randy.

[gpidaho]

Randy: To be honest, I haven't shot many. I'm easily distracted LOL. My next gun purchase is going to be a better 410 as of now I just have a Rossi break barrel and all I can say for sure is they hit the dirt berm somewhere in the neighborhood of where I'm aiming. As to weight, mine weigh 111.5gr. They look just like mini Lyman pellet slugs but, as I said above they are close to full bore at .408 band and .410 skirt. I'm headed down to Florida Thursday to visit the kids and do some fishing but will make it a point to send a few when I get back and will post a try this or don't do that load for get-the-lead-out. Gp

[cwlongshot]

I have become smitten by the Henry AXE in 410... The 410 has always held a special place for me.

I picked up a 0 & 000 Buck mold last month waitin on the 00 Buck next. Dusted iff my 30 yr old MEC loader in 410 too!! I wanna start loading some buck shot loads. (12 & 410) Maybe try some of these "Russian" slugs too!

Watching with interest!! 40year caster and reloader here but I have never loaded a buck shot load!! Fired a bunch!!

CW

[Get-The-Lead-Out]

Just to give an update:

I mentioned how I had approx 200 lbs of lead... well that was a little on the low side of the estimate. I actually have 325 1lb bars of wheel weight lead good for my pistol and rifles rounds, but I was out of soft lead for the shotgun rounds. Not sure how it is where you live, but here in the tri-state of Ohio, Pennsylvania, and West Virginia, for the past several years I've called no fewer than 10 recyclers within a 1 hour radius and only one would resell to the public which luckily is just a 20 minute drive. So called them thismorning and I picked up 165lbs for .50lb ....it comes in old lead pipe from house plumbing, lead flashing that was used on roofs n such, and quite a few other means. Me and the wife melted it down this afternoon and ended up with about 160lbs

I was saying how I was going to use the 3" hulls but when I looked through my box I actually have about equal amounts of 2 1/2 and the 3" hulls and so will probably just have to wait and see what some of you think I should go with. I was thinking the 2 1/2" hull so maybe wouldn't require as many 'fillers' as what the 3" hull might require.

I have at least 1000 Winchester 209 primers but I know some will say (and possibly rightfully so) that if I use the powder they use and/or recommend, I might have to use the CCI primers or something... just please dont tell me to use the Remington primers... good grief those are expensive

As for the wads, was nice to hear from GPidaho that there's a really good chance that I wont even be hassling myself trying to figure out the right wad to use with the Svarog sabot slug whereby the diameter of the cast bullet is sized to shoot without a wad, and so I will be looking at the different spacers/fillers/cards between the powder and the slug

So now I'm ready to order the Svarog .410 Match (sabot) mold and I posted a comment on the payment and shipping details which looks like I will be getting the mold within 3-4 weeks and then cast a few bullets and then mic them to see its exact size and if it matches up to what GPidaho said his is measuring to

So for now, finally able to check out some of those websites several of you gave me a heads-up on for me to check out

[W.R.Buchanan]

I know you think you want to cast these slugs? Before you do that, maybe a good idea to buy some of the BPI Thug Slugs to try out, and/or maybe try to get GP to send you some of his slugs from the same mould to try before you waste $100 on a mould that isn't going to do what you think you want.

If this was a good idea we'd all be doing it, and also be of a lot more help than we've already been.

Just sayin' do a little more research before you spend the $. There is alot of better things you can do with all that lead.

Randy

[Get-The-Lead-Out]

I know you think you want to cast these slugs? Before you do that, maybe a good idea to buy some of the BPI Thug Slugs to try out, and/or maybe try to get GP to send you some of his slugs from the same mould to try before you waste $100 on a mould that isn't going to do what you think you want.

If this was a good idea we'd all be doing it, and also be of a lot more help than we've already been.

Just sayin' do a little more research before you spend the $. There is alot of better things you can do with all that lead.

Randy

Hi Randy Thanks for the suggestion but like I already said here in this thread at least a couple different times now

"I will opt out of buying shells and slugs.... I wouldn't bother with reloading the .410 ........" but "I love to reload during the winters months due to spinal cord injury keeping me in a wheel chair which makes it difficult to get outside and do much of anything in the snow and cold, I'll do anywhere from 1000-1500 rounds at a time and then come good weather we love putting holes in an old junk down in the back yard including a honda civic that we owe some vengeance to lol."

besides that, I also already outlined here in this thread the total purchase cost of the mold whereby after its ALL said and done... purchase price, shipping price, and tax isn't anywhere near the 100.00 but is only going to be a bottom line total of the $56.18 us dollars

but hey please dont hear me as trying to be combative with ya... I'm just trying to get the point across that reloading the .410 with the Svarog sabot slug is something I am certainly doing and I wont buy ANYTHING but maybe the slug loaders manual from Ballistic Products website even though it is now only a download that's available, and even though it don't (or 99.9% chance that it dont) have the Svarog slug in it, the manual along with your guy's deeper knowledge of slug loads, will help me to responsibly work my way to the proper load