Boolit weight and molds for a Ruger PC Carbine 9mm

[Wm Cook]

I would like some advice specific to bullet weight and molds for a Ruger PC Carbine 9mm.

Is the MP Mold 358-165-RF, 4 Cavity Hollow Point too heavy for this rig?

As is, the Ruger has a 16.5” barrel with a one in ten twist. I’m good to go for a 124 grain RN mold but since I have a 16”+ barrel to work with I would like to try dropping down to a slower powder and have something heavier than the 124 grain to get some use out of the Ruger’s barrel length.

MP has a four cavity HP that drops a 165 grain at .358. They currently show them in stock but am I wrong in thinking that 165 grain is too heavy for a 9mm? I loaded a few 9mm’s but not many so this is a new venture for me. As for velocity, I’m not looking to set land speed records and subsonic loads would be just fine. This will be used for self-defense and plinking at distances not to exceed 50 yards.

NOE has some a two cavity FN in the 135 that might work but one cavity drops PB and the other cavity is GC. I would like to stick with gas checks because I’ve had a lot of luck with them with.

So in this case I would like to find a .358 mold that would drop something like 135/140 to 160 grain, four cavity, gas check and while I’m shooting for the moon I would ask for a brass mold.

As a side note; my first mold from MP is coming tomorrow. The purchase (314-140 SledgeHammer, Hollow point) was painless and it’s being delivered within a week of being ordered. On line when I was checking out they offered a discount on a 40 grain Hornet, four cavity, brass, GC mold and I picked that up as well. I’m a sucker for casting and shooting .22’s.

[sigep1764]

Accurate has several heavy for caliber molds in 9mm. NOE has the Elco boolit that works with shorter throats. I believe one or the other offers brass molds as well. I don't know if I'd go as heavy as 165 due to the base getting swaged in the tapered case of the 9mm. Also, I've never seen the need for a gas check in 9mm so long as the case is expanded deep enough and the round is not over crimped. But if you prefer gas checks, theres no harm in that.

[cwtebay]

I'm not commenting on your cast choices - but I will speak to differing performance from pistol to carbine loads for pistol caliber carbines. Performance is sometimes VASTLY different between the two. Oftentimes velocity is decreased appreciably with a longer barrel due to powder being burnt long before the bullet exits the barrel. I have found that lighter bullets with slower powders tend to be better in my own carbines.

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[Wm Cook]

Thanks. What is an Elco boolit?

And by shorter throat I’m guessing that since it’s a rifle (carbine) the distance from lands to case base is less than a pistol’s lands to case base. I’m almost exclusive to long guns and live by being off the lands .xxx”, touching the lands or into the lands .xxx when working up a load for accuracy. Thanks, Bill.

[sigep1764]

A short throat or leade is the basically the the introduction to the rifling. Usually in the past, the rifling had a gentle slope to squarely introduce the boolit to the bore of the barrel. Nowadays, it is a step that gun manufacturers are skipping. This leads to an issue where lead boolits have to be seated very deep in the case in order to chamber. The Elco boolit is a way around this. It has a stepped nose allowing it to not touch the rifling but still chamber.

If someone has a better way to describe this, please chime in. DougGuy, where are you?

https://noebulletmolds.com/site/prod...358-155-tc-as5

[tazman]

The ELCO boolit was designed from the beginning as a heavy for caliber 9mm boolit. It can be seated longer and still chamber in the majority of 9mm handguns, even those with poor leade. The hollow point version drops at 147 grains with my alloy(range scrap) allowing easy data acquisition.
It was referred to as ELCO in it's first development and production run. The ELCO part doesn't appear much in the listings anymore.
Do a site search for ELCO and you will find several threads about it giving the results obtained.
It performs very well for me in all my 9mm handguns. I don't currently own a pc carbine so I can't properly address it's usage there.

[sigep1764]

Thanks Tazman!

[shortlegs]

Noe has a 358-136-fn-s1 4 cavity gc mold in stock

[Burnt Fingers]

I've had my Ruger PCC for a couple of years now.

The two boolits I use the most in it are these.

https://www.mp-molds.com/product/357...e-groove-mold/
https://noebulletmolds.com/site/shop...cavity-bb-elco

I've also shot this one quite a bit.

https://www.mp-molds.com/product/mp-...5-hp-pb-4-cav/



I've got no need for a gas check boolit for 9mm. I size my 9mm boolits to .357, coat with Hi-Tek and shoot. I've got more than a dozen 9mm firearms and these boolits work in all of them with no leading.

[Wm Cook]

Thanks to all. As of 2020.08.13 it seems that the current opinion is that 165 grain is too heavy for the 9mm and that something in the 125 grain is more appropriate. So be it. I'm new to 9mm's so I have nothing to bring to the party.

To that end I'm going to go with the 125 grain MP 359 -125 Hollow point PB 4 Cavity because of the HP (self defense) and the testimony of the author brnt' fingers. He seems to have a lot of experience with 9mm carbines, specifically the Ruger PC.

MP has a number of them on the shelf and that's something that I'm not used to.

As I said, Burnt Fingers has history with the Ruger PC and I hope he's still following this thread. Burnt Fingers or anyone else that has experience with 9mm carbines; if you could you give me the top three powders you used and the starting charge/velocity you started with for a 125 grain boolit it would be appreciated. I have a 10 meter range in my shop that I use to shake out velocity and first impression of accuracy and that would be a huge jump start to the project.

Thanks to all, Bill.

PS: And if Brn't Fingers could share the OAL of the 125 grain MP plain base HP it would be greatly appreciated as well.

PPS: I have a Lyman sizer/lube/GC. MP doesn't recommend a specific punch. How do you determine what punch you use for their molds?

[Landshark9025]

Whatever you settle on, get the most number of cavities you can. PCCs in 9mm are hungry buggers.

I run the MP 147g Competition RN as the 147g FP has trouble feeding with no feed ramp. Loaded to about 950fps with a silencer is just so much fun.

[sigep1764]

Hard to go wrong with a pinch of Red Dot. 2.8 grains is nice in the 120 to 135 grain range. You could up it to 3.3 and wring a little velocity out of it depending on your oal.

[Burnt Fingers]

Whatever you settle on, get the most number of cavities you can. PCCs in 9mm are hungry buggers.

I run the MP 147g Competition RN as the 147g FP has trouble feeding with no feed ramp. Loaded to about 950fps with a silencer is just so much fun.

That's why I have the 8 cavity mold!!