Niko camera photos of my new Sharps 1874 Montana Rough Rider-PHOTO HEAVY

[Big Mak]

And a question.
After measure Ogive, I made a dummy bullet (no powder, primer) and noticed the starline brass would not fit the chamber. These cases were used in my springfield trapdoor and I fixed the issue by doing a resizing full body length, then they fit the Sharps chamber fine!
After primering and belling the mouths, I proceded in making 20 test loads.
65 gr (*by volume, then trickle by weight) Old Enysford 2F black powder
.030 greased veggie wad
Compressed with a Montana Compression die .090
520 gr BACO "Money Bullet" compressed the load further by .100
Taper crimped ever so slightly to eliminate the bell (so they would fit the chamber)
Wiped their butts and chambered each load to insure they *fit*

Q1: The next time I load these 'fired' pieces of brass, as I understand it I should NOT resize, but merely deprime, clean, primer, bell the mouth and load it with wad,powder and bullet and slight crimp to remove the belling. This should technically "fit" the chamber without having to resize, Correct???

Finished cartridge is last photo.












Background:
A 2 year wait for this custom build as I ordered it when I retired in 2018. Picked it up a week ago from Tuesday.

I cast my own 520 gr bullets using a BACO "Money Bullet" mold. 20/1 lead.

Caliber: 45/70
Barrel: 30" heavy Octagonal
Wood: Semi-fancy Walnut
Buttplate: Traditional Steel
Metal Finish: Pack hardened
Brass Escutcheons
Fireblued polish screws
Custom bedding
Custom long range sightsby Steve Baldwin: rear Vernier Tang and bubble-leveled globe front with interchangeable silhouette patterns.

[Maven]

Nice rifle and beautiful photography, Big Mak!

[smoked turkey]

Whew! That is extra nice Big Mak. I agree. Your pictures are very nice. I'll bet as nice as they are, the rifle is nicer in "person". From the pictures and write up it looks like you are ready for a test run. Be sure and let us know how she does. It will be awesome I just know. Congratulations on a beautiful rifle. You deserve it.

[725]

Best photos and rifle I've seen. Congrats.

[Hiwall55]

Yep, the next time load should work, I bell the cases to make sure the bullet fits, then compression die, hand seat bullets. Make sure your brass is clean, I use ceramic media and
Soap. Good shooting.

[smithnframe]

Very nice!

[bedbugbilly]

Fantastic photos and WOW! What a beautiful rifle! Love the casehardening and the wood is super select!

[Bent Ramrod]

That is a pretty gun, all right!

You should be able to use the shells without resizing next time. If the case mouths are properly chamfered, they may not need belling either. The expanded cases might need a grain or so more powder to seat the boolit to the same depth. If everything is right, the boolits should go into the cases with a twist and push, and stay there with careful handling. Sometimes seating will compress the air in the case and push the boolit back up until it leaks out, but a plastic cartridge box of the proper height should keep everything together when the lid is closed.

After many loadings, the cartridges may begin to get hard to push into the chamber. I generally FLS and expand and bell them when this happens. I myself haven’t really seen significant accuracy differences between FLS and fireformed shells. Of course, the Shiloh chambers are minimum size, unlike those of Trapdoors, that had to keep firing, no matter how fouled the chambers and bores.

[EDG]

Spectacular color case on the metal parts.

[GOPHER SLAYER]

I would first like to say, that is a beautiful rifle and you cast great bullets. I will tel you what I have found to be the easier way to size the case. I never bell the case mouth. I expand it with either a Lyman "M" die or one I have made. It makes reloading much easier and never misaligned the cast bullet.

[Big Mak]

Thanks fellas, and thanks for the answer to the Q I had from several of you.

I figured the Trapdoor had a much larger chamber than the tolerance of the Sharps.

[Big Mak]

When I look at some old 45/70 bullets, they used to crimp the hell outta them.
Here is my cast 500 gr boolit I cast next to a bullet that had an 1887 stamp on the bottom of it.

[Big Mak]

A couple more oldies, 500 and 405 grain I presume.

[Big Mak]

Last photo, I believe these were copper cartridges, but they're not balloon type.
The box is simply for effect. They did not come out of this box.

[MikeT]

You must keep in mind, the target loads you are probably building are not in need of the crimp because they will not be subjected to the same "rough handling" as military ammo.
Keep on hav'n fun!
MikeT

[Big Mak]

You must keep in mind, the target loads you are probably building are not in need of the crimp because they will not be subjected to the same "rough handling" as military ammo.
Keep on hav'n fun!
MikeT

Roger wilco!

[Texas by God]

That gun is too nice to shoot. Simply gorgeous.
I’m kidding about the shooting part- 2 years waiting to hear it roar? Let Er rip.

[hiram]

Art work

[Gunlaker]

Very nice!

A few things I'd suggest trying as you experiment would be:

1. do all of your compression with the die and none with the bullet.
2. try an unlubed wad. I've always been happy with a 0.060" LDPE wad.
3. get your case mouth expansion sorted out so you don't have to do a taper crimp at all. I usually load a couple of thousand rounds a year for my Shiloh's and I've never used any sort of crimp. Basically you want to eliminate even the smallest possibility of deforming the bullet in any of your reloading steps.

As far as sized vs. unsized cases go, I find you can get superb accuracy either way. Often with the .45-70 the cases will shorten 0.010" or so upon firing so they might come out a little shorter than you like. If that's the case then try to use a bullet that, when seated all the way out, has some lube groove showing at the case mouth. If you decide you'd rather size and use neck tension then I recommend the Shiloh inline seating system. It's not cheap but it will ensure that your bullets are seated with basically zero runout, and it also ensures that your loaded rounds will always fit your Shiloh's chamber. Their seater is made from a section of barrel that has been reamed with the same reamer as used on the chamber so it's a perfect fit.

Good luck in your journey. You are definitely starting off in style!

Chris.

[Big Mak]

Very nice!

A few things I'd suggest trying as you experiment would be:

1. do all of your compression with the die and none with the bullet.
2. try an unlubed wad. I've always been happy with a 0.060" LDPE wad.
3. get your case mouth expansion sorted out so you don't have to do a taper crimp at all. I usually load a couple of thousand rounds a year for my Shiloh's and I've never used any sort of crimp. Basically you want to eliminate even the smallest possibility of deforming the bullet in any of your reloading steps.

As far as sized vs. unsized cases go, I find you can get superb accuracy either way. Often with the .45-70 the cases will shorten 0.010" or so upon firing so they might come out a little shorter than you like. If that's the case then try to use a bullet that, when seated all the way out, has some lube groove showing at the case mouth. If you decide you'd rather size and use neck tension then I recommend the Shiloh inline seating system. It's not cheap but it will ensure that your bullets are seated with basically zero runout, and it also ensures that your loaded rounds will always fit your Shiloh's chamber. Their seater is made from a section of barrel that has been reamed with the same reamer as used on the chamber so it's a perfect fit.

Good luck in your journey. You are definitely starting off in style!

Chris.

Thank you Chris. Tell me more about the Shiloh inline seating system? Where do they sell them? No luck with google search.