Marlin 1895CB w/26" barrel considerations?

[HawgBonz]

..Been lurkin around a bit and it would appear that I have a reasonable spread of commonly used powders to start with already on hand from other loading thru the years. Got Unique, 2400, H322 & 335 & 4198 plus Varget (stay outta my Varget! 308) Also AA2015, while in the range, I've never seen anyone suggest it although there's a starting 405gr load on their site that might be ok. Got molds en route. Lee for now. The 340 and 405gr PB FN's IIRC. Both are 457. Hope I didn't jack that up but the reviews seemed mostly positive. And yeah, I'm gonna plug the barrel but the Lee's were cheap enough to just try'em and see. Plus a lot of the others just ain't available right now. This will be my first attempt a casting my own.

..Anyways, it's all for a Marlin 1895CB(JM) 45-70 with a 26" octagon barrel, ballard rifling. Everything else I have is way shorter than that and while I know it's an individual rifle thing I was wondering if there were any leanings I should consider for the barrel length starting out? I was gonna try Unique, 2400 and mebbe the H4198 at first. I've got a ton of H335 around, but it's my understanding that it's more for full tilt loads?

..Main use will be for deer and hogs in south central NC area on paper company owned property, private hunt club. Generally <200yards with under 100 being the norm (the usual). There will be "x" amount of plinking at fire ant mounds out as far as ya feel like lobbin'em in the new cutovers just for the halibut in the off season. That used to be grande fun with a 17# class bench gun. Lookin forward to it with this one as well.
..I was thinkin somethin in the mid range (14-1600ish?) would be easier on the old shoulder and have enough oomph to get it done on any of the local inhabitants of said club and mebbe a possible Elk later on. I ain't married to any bullet heavy or light nor am I opposed to buying a different powder if needed. I would like to K.I.S.S. if at all possible.
Thanks much for any useful or entertaining commentary..

[Winger Ed.]

Get a Lyman Cast loading book. There are several whole pages covering the .45-70.

I hunted with the modern lever gun info and the 405 in my Marlin CB.
It works, but I'm still not sure which end of it is more dangerous than the other.

I've since dropped down to their loadings for the old trapdoor Springfield.
Accuracy is fine, and not so punishing to shoot.

Which ever way you load, you have got to learn the trajectory for the range.

[Ozark mike]

I shoot black and h322 exclusively in mine because i also own a bfr and those are the 2 powders that work in both black for reduced loads and some h322 for when i feel i need some since knocked into me. And without getting into debate both guns are capable of sub moa when my eyes work right

[HawgBonz]

..Is there a particular version of the Lyman manual that's more applicable and can be bought currently? I see reference to several different editions quoted often. Trajectory is easy enough to get down between PB software and "practical application" to paper and fire ant mounds.
I'll be putting a 4-12x scope on it for load/bench work in an attempt to keep me and my ain't-20-something-anymore eyes out of the equation.
..Is 1400-1600 with 340 or 405 still in the "punisher" range for recoil in that light rifle? That's what I was seeing for Trapdoor velocities on the Hodgdon site. I had a ported GG very briefly when I was a lot younger. Fired it once with factory ammo w/o ears to see how it would be in the hunting woods. I sold it after that shot. More for my ears than the recoil.

Get a Lyman Cast loading book. There are several whole pages covering the .45-70.

Ozark mike- So the 322 is a more "full tilt" loading option in your opinion than something that can be effectively and safely reduced?
It wouldn't break my heart if my 6.8's favorite powder was saved from this hungry beast.

[Norske]

My Marlin 1895 sees mostly a 400-405 gr cast bullet over 38.5 gr IMR3031, a factory equivalent load according to my 1967 Lyman loading manual. For a "modern lever action" load, it's the same bullet over around 40 gr Reloader 7 or Ramshot Exterminator. If I get in a tight spot hunting black bear, the last 2 cartidges out of the magazine are Buffalo Bore which kick like a 12 gauge slug gun. a friend has a Marlin 1895 that really likes LeveRevolution factory ammo (cloverleaf groups @ 100 yards). Mine isn't all overly impressed with them.
When I was shopping for a 45-70, I was cautioned by a man who owned 5 45-70s (black powder cartridge shooter). He didn't like the straight grip on the Cowboy Marlin. According to him, pulling the rifle tight into his shoulder was done with the little finger of his trigger hand. He said after a number of shots, that finger got sore resulting in the rifle getting a running start at his shoulder. He convinced me to get a rifle with a curved pistol grip. To each his own.

[Ozark mike]

..GG.



Ozark mike- So the 322 is a more "full tilt" loading option in your opinion than something that can be effectively and safely reduced?
It wouldn't break my heart if my 6.8's favorite powder was saved from this hungry beast.

The h322 can be down loaded but as the pressures go down the amount of unburned powder seems to go up. So i use 60 grains by weight of black under this bullet

I imagine you could drop down to 15 -20 grains without having problems igniting the powder. I would use filler if ya go that low to keep it next to the primer to keep accuracy. I also use 30 grains h322 under 3 round balls for a guard load the problem with that load is i dont get good spread up close. More of a long range buck shot and this is a compressed load. H322 is a easy powder to get along with unlike some others dont fret just make sure the projectile exits the bbl with reduced loads

[Norske]

Western Powders' Accurate 5744 is described as being position insensitive (no fillers needed) and friendly to reduced loads. I have a bottle, but I've used it very little. As for unburned powder complaints with other powders, the residue may be ash. I once swept up "unburned" 2400 and tried to ignite it with a lighter. It didn't burn.

[Duckiller]

I shoot Lee 340 and 405 gr boolits in my 26" 1894 Marlin, Load with minimum amounts of Trail Boss. Minimal recoil. Can't hunt with cast in Cal. Will solve this soon. Moving to Oregon soon. Even with a 26" barrel it is still a light gun and will beat you up with heavy loads. I do have some hunting loads with 5744.

[Winger Ed.]

..Is there a particular version of the Lyman manual that's more applicable and can be bought currently?:

I'd just get the current blue cover, 4th edition, 'Lyman Cast Bullet Handbook'.

.45-70s are so old, (still)popular, and so many folks shooting them, the info. on them in the book is very extensive.

[HawgBonz]

Thanks much for the responses, fellas!! I'm takin it all in.
One of yer brethren is helping me out to get started via email AND snail mail.
Whot a buncha great folks here!!

[NorthMoccasin]

A 300 to 350 gr FP at 1200-1300 FS will kill any deer pronto, and not beat you up. Lymans 330gr HP cast of a soft alloy (2-2-96) is my fave for hunting over a modest dose of 2400. The 300gr fp (Lyman or RCBS) over 15gr Unique for knocking over steel plates and general plinking. More weight and or velocity is NOT needed unless hunting ton+ critters.

[HawgBonz]

A 300 to 350 gr FP at 1200-1300 FS will kill any deer pronto, and not beat you up. Lymans 330gr HP cast of a soft alloy (2-2-96) is my fave for hunting over a modest dose of 2400. The 300gr fp (Lyman or RCBS) over 15gr Unique for knocking over steel plates and general plinking. More weight and or velocity is NOT needed unless hunting ton+ critters.

Right now for me I'm thinkin mid-ish teens tops for velocity and it's not really about "needing" the extra mass. It's just to try hunting with really big n slow.
Somethin that'd poke thru a coupla hogs at once would be nice as well. Last year's setup was a 6.8SPC with 90gr GD's and it did everything I wanted.
The 45-70 is just cause I haven't done it yet. Also, one of my guys at hunt club got a double last spring and I gotta play catchup now.
..That said, I'll prolly end up using the 457-340-F mould after I get tired of lobbin a 16th # of lead downrange every pull.
That is if the 457" is gonna fit proper. Haven't gotten to try it out yet. That's what the barrel slugged to.

..Side note- My "old" family is from SW Va. Woodlawn in particular. Around Fancy Gap and Galax. Spent some time in Tazewell, too.
All very beautiful places. d:^)

[Ozark mike]

The lee moulds were a bit undersized for my 95gs but could be paper patched or lapped. I lapped mine and they worked fine but in the end i went with accurates custom offerings because i can have em made to any finished diameter baised on alloy. Tom really is the best and i wish i would of known this at the beginning so i wouldn't have bought the lee moulds with the exception of the 457 rb mould

[HawgBonz]

I lapped mine and they worked fine but in the end i went with accurates custom offerings because i can have em made to any finished diameter baised on alloy.

..I'm just getting to the point of figuring out which alloy to start with. I'll try the Lee's and see how it goes. Comments I see about them here differ from what I've read in reviews (Midway). The 452-255-F I got throws .454" with the same initial/experimental alloy that throws .457 in the 457-405-F.
Go figger..

..If I end up keeping with this I'll prolly gourd head and get something better later. Hopefully these work good enough to try anyways.

..One thing I've always disliked about more traditional type rifles was carry options. With my "military style" rifles I have slings that QD to the top rail or some such and they're carried upright and low on my right side. They can easily be slid to the back to get them out of the way and shoulder w/o "unslinging". I've never liked the over the shoulder carry and "in my hand" gets in the way of using my hands in the woods. Which I do a lot in this thick. d:^)

[Ozark mike]

My guide gun has no sling cause when im in the bush i have got to be ready for a charge so i need it already in my hands. All the bears ive came upon have went the other way but ill hopefully be ready the day that one decides thats his ground im standing on. On that note though i do want to get a scabbard like this for my bike

[MT Chambers]

I really like my 95 cowboy gun and use it for most of my serious hunting, one thing for sure is recoil, lots of it, especially with boolits over 400 grains, it doesn't stop me though as I use right up to 555 gr. flat points.

[Ozark mike]

I really like my 95 cowboy gun and use it for most of my serious hunting, one thing for sure is recoil, lots of it, especially with boolits over 400 grains, it doesn't stop me though as I use right up to 555 gr. flat points.

Ya aint kiddin ive ran loads through mine that make a 12ga seem tame

[rintinglen]

I loaded some top end 495 grain (my alloy), Lyman 457-406 3031 loads. Ended up with three stitches in my hand when recoil drove the sight base into the web of my thumb and index fingers, Unless you are concerned with rampant Mammoth attacks, there's no need to go there. You can't drive those big boolits fast enough to materially flatten the trajectory, and they will beat you mercilessly if you choose to go there.

I shot one for a couple of years in lever-action rifle silhouette competition, and the 1873 Springfield loads are much more fun to shoot. They will kill any deer you might encounter unless you have a time machine.

[Deadeye Bly]

Rifle powders like 4198, Re7 and 3031 should produce good loads in the 1300-1400 fps range. Even Varget is listed in the Lyman manual. These should give a good loading density that is not position sensitive. For Hogs I would go for bullets in the 400 grain range. The Lyman 457193 is a good bullet for lever guns and generally casts about 420 grains. Big hogs have tough skin and you want a bullet to punch a big hole all the way through. Some folks want a lighter bullet with a higher velocity but big honkin' slugs are the way to go.

[shortlegs]

I like 35 gr of RL7 under a 300 gr bullet for a little over 15oo fps. Not bad on recoil in my marlin and the rifle likes it too. I get 4" at 100 yards with the factory open sights, thats the best these 67 year old eyes will do.